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Thread: Deduction Limits Pose Test for Donald Trump’s Tax Plan

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  1. #11
    MW
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    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" ** Edmund Burke**

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  2. #12
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    Thanks for the clarification on the home purchases.


    As for illegals not getting it, until they are all deported and the government's attitude toward them changes, they will get it one way or another. While my fervent hope is the illegals will be gone, I am going to settle for some being gone, and the attitude of our government and laws changed. We also have tons of immigrants, those on visas, foreign workers. How long before the government - next administration decides they deserve a prebate. No prebates would keep that from happening - at least until the government decides to tweak the system.

    It just seems like a string the government doesn't need to have.

    There will be some exemptions. Why not put exemptions for food, medical expenses into the equation at the start and not have a rebate that people have to make application for. Again, that necessitates a bureaucracy that just doesn't seem needed. I'm not sure it is a good idea to have people asking for and receiving checks each month from the government. When that is not at all necessary, let's ask ourselves why they think it is a good idea.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    I'm sure there will be a lot of different suggestions considered when the bill comes up for debate, and amendments offered. But the reason they call it a FairTax is their goal was to make it fair, egalitarian. Someone might eat a lot of expensive food but live in a smaller apartment so if food is exempt, the person who eats less and spends less on food, but spends more on rent for a nice place gets cheated on their essential.

    Same with pharmaceutical and medical expenses, some people take all kinds of drugs and spend a lot on them while other people don't, so if pharmaceuticals are exempt for example, the person who doesn't use a lot of drugs but pays more for a house with a big yard and has a big garden, gets cheated.

    The fixed amount of the Rebate allows people to spend as they choose on their essentials without being cheated, the same philosophy as behind the personal exemption on the income tax. if people don't want the Rebate, I have no problem with that, but exemptions aren't necessary at that point, what's required then is to lower the rate, but that does turn it back to a "regressive tax", hurting the poor and lower incomes unfairly on their essentials, which makes it more difficult to pass in Congress. With the Rebate, it's fair to those groups while still being fair to everyone else who receives the same Rebate offset if they want to sign up for it, same as they do every year for the personal deduction on their income tax return.

    So however they work that part out will be fine with me.
    Last edited by Judy; 12-01-2016 at 08:02 PM.
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    http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...nap-story.html

    Jul 14, 2016 - A shortage of new housing has helped push up prices in Southern California... The median home price in Orange County in May was $651,500, ...

    $651,500.00 x 23% Fair tax = $149,845.00

    Total cost now $801,345.00
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  5. #15
    MW
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    Judy wrote (excerpt):

    I'm sure there will be a lot of different suggestions considered when the bill comes up for debate, and amendments offered.
    Geez, it's been in committee for 16-17 years. It's a plan that will never reach the floor for a vote ....... for good reason I might add.

    http://www.fairtaxfraud.com/fallout.asp

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  6. #16
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Then don't worry about it.
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  7. #17
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDoe2 View Post
    http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...nap-story.html

    Jul 14, 2016 - A shortage of new housing has helped push up prices in Southern California... The median home price in Orange County in May was $651,500, ...

    $651,500.00 x 23% Fair tax = $149,845.00

    Total cost now $801,345.00
    That isn't how it works. You don't take a market price and then add on 23%. You take the 23% OUT OF the market price.

    You sell a new home for $651,500, you send 23% to the state leaving you with $501,655.
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  8. #18
    Senior Member JohnDoe2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    That isn't how it works. You don't take a market price and then add on 23%. You take the 23% OUT OF the market price.

    You sell a new home for $651,500, you send 23% to the state leaving you with $501,655.
    When a developer wants to sell a new house for $651,500 to get the profit he wants on the sale he must add the tax on to the sales price or lose money on the house.
    If he sends 23% of the money to the government he has to get the money from the buyer.
    If the house cost the builder $600,00 to build and he sends 23% of the $651,500 to the government he loses money on each house.
    NO AMNESTY

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  9. #19
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDoe2 View Post
    When a developer wants to sell a new house for $651,500 to get the profit he wants on the sale he must add the tax on to the sales price or lose money on the house.
    If he sends 23% of the money to the government he has to get the money from the buyer.
    If the house cost the builder $600,00 to build and he sends 23% of the $651,500 to the government he loses money on each house.
    No he doesn't, John. Right now when a developer builds a house, there are embedded federal income taxes in the price. His income tax on the sale, the roofer's income tax on the roof, the lumberyard's income tax on the wood framing, the bricklayer's income tax on the brick facades, the concrete company's income tax on the floors and driveways and patios and sidewalks, the concrete contractors income tax who actually pours and lays it, the dry wall company's income tax, the cabinetmaker's income tax on the kitchen cabinets, the electricians income taxes on the wiring, the plumbers income taxes on the plumbing lines and fixtures, the appliances income taxes, the lot seller's income and capital gains taxes, etc., etc., etc., etc. All of those embedded income taxes that are in all the prices of all of our products and services are repealed by the FairTax legislation and replaced with a single FairTax at the final point of sale. In most cases, he'll actually make more profit because all those income based taxes including payroll taxes that are no longer accumulating in the supply, building and development chain add up to more than 23%.

    The FairTax is an inclusive tax, meaning that it's in the price you pay, not added on to it at the point of sale, it's deducted from it and sent to the state once a month. It's the same as the way income taxes are paid. Income taxes aren't added to your salary or wage on pay day, they're in the salary and wage already and then deducted from it.
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  10. #20
    Senior Member JohnDoe2's Avatar
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    YOU are a builder.

    You are ready to sell the new houses you just built.

    You add up your cost of the land, grading, streets, sewer line, water lines, gas lines and electric line to each house in the project and the cost of building materials and labor to build them.

    YOU have spent an average of $600,000 per house. (That money is GONE. You already paid everyone.)

    You want a profit of $50,000 per house.

    The government wants 23% tax. ($149,500)

    You have to sell each house for $799,500 to pay all of your bills and taxes and make a profit.

    If you sell the houses for $650,000 and send 23% to the government you will lose money.
    Last edited by JohnDoe2; 12-02-2016 at 12:05 AM.
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