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  1. #1

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    WHAT IS THE REAL INTENT OF THE REAL ID ?

    What Is The REAL Intent Of The REAL ID ?

    In a post I made last night, I said the "Intent of the REAL ID was good ". I wanted to give them the benefit of the doubt. However, that comment caused me to reconsider what I said. So, I decided to compile some issues, that in my opinion, needed closer scrutiny. It was, and still is, my opinion, the intent of the REAL ID is not good. It's meant to ENSNARE the American people.

    The author's of the REAL ID added insult to injury, by cleverly devising a way to make us pay for the destruction of our own civil liberties.

    The REAL ID will create a huge new Federal Bureaucracy.

    The REAL ID includes the requirement that states ALLOW the federal government to link together their data bases.

    The REAL ID will federalize, and standardize driver's licenses for all 50 states resulting in a de facto national ID CARD.

    The REAL ID will not protect your identity.

    There are no safe guards to keep your private information safe.

    The actual intent of the REAL ID is to establish a tracking device.

    The REAL ID will force us to carry one card with sensitive personal information. The extent, and inclusion, of that information, is left to the discretion of DHS.

    "What all this means is that we are facing a situation where U.S. And Canadian drivers’ licenses, which Americans need to drive to work, go to a tavern, and generally navigate day-to-day life, will contain sensitive personal biometric information, interlinked and readable by the governments of Canada and Mexico. And depending on the standards decided upon by Homeland Secretary Michael Chertoff, our drivers’ licenses could contain more information than the documents Mexicans use to cross into the U.S. Legally; never mind those who cross our insecure southern border without permission".
    http://www.citizensforaconstitutionalre ... 19-07.html

    I've included two sections of the SAVE ACT that, I think, directly interlock with the REAL ID, in that, there will be no turning back, if these two bills become law.

    If enacted, the SAVE ACT will create the establishment of an "Electronic Birth And Death Registration System"
    S. 2366 SEC 203
    http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c ... 4KZ:e62354:


    If enacted, the SAVE ACT AKA "The Basic Pilot Program" will be PERMANENT !
    S.2366 Sec 201
    http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c ... 4KZ:e62354:

    Quote " All LEGITIMATE CONSENT REQUIRES THE ABILITY TO WITHOLD CONSENT"

    Why was it necessary to add the word "PERMANENT" ?

    Could it be, that in the future, there will be dissenters, when people realize what has happened to them ? We can run, but there will be nowhere to hide.


    Quote Tom DeWeese, President of American Policy Making :
    "As I have stated before, we have no problem with attempts to strengthen efforts to enforce immigration laws. But these should include building the wall; deploying troops if necessary; supporting border control; detaining illegals for court appearances; denying services like schools,hospitals and welfare to illegals; denying citizenship to the new born of illegals; denying college tuition discounts to illegals; and prosecuting sanctuary cities."

    http://www.newswithviews.com/DeWeese/tom105.htm

    Here is a link I found very informative, and helpful while trying to sort out all the information regarding the REAL ID.

    Analysis Of The Department Of Homeland Security;
    http://epic.org/privacy/id-cards/epic_realid_0508.pdf

    My intent in writing this is to address, what I think, are some of the most important issues or points of contention contained within the REAL ID. I've included links for the information or quotes, that also reflect what I've said when choosing to use my own words.
    IT'S NOT HOW YOU GET IN, IT'S HOW YOU GET OUT

  2. #2
    Senior Member magyart's Avatar
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    In my humble opinion, if you are relying on information from Tom DeWeese, President of American Policy Making, you are NOT getting fair and balanced information. He has been waging a propaganda campaign against the SAVE Act for some time now.

    I tried to look at the information provided by your links, but they failed to work.

    In regard to the SAVE Act, it's already WORKING at the state level. It's being implemented in AZ and OK. Soon, SC will join they. Illegals are self deporting from those states. If it works on the state level, it will work nationally.

    The federal govet ALREADY has ALL the information about YOU, it needs. The SAVE Act doesn't require additional information. It does force employers to actually VERIFY an employees social security number. This is a NEW law. Presently, no federal law requires any employer to actually verify the legal status of an employee.

    I believe the SAVE Act will make us safer, by reducing the number of illegal aliens that can easily secure any type of employment.

  3. #3
    Administrator ALIPAC's Avatar
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    If you research the ID issue closely, you can see that Real ID is not designed to prevent illegal aliens from getting licenses. Here in NC, they setup the Real ID technology a few years back and continued giving Real IDs to illegal aliens.

    New Haven is giving them a form of Real ID and the Real ID was what Gov Spitzer wanted to give the illegals in NY.

    W
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  4. #4
    MW
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    Why couldn't you have posted this information on one of the several other threads you and JP have recently started on this issue? Why continue to beat a dead horse (repeat the same information over and over).

    These two links wouldn't open for me:

    http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c ... 4KZ:e62354:


    http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c ... 4KZ:e62354:

    The following articles have recently been posted on ALIPAC (and discussed):

    http://www.citizensforaconstitutionalre ... 19-07.html

    http://www.newswithviews.com/DeWeese/tom105.htm

    William wrote:

    New Haven is giving them a form of Real ID and the Real ID was what Gov Spitzer wanted to give the illegals in NY.
    New Haven, CT. is not giving illegal aliens Real ID. It is my understanding that the card New Haven is issuing to illegals is only good for city services. It's not a Real ID, nor does it have anything to do with Real ID (it's not a form of Real ID).

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" ** Edmund Burke**

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  5. #5

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    These two links wouldn't open for me:
    They worked for me today. This is far from a dead issue.
    IT'S NOT HOW YOU GET IN, IT'S HOW YOU GET OUT

  6. #6

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    If you research the ID issue closely, you can see that Real ID is not designed to prevent illegal aliens from getting licenses.
    Yes, I saw that. It also is not designed to protect your identity. I really don't like having a federalized DMV IE an interlinked data base. My state has asked for an extention. My hope is that enough states will refuse to comply, and hopefully, render this law unenforceable.
    IT'S NOT HOW YOU GET IN, IT'S HOW YOU GET OUT

  7. #7
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    The question of whether a National ID is good or bad is really a question of who is the predator and who is the prey. In the case of illegal immigration clearly those of us who want to rid the nation of illegals are the predators. So it is easy to support such means to rid us of this threat. Some of us may even take pride in being able to "show our papers" to prove "we are American citizens." It's pretty compelling - until the same system is used to make us the prey.

    That is my fear, and that is why I oppose any excuse to create even a small piece of a National ID databank system. Like you, I certainly have political enemies. Someday I will certainly be the prey.
    http://www.newswithviews.com/DeWeese/tom105.htm

  8. #8
    MW
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    William wrote:

    If you research the ID issue closely, you can see that Real ID is not designed to prevent illegal aliens from getting licenses. Here in NC, they setup the Real ID technology a few years back and continued giving Real IDs to illegal aliens.
    I was told by a NC DMV employee that Real ID would not go into effect until July 1, 2008. I know NC has been issuing cards with the North American Hologram (yuk) but cards issued prior to the July 1st date are not in full compliance with the requirements of Real ID. Here's what will be required, effective July 1st in NC:

    - Iinformation and security features must be incorporated into each card.
    - Proof of identity and U.S. citizenship or legal status of an applicant.
    - Verification of the source documents provided by an applicant.

    Also, specific security standards are required for the offices that issue licenses and identification cards.

    Currently all that is required for a license renewal in NC is a current driver's license and proof of insurance (changes July 1st).

    States in compliance with Real ID can issue driving permits to illegals if they want. However, those permits cannot be used to board commercial aircraft or enter government buildings (they won't meet requirments of Real ID). Issuing the permits has nothing to do with Real ID - it's a state issue that the federal government has nothing to do with, nor do they encourage it.

    Real ID will not be issued to illegal aliens.

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" ** Edmund Burke**

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  9. #9
    Senior Member jp_48504's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ALIPAC
    If you research the ID issue closely, you can see that Real ID is not designed to prevent illegal aliens from getting licenses. Here in NC, they setup the Real ID technology a few years back and continued giving Real IDs to illegal aliens.

    W
    Exactly
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  10. #10
    Senior Member SOSADFORUS's Avatar
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    Give the real ID to people they need to track that they let into this country from all around the world who over stay their visa, etc. don't track me like an animal.


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