Thread: a lot of the illegals have left.

http://www.timesleader.com/mld/thetimes ... 210632.htm










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Posted on Sun, Aug. 06, 2006


Immigration relief act
Change apparent, some say
Some council members say controversial new law has already caused many illegals to move on.

By STEVE MOCARSKY smocarsky@leader.net

“Locally, what I’ve seen and what’s been told to me is that a lot of the illegals have left. …”

Joe Yannuzzi Council president


HAZLETON – - HAZLETON – City council members say they have seen positive and negative effects on the city since their July 13 adoption of Mayor Lou Barletta’s Illegal-Immigration Relief Act ordinance.

“Locally, what I’ve seen and what’s been told to me is that a lot of the illegals have left. You can notice the difference,” said council president Joe Yannuzzi.

Councilman Jack Mundie said, “a lot of illegal people have already moved out of town. I heard one apartment cleared right out.”

Bob Nilles, the only council member to vote against the ordinance, said it “might have had an effect in that many of the illegals may have left, but there are no statistics to back that up.”

Councilwoman Evelyn Graham said she has found “a lot of enthusiasm amongst the people for our stance. I hear it constantly. People I don’t even know stop me to say that they appreciate what we’ve done.”

The ordinance punishes employers and fines landlords who employ or rent to illegal immigrants. It also prohibits city documents and signs in any language other than English.

Latinos upset with ordinance

Council members interviewed acknowledged that tension in the Latino community has erupted since the ordinance was introduced. Latino leaders say the ordinance promotes discrimination. Councilman Tom Gabos could not be reached for comment.

Graham blamed the backlash on Latino leaders’ attitude rather than on the ordinance.

“I believe that the self-appointed spokesmen for the Latino community, namely Dr. Agapito Lopez and Anna Arias, are actually fomenting racism or trying to foment racism. I think most of the legal immigrants understand that what we have done is good for all legal residents of Hazleton,” Graham said.

“I think they’re reading into the ordinance something it’s not meant for. Anybody who reads the ordinance will see it as a very simple document not capable of being misinterpreted,” she said.

Mundie agreed, saying the ordinance has “nothing to do with legal immigrants. But in Hazleton, there are legal and illegal immigrants. Some legal immigrants have friends and relatives who are illegal and they want to help them. I feel bad for them, but they’re breaking the law.”

Mundie said it’s “unfortunate that some legal people may be moving out,” because of the ordinance. “We don’t want that. If you’re legal, you should stay here.”

Nilles agreed that the Latino community’s reaction is “unfortunate. I don’t think anybody ever wanted to give the appearance of being discriminatory in any way, shape or form. The ordinance had nothing to do with Hispanics. It was directed at illegals, whether they’re Russian or Italian or German.”

Hazleton gets attention

Yannuzzi said that on the national level “there’s an awful lot of inquiries. Everybody’s asking for a copy (of the ordinance). This is something the silent majority has been thinking about and not saying it until now, until Lou presented it.

“Hopefully, the state and federal governments will do something. And I think we are causing that to happen now, little Hazleton. If you notice, they’re having their hearings. And I think the federal elected officials are getting the hint that something has to be done,” Yannuzzi said.

Graham said she thinks more municipal leaders are realizing “they cannot afford to wait any longer for the federal government to do something about the problem of illegal immigration.

“I think that the politicians just don’t have the courage to do what needs to be done. And fortunately, we have a mayor who is not first and foremost a political beast.”

Mundie said other municipal leaders are “starting to adopt it and stand up for themselves because the federal government is not doing anything about illegal immigration. The federal legislators are bickering about what should be done.”

Nilles agreed that Hazleton’s ordinance has “certainly had some impact” nationally. But he noted that the U.S. House of Representatives already passed an immigration bill. And while the Senate has not, “I don’t think what Hazleton did will change too many senators’ minds, but you never know.”

Multiple economic impacts

Yannuzzi, Graham and Mundie provided similar reasons for their July 13 vote.

“In Hazleton, our resources are strained because of illegal aliens. The police force had been dealing with crime, some of which was committed by illegal aliens, and obviously we arrested some,” Mundie said.

“But that’s not the sole reason we adopted the ordinance. It’s not just the police, it’s health resources, the schools. Look at the ESL budget. Four or five years ago, it was nothing and now it’s (almost) a million dollars,” Mundie said, citing last Sunday’s Times Leader story about Hazleton Area School District’s English as a second language program.

“It was a little bit of everything,” Yannuzzi said. “It was the type of immigrant we were getting. All of a sudden, it turned into criminals and vicious crimes. The last killing was the straw that broke the camel’s back.”

Yannuzzi was referring to the May 10 shooting death of Derek Kichline. Two illegal immigrants – Joan Romero and Pedro Cabrera – have been charged in the killing. Graham said Barletta proposed the ordinance “because he wanted to have a way to deal with the lawlessness that was burgeoning through the city. And it just seemed to me that he found the right answer.”

Challenges may be ahead

Nilles declined to summarize the reasons for his vote because of possible “legal issues.”

During the July 13 council meeting, Nilles said it’s likely the city would be sued because of the ordinance, adding that he had received legal opinions “that say we’re on dangerous ground.”

He cited several legal issues with the ordinance, and suggested council address them before approving the ordinance, rather than “in a court of law, where it’s going to cost us and you, the taxpayers, money.”

Mundie said the city received “some inquiries from law firms that said they will help us pro bono, and there might be some national firms, too. …I faxed (the ordinance) out to some law firms; they’re looking at it now.”

Yannuzzi said he’s “not really concerned” about the threat of a lawsuit the city received from civil rights lawyers, including those from the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund, the American Civil Liberties Union of Pennsylvania and the Community Justice Project.

“I’ve been that road before. Years ago, there was a disagreement over whether the mayor or council made appointments to authorities. In my opinion, it was council that makes the appointments,” Yannuzzi said.

“It went all the way to the Supreme Court of Pennsylvania, and it was solved that council got to make the appointments, and that settled it for every municipality in the state,” Yannuzzi said.

“It’s the same with this law. We feel we have a good case. And if there is a challenge, we feel we’ll be successful. But sometimes you need the courts to decide it. In this case, it will be pretty hard for them to come up with a good argument.”


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Steve Mocarsky, a Times Leader staff writer, may be reached at 459-2005.





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© 2006 Times Leader and wire service sources. All Rights Reserved.
http://www.timesleader.com

Nilles agreed that the Latino community’s reaction is “unfortunate. I don’t think anybody ever wanted to give the appearance of being discriminatory in any way, shape or form. The ordinance had nothing to do with Hispanics. It was directed at illegals, whether they’re Russian or Italian or German.”

First off, my hat is off to the people of Hazlton and Mayor Barletta. It took allot of guts to do what Hazlton did.

Is it just me, or does the Latino community remind you of a spoiled rotten child?
Everytime they don't get their way, they either scream all the 'ism's' they can, accuse us of being discriminatory, etc. Basically, its the preverbial child throwing a tantrum because America is now saying NO!

I hope the Hazelton ordinance does get its day in court. Can you imagine how much a favorable finding would help our cause. I believe a lot of cities are holding off on inacting similar ordinances because they don't want to deal with the headache of going to court over the issue. Just wait and see, once precedent has been established in the courts, we'll see a lot more cities enacting similar ordinances.

Locally, what I’ve seen and what’s been told to me is that a lot of the illegals have left. You can notice the difference,” said council president Joe Yannuzzi.

Councilman Jack Mundie said, “a lot of illegal people have already moved out of town. I heard one apartment cleared right out.”

I wish they really did LEAVE. Unfortunatly....they just transplanted themselves in another town. Another towns headache now. And they'll notice the difference too.

Sippy, I completely agree with you --

"I want what I want, when I want it"!!!!!

Typical 2 year old behavior!!!

My response to my children when they were that age was to tell them to hold hands out palms up and I'd say:

"Spit in one hand and want in the other, and see which one fills up first"

CW, Have you seen Grumpier Old Men? The scene with Jack Lemmon and Burgess Merydity are shopping in the store, and Burgess says something similar to that. His word sounded like spit, but with a different consenant.
But it holds true. I use that one w/ my kids still. Most of the time it brings them back down to reality.

No I haven't seen it. But based on what you're saying, maybe I should.

Children always want more than they should be allowed to have. It's up to us parents to tell them "no" or "wait".

Too many young parents nowadays, don't seem to want to do that> so, we've created a sense of entitlement in the youngsters.

something similar to that. His word sounded like spit, but with a different consenant.

That's the version my dad used say all the time.

I only have one child but we she was little all of her cousins would come up and spend a week or so in the mountains and I had my hands full.
After breakfast they would be getting ready to go out and play and I would tell them if anybody gets hurt I am going to spank them, that opened their eyes , they had no idea of what it felt like to break their arm but they knew what a spanking was and so were careful not to get hurt.
These kids are all grown now and they still have a lot of respect for me and still talk of the fine memories they have of their time spent with me.

I feel very childlike right now -I want my mayor and aldermen to adopt this ordinance. Even the rumor around town that they are discussing it might help. I am going to post this article on our town site and implore/request/.... people to send it to the mayor. Reading our town site lately is sad, they are resigned that Waukegan is dead already.

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Is There Hope
Starting Member Posted - 08/06/2006 : 13:15:34
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I've been an observer here in Wauktown for a long time. Is there hope for Waukegan? I'm beginning to accept that there is not much hope left here. Waukegan has such potential to be a great city but I think, at least for the forseeable future, the problems here have become insurmountable. Problems mostly brought on by a combination of an incompetent city government (that is almost certain to retain office for the forseeable future) and a huge influx of culturally stubborn non-citizen Mexican peasants. Because of this Waukegan is near the bottom in terms of places most Americans would consider an ideal place to live and/or raise a family. These ideal places to live are judged as such based on their amenities. Maybe there are a lot of amenities here from a peasant Mexicans perspective but there is little here for a 38 year old white American male and his family. Because of these two factors I think there is little hope of improvement in Waukegan . Waukegan is a city with no hope. Learn to accept that.

http://www.waukegan.org/Forum/topic.asp ... hichpage=2
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I posted back that I can't accept this... I am going to go way out on a limb later and post on this site a plea of sorts for anyone to 'donate' 5 to 10 minutes to send some info. to our mayor/aldermen. I'll make it easy with links, a letter, whatever it takes. I fight till I can't fight for my children's future. In return I will continue to answer any request for letters/emails/etc... from other members.