Thread: Barack Obama's citizenship questioned

The Susan Daniels interview (35 min.) on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/v/IZlaIS5o9Vs

Good interview, but...

It's unfortunate that she had to naysay the Jean Paul Ludwig SSN
without considering the possibility that Ludwig had two SSN's himself:
the one that she did find, under the name "Jean Ludwig"
with a Connecticut-issued SSN ending in 8872, and
the other that she didn't find, under the name "Jean Paul Ludwig"
with a Connecticut-issued SSN ending in 4425.
Same date of birth (Feb. 17, 1890) and same date of death (June, 1981) =>
same person, but different SSNs.

It reminds me of Obot "logic": if I didn't find it (evidence of a Kenya birth), then it doesn't exist. "If I didn't find it, then you can't find it either!" Childish pouting. Only in Barryland is the nonexistence of evidence evidence of nonexistence.

Looks like Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer chickened out and vetoed the eligibility bill in Arizona. It may have enough votes to override her veto. She gives a weak excuse for vetoing it.

"As a former Secretary of State, I do not support designating one person as a gatekeeper to the ballot for a candidate, which could lead to arbitrary or politically-motivated decisions," the governor wrote in a letter addressed to the Arizona House speaker.

I hate to break it to her, but this is already how it is done, with two persons as gatekeepers: DNC Chair Rep. Nancy Pelosi and DNC Sec. Alice Travis Germond.

Originally Posted by Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer

"I never imagined being presented with a bill that could require candidates for President of the greatest and most powerful nation on earth to submit their 'early baptismal or circumcision certificates' among other records to the Arizona Secretary of State. This is a bridge too far."

CNN source article

It's only required of people like Obama who don't have original birth certificates ... it's called secondary evidence, similar to what the state department accepts for passport applications.

Chicken-hawks always have an excuse, but they never have a good reason.
Bottom line: Gov. Brewer is afraid to go out on the limb.

Originally Posted by MinutemanCDC_SC

Looks like Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer chickened out and vetoed the eligibility bill in Arizona. It may have enough votes to override her veto. She gives a weak excuse for vetoing it.

"As a former Secretary of State, I do not support designating one person as a gatekeeper to the ballot for a candidate, which could lead to arbitrary or politically-motivated decisions," the governor wrote in a letter addressed to the Arizona House speaker.

I hate to break it to her, but this is already how it is done, with two persons as gatekeepers: DNC Chair Rep. Nancy Pelosi and DNC Sec. Alice Travis Germond.

Originally Posted by Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer

"I never imagined being presented with a bill that could require candidates for President of the greatest and most powerful nation on earth to submit their 'early baptismal or circumcision certificates' among other records to the Arizona Secretary of State. This is a bridge too far."

CNN source article

It's only required of people like Obama who don't have original birth certificates ... it's called secondary evidence, similar to what the state department accepts for passport applications.

Chicken-hawks always have an excuse, but they never have a good reason.
Bottom line: Gov. Brewer is afraid to go out on the limb.

This makes me sad. We get a chance to do something right and political pressures force a defeat.

[quote=HighlanderJuan]

Originally Posted by MinutemanCDC_SC

Looks like Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer chickened out and vetoed the eligibility bill in Arizona. It may have enough votes to override her veto. She gives a weak excuse for vetoing it.

"As a former Secretary of State, I do not support designating one person as a gatekeeper to the ballot for a candidate, which could lead to arbitrary or politically-motivated decisions," the governor wrote in a letter addressed to the Arizona House speaker.

I hate to break it to her, but this is already how it is done, with two persons as gatekeepers: DNC Chair Rep. Nancy Pelosi and DNC Sec. Alice Travis Germond.

Originally Posted by "Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer":mbumoesc

"I never imagined being presented with a bill that could require candidates for President of the greatest and most powerful nation on earth to submit their 'early baptismal or circumcision certificates' among other records to the Arizona Secretary of State. This is a bridge too far."

CNN source article

It's only required of people like Obama who don't have original birth certificates ... it's called secondary evidence, similar to what the state department accepts for passport applications.

Chicken-hawks always have an excuse, but they never have a good reason.
Bottom line: Gov. Brewer is afraid to go out on the limb.

This makes me sad. We get a chance to do something right and political pressures force a defeat.[/quote:mbumoesc]

This is sad but take heart. WE are awake now! Ask yourself, since when do we HONESTLY expect politicians to police politicians?

Originally Posted by florgal

Originally Posted by HighlanderJuan

This should get everyone's blood to boil:

http://africanpress.wordpress.com/2011/ ... an-people/

Indeed

And it said that he has run the White House well? It's interesting to go back to Obama campaign materials and compare them with today's reality. Price of gas - reaching $4 in places. Food inflation. Jobs - anemic. He was supposed to end Bush's wars. We still have them smoldering, and a new one besides. Americans would be welcomed and esteemed overseas? Uh ...

The question of his being a usurper or not are about to become moot. Repeat after me: One. Term. President.

Unless the Repulicans are unable to come up with a presentable candidate, which in the light of recent history seems all too likely.

Originally Posted by At forums.hannity.com, Trip

And like Orly Taitz, you're focused on ... the Birth Certificate issue, just as Obama's own web site has indicated the issue should be about.

Don't knock Dr. Taitz; she has done more to advance the prosecution of the usurper than all of us here put together.

Yes, she is focused on the .jpg image of a purported COLB, which, as we all know, is counterfeit.

She is likewise focused on the Coast Province General Hospital Certificate of Birth.



I independently checked the validity of the three hospital officials who signed it, the Chief Administrator, the Attending Physician, and the Supervisor of Obstetrics, and found the names to be appropriate. I believe it is a valid document on the face of it, which lacks only a valid chain of custody. It deserves to be officially requested, with official custody, from CPGH by an investigation by the U.S. House of Representives, as well as by judges. A U.S. House investigation should similarly request the government-issued long form Certificate of Live Birth from the Bureau of Vital Statistics in Nairobi and the Royal Archives in London. In the court of public opinion, official discovery by itself will force the fraudulent impostor to resign.

Dr. Taitz is also focused on the standard meaning of "natural born Citizen," that is, a citizen born in the country of citizen parents. She brought suit of behalf of Army Maj. Stefan Cook before U.S. District Judge Clay Land at the U.S. Post Office and Courthouse in Columbus, Ga., on July 16, 2009. Afterwards, she explained convincingly to media reporters that Mr. Obama was ineligible both because he was not born in the U.S., and, regardless of where he was born, because his father was not a U.S. citizen.

She also spoke a year ago at an almost-unattended rally at the Deland, Fla., fairgrounds. Once again, she stressed both birthplace and parentage as equal requirements for nbC, explaining that Mr. Obama is ineligible on both counts.

As we well know, it is much easier to communicate to the layman the requirement for native birth (ius soli) than the requirement for both parents (ius sanguinis) to be citizens at the time of the candidate's birth. But within the limitations of her Moldovan accent, she really tries to communicate everything one needs to know. I would prefer that she speak more slowly and not relate so much detail, but that's Orly Taitz.

Both birthplace and parentage are important to eligibility. In this case, both counts are equally disqualifying, and Mr. Obama is equally guilty on both counts. No lawyer takes a solid charge off the table before using it to maximum advantage. Don't give the criminals anything without making them pay full price. Don't give the devil an inch, or he'll take a mile. Just because a law is too technical for a layman to fully comprehend does not mean that the charge should not be brought or that the accused is any less guilty of it.

Any probability and statistics student knows that the odds of conviction on either or both of two charges is greater than on just one of the two charges. The parentage ineligibility charge will stand on its own, even if the Obama Campaign does fabricate a Hawaii birth document that can pass a sympathetic forensic examination.

IMO, there should also be a charge of sedition, for the de facto overthrow of the U.S. Constitution, Art. ii, § 1, ¶ 5, prior to Mr. Obama's inauguration as putative President.

_______ while in office is beyond the scope of this discussion, because it is not relevant to Mr. Obama's Constitutional ineligibility for the Office of President. Nevertheless, there should also be charges of _______, for giving aid and comfort to enemies of the United States and enemies of the U.S. Constitution - communist, globalist, or Is|amist - on occasions too numerous to list. However, those are causes for impeachment, not for removal on account of ineligibility.

Supreme Court Justices Admit Obama Eligibility Is a Problem

Posted on April 20, 2011
by Eowyn
7 Comments

First, we have Justice Clarence Thomas in a House Appropriations Subcommittee hearing last April admitting that the Supreme Court was evading the many lawsuits that have been brought to the Court on Obama’s birth eligibility to be President of the United States [beginning at the 1:00 mark]:

Video: Supreme Court Justice Thomas; We're evading the eligibility issue - 4/16/10 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... u6OiTiua08

Now, Justice Stephen Breyer in a House Appropriations hearing on the 2012 Supreme Court budget, admits that:

â–* The Constitution specifies that only a “natural born citizenâ€

[quote="AirborneSapper7"][size=117]Now, Justice Stephen Breyer in a House Appropriations hearing on the 2012 Supreme Court budget, admits that:

â–* The Constitution specifies that only a “natural born citizenâ€

I came across several renewed posts (courtesy of Trump's involvement in politics) regarding obama and his birth location, including the following. I should note that I am not convinced that Politifact is an unbiased source for commentary, and so I have linked in the actual Sarah telephone audio clip and the bishop's letter.

=========================

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... other-cau/


Says President Obama's "grandmother in Kenya said he was born in Kenya and she was there and witnessed the birth."

Donald Trump on Thursday,
April 7th, 2011 in a "Today Show" interview
Donald Trump Says President Obama's grandmother caught on tape saying she witnessed his birth in Kenya

It's early, but Donald Trump is emerging as a significant player in the Republican race for president. The latest NBC News/Wall Street Journal survey found that among people planning to vote in the Republican primary, Trump placed second, tied with Mike Huckabee and behind Mitt Romney.

On MSNBC's Morning Joe on April 7, 2011, former Pennsylvania Gov. Ed Rendell warned, however, that Trump's economic commentary is being "trivialized" by his association with the so-called birthers, people who doubt that President Barack Obama is a natural-born citizen of the United States, and is therefore ineligible to serve as president, because he has not provided a copy of his original birth certificate.

"Get off the birther stuff," Rendell said.

Trump, who is considering a run for president, said in a telephone interview on the program that he would not back off the issue, and that over the last few weeks he has only become more skeptical that Obama was born in the U.S. (His campaign released a Certification of Live Birth, which Hawaii officials say is an official birth certificate and sufficient to prove he was born in Honolulu. Trump and others have said that is not sufficient and that they still have doubts. We've gone over this ground repeatedly at PolitiFact.)

Trump also defended his position, saying, "His grandmother in Kenya said, 'Oh no, he was born in Kenya and I was there and I witnessed the birth.' Now, she's on tape and I think that tape's going to be produced fairly soon ...The grandmother in Kenya is on record saying he was born in Kenya."

Trump made an identical claim in a Today Show interview the same morning: "His grandmother in Kenya said he was born in Kenya and she was there and witnessed the birth, okay?"

This is actually an old claim that has been bouncing around the Internet for years. But keeping up with the latest birther claims is often like playing Whac-A-Mole, and we never got around to this one. So here we go.

The claim is based on an Oct. 16, 2008, telephone call between Bishop Ron McRae of the Anabaptist Churches of North America and Sarah Obama of Kenya, Barack Obama's elderly step-grandmother. The interview is complicated by the addition of at least one translator, because Sarah Obama, then 86, spoke Swahili.

The edited portion that often makes the rounds on the Internet includes this part of the interview:

McRae: "Could I ask her about his actual birthplace? I would like to see his birthplace when I come to visit Kenya in December. Was she present when he was born in Kenya?"

"She says yes she was. She was present when Obama was born," said the translator.

Smoking gun? Only if you stop the tape there and don't listen to the rest of the interview.

McRae immediately followed up by saying, "Okay, when I come in December, I would like to go by the place, the hospital where he was born. Could you tell me where he was born? Was he born in Mombasa?"

The translator can be heard translating, and then, he said, "No. Obama was not born in Mombasa. He was born in America."

Said McRae: "Whereabouts was he born? I thought he was born in Kenya."

The response came back, "He was born in America, not in Mombasa."

"Do you know where he was born?" McRae continued. "I thought he was born in Kenya. I was gonna go by and see where he was born."

"Hawaii. She says he was born in Hawaii," the translator said. "In the state of Hawaii, where his father, his father was also learning there. The state of Hawaii."

"I thought she said she was present," McRae said. "Was she able to see him being born in Hawaii?''

"No, no," the translator said. "...She was not ... she was here in Kenya. Obama was born in America ... Because the grandmother was back in Kenya and Obama was born in America, where he is from, where his father was learning, learning in America, the United States."

Listen to the full conversation yourself. The parts in question begin about the 4:20 mark. http://s16v.com/americasright/8167169.wma

McRae -- who we should emphasize was not the translator -- has kept the theory alive. In a Dec. 5, 2008 article, Salon ran an affidavit from McRae in which he maintains Sarah Obama confirmed she witnessed Obama's birth in Kenya:

"Though some few younger relatives, including Mr. Ogombe (one of the translators), have obviously been versed to counter such facts with the common purported information from the American news media that Obama was born in Hawaii, Ms. Sarah Hussein Obama was very adamant that her grandson, Senator Barack Hussein Obama, was born in Kenya, and that she was present and witnessed his birth in Kenya, not the United States. When Mr. Ogombe attempted to counter Sarah Obama's clear responses to the question, verifying the birth of Senator Obama in Kenya, I asked Mr. Ogombe, how she could be present at Barack Obama's birth if the Senator was born in Hawaii, but Ogombe would not answer the question, instead he repeatedly tried to insert that, "No, No, No. He was born in the United States!"

That's not what we heard on the tape. What we heard was a very rough translation in which an elderly woman agreed to the leading question that Obama was born in Kenya and that she was present. But it was immediately and clearly corrected -- repeatedly.

When we contacted Trump’s organization, Michael Cohen, his political aide, referred us to Jerome R. Corsi, author of The Obama Nation: Leftist Politics and the Cult of Personality, which makes a case against Obama, calling him a political extremist who associates with radicals and has disturbing connections to Islam. (PolitiFact found the book was riddled with errors). In a brief telephone interview with PolitiFact, Corsi said he has spoken to Trump and that the statement about Obama's grandmother was, in fact, based on her taped conversation with McRae. Corsi pointed us toward an article he wrote for the conservative WorldNetDaily, in which he says that he spoke to two unnamed Kenyans familiar with Sarah Obama's dialect, and that they claimed she was clear in saying that she witnessed Obama's birth in Kenya. Futhermore, Corsi said they told him it appeared her later efforts to recant appeared to be heavily coached by those around her. Corsi has a book questioning Obama's birthplace coming out next month.

We note that in a Chicago Tribune story in March 2007, national correspondent Tim Jones wrote that in an interview with Sarah Obama, she said she received the news of Obama's birth via a letter to her in Kenya and that she was "was so happy to have a grandchild in the U.S."

Trump is serving up re-heated leftovers that have long ago been debunked. Anyone who listens to the tape of the phone conversation with Sarah Obama can hear how tightly you need to edit this interview to present it as evidence of a presidential cover-up. We rule Trump's claim that Obama's grandmother in Kenya said he was born in Kenya False.

Addendum: While researching this story, we sent an e-mail seeking comment from Bishop Ron McRae, who conducted the trans-Atlantic interview with Sarah Obama. We received this letter from McRae after our story published.

=========================

This is an audio recording of the Bishop McRae interview of obama's grandmother:

http://s16v.com/americasright/8167169.wma

=========================

http://www.politifact.com/letter-from-bishop-ron-mcrae/

Letter from Bishop Ron McRae (date unknown)

Mr. Farley,

I have read a multitude of pro and con articles concerning the taped interview of Sarah, which most of both views, fail in a truly factual desire to discover anything beyond authors’ of those articles pre-conceived notions and beliefs about Obama’s birth prior to listening to the tape. The taped interview is only a small fraction of evidence, and honestly should only be used as perhaps an introductory to a much deeper issue than just Sarah’s initial response, or the exasperated attempts of her other grandson, who was the second translator to correct the verbal response of Sarah.

People want to ignore the fact, that there were two translators present on that phone interview. One was a step grandson of Sarah, and the other was our National Evangelist Kweli Shuhubia. His sworn affidavit has been submitted to the United States Supreme Court as well as my own. The question that I asked Sarah, was repeated to her twice, and both times she adamantly answered very proudly that yes she was present in Mombassa, Kenya when Barack Obama was born. Upon Sarah’s two admissions to having been present when Barach Obama was born in Kenya, her step grandson realizes the seriousness of his grandmother’s response and immediately begins to respond to the contrary, while moving his hand towards his grandmother’s mouth to silence her from saying anything further, while he tries to answer my pointed questions himself and correct what his grandmother has revealed. You see Mr. Farley, we have witnesses that were present during that conversation, including police officers and soldiers. All of my subsequent questions concerning Obama’s birth were not translated to Sarah, but the step grandson insisted on replying immediately to me himself in English, while continuing to move his hand towards Sarah’s mouth motioning her to be quite.

The only portion of the conversation and questioning that Sarah was allowed to respond to me about was the initial question if she was present when Barack Obama was born in Kenya. To that question she clearly responded twice, that Barack Obama was born in Mombassa, Kenya and that she was present when he was born. Mr. Farley, Sarah Obama is not a liar, and she is not ignorant or stupid. The most important aspect of her life and history as a mother and a grandmother is not just that her grandson is president of the United States, but that she was present when he was born. That is a culturally significant aspect of Kenyan life, that the grandmother be present to witness the actual birth of her grandchildren. She is not going to lie about that for anyone, including her famous grandson. For the grandmother to be a witness to the birth of her grandchildren is more important to African life, that the presence of the physician.

I have copies of Barack Obama’s Kenyan birth certificate. He was 7 pounds and 1 ounce, 18 inches long, and was 6 inches across his shoulders. The certificate is easily enough proven true or false, if Barack Obama wants to clear the record. His Kenyan birth certificate contains his feet print for his right foot. Now, lets just put everything to rest, and verify his foot print with the Kenyan record. Let Mr. Obama come forward and allow an independent expert in finger/foot printing technology take his foot prints before a panel of witnesses and examine the evidence from the Kenyan birth records. If there is not a match, I will personally lead the effort in telling everyone to shut about it, and let him be president.

Concerning my view of Barack Obama, he has performed as good as any of his predecessors in shouldering the blame for everything that is wrong in America. Concerning anything in his past as a muslim or a sinner, is of no concern to me, and I am not interested in his moral failures as a young man. As far as him being a Christian, he is not one. He is openly a better muslim than he is a Christian, and I would expound upon those testaments if you would like. Concerning my stand upon his presidency, I have no stand, for I do not consider him president, would not give any allegiance to him or demonstrate any regard for him or any document he signs, until he is man enough to step forward and prove his grandmother a liar. The Kenyan people are a grand people, but it is the most treacherous, and damnable lie that one can tell that makes his own grandmother out to be an ignorant native at best, or a liar at worst. To refuse the truth about one’s place of birth, is the lowest of moral character known to man, in any country.

Mr. Farley, I am a Christian and a preacher. I do not involve myself into politics, and could care less about the corruption or lack of it that promotes any citizen to the office of President of these United States. It is of no concern of mine that Congress, the Supreme Court or this entire nation ignores the Constitutional requirement to be a natural born citizen in order to be President. But I cannot tolerate a liar and a fraud, especially one so low as to dishonor his grandmother, or his father in denying the truth about his actual place of birth. That is the only issue this preacher has involved himself with in regards to Barack Obama. Until he steps forward and acknowledges his grandmother, and tells the truth, this preacher will continue to do what is not him to do or tell, “for you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you freeâ€

If it be true that the attitude,

"If I can't have it, nobody else can either!"

is a primary characteristic of a malignant narcissist,
then someone needs to be planning an exit strategy
from the Obama usurpation, lest things get ugly.