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Joined: Nov 17, 2006 Posts: 4517 Location: California
Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 2:30 pm Post subject: Mexican Constitution, Immigration Laws Vs. U.S. Constitut
Mexican Constitution, Immigration Laws Vs. U.S. Constitution
By John W. Slagle (ret) Special Agent, Anti-Smuggling Unit USBP, Arizona
MichNews.com
Aug 30, 2007
Special Interest Groups consider U.S. Immigration laws racist, inhumane and unjust. A possible answer to the problem would be abolishing all U.S. Immigration Statutes and adopting "word for word” Mexico's standards and law per their government constitution. How could any group in the United States including LULAC or ACLU be offended? DHS Secretary Chertoff appears to hate the idea of enforcing U.S. laws on the books because it would separate families. Amnesty, guest worker classifications for twenty million plus illegal aliens from all nations was not a proposition voters wanted.
Enforcing the laws for the first time in decades stateside may actually be the answer.
Contrary to popular belief, Mexico has very strict immigration laws which are enforced by every police agency in the country. The Bureau of Immigration can call upon any law enforcement officer to assist in their mission. Citizens from the United States traveling in Mexico without proper documents are subject to arrest as illegal aliens. The Mexican government has been very outspoken, critical on U.S. Immigration law enforcement efforts and supports Amnesty for all illegal aliens residing, working in this nation. It seems President Bush as well as most in the U.S. Congress and Senate are on the same page. If our Constitution, Bill of Rights, Immigration Codes are of no importance, our laws too strict, there should be comprehensive reform direct from the 1917 Constitution of Mexico.
The laws regarding foreign national visitors, immigrants, non-citizens are as clear and concise as U.S. laws which are considered unenforceable by many politicians.
Our Immigration codes are similar in context to Mexico’s but without political will to enforce the law, establish border security, interior enforcement, the INS was “broken” by design, intervention and agendas through many administrations.
Mexico welcomes only foreigners who will be useful to Mexican society:
Foreigners are admitted into Mexico "according to their possibilities of contributing to national progress." (Article 32)
Immigration officials must "ensure" that "immigrants will be useful elements for the country and that they have the necessary funds for their sustenance" and for their dependents. (Article 34)
Foreigners may be barred from the country if their presence upsets "the equilibrium of the national demographics," when foreigners are deemed detrimental to "economic or national interests," when they do not behave like good citizens in their own country, when they have broken Mexican laws, and when "they are not found to be physically or mentally healthy." (Article 37)
The Secretary of Governance may "suspend or prohibit the admission of foreigners when he determines it to be in the national interest." (Article 3
Mexican authorities must keep track of every single person in the country:
Federal, local and municipal police must cooperate with federal immigration authorities upon request, i.e., to assist in the arrests of illegal immigrants. (Article 73)
A National Population Registry keeps track of "every single individual who comprises the population of the country," and verifies each individual's identity. (Articles 85 and 86)
A national Catalog of Foreigners tracks foreign tourists and immigrants (Article 87), and assigns each individual with a unique tracking number (Article 91).
Foreigners with fake papers, or who enter the country under false pretenses, may be imprisoned:
Foreigners with fake immigration papers may be fined or imprisoned. (Article 116)
Foreigners who sign government documents "with a signature that is false or different from that which he normally uses" are subject to fine and imprisonment. (Article 116)
Foreigners who fail to obey the rules will be fined, deported, and/or imprisoned as felons:
Foreigners who fail to obey a deportation order are to be punished. (Article 117)
Foreigners who are deported from Mexico and attempt to re-enter the country without authorization can be imprisoned for up to 10 years. (Article 118)
Foreigners who violate the terms of their visa may be sentenced to up to six years in prison (Articles 119, 120 and 121). Foreigners who misrepresent the terms of their visa while in Mexico -- such as working with out a permit -- can also be imprisoned.
Under Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony. The General Law on Population says,
"A penalty of up to two years in prison and a fine of three hundred to five thousand pesos will be imposed on the foreigner who enters the country illegally." (Article 123)
Foreigners with legal immigration problems may be deported from Mexico instead of being imprisoned. (Article 125)
Foreigners who "attempt contempt against national sovereignty or security" will be deported. (Article 126)
Mexicans who help illegal aliens enter the country are themselves considered criminals under the law:
A Mexican who marries a foreigner with the sole objective of helping the foreigner live in the country is subject to up to five years in prison. (Article 127)
Shipping and airline companies that bring undocumented foreigners into Mexico will be fined. (Article 132) *1917 Mexican Constitution… ref. Center for Security Policy
Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:49 pm Post subject: send this to ANY and EVERYBODY
everyone needs to pick up on this and forward it to anyone and everyone around the WWW (world wide web) as many time as it takes to get this curculating. This is our victory!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! how can anyone argue with this. lets push to get our immigration laws to match theirs. HECK, i like thier law better!
I skimmed through that article.....What ever the merits of it, I noticed that they ended it by saying the article on Mexican immigration will be "spun by racist and xenophobic agendas." Interesting editorializing.....Seems that author has a bit of an agenda with his rhetoric.
I haven't nit-picked the Mexican constitution for the validity of these arguments, and I don't care to.....Because I know how it is enforced in mexico. Its enforced with the point of a gun. Through beatings, theft, rape, and murder of Central Americans. So Mexico City needs to STFU about how we handle immigration.
Joined: Feb 28, 2007 Posts: 2586 Location: San Diego, CA
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:12 pm Post subject:
I wasn't attesting to the validity of either article. Other than pointing out the agenda driven rhetoric of the author of the article you linked to, I don't know which one is correct. I haven't perused the Mexican Constitution to fact check either one. My point is that whatever is written in their constitution is irrelevant when Mexico City gives tacit approval to murder, assalt, robbery, and rape by looking the other way when their soldiers and police do it ( as pointed out in the video). That is worse than the charges of the original article.
You said if we oppose illegal immigration, not to link to discredited info.....So I thought you might enjoy a look into what these scum bags in Mexico City are allowing to happen to Central Americans. Just adding some source info on the discussion of Mexico's hypocrisy regarding immigration policy.
IF you read the article it will be immediately clear. But you refuse or are intentionally playing dumb.
"Other than pointing out the agenda driven rhetoric of the author of the article you linked to,"
Well, if you read that far, you'd know that the original article is fake, as it is painfully obvious and proved so with every line.
Also, I don't think you read the mind of the author. If you haven't read the article, then how can you be sure it is "an agenda" and not an inferred statement.
If you saw a piece of crap article that's clearly and blatantly fabricated, I think it'd be safe to say the author was motivated to spin.
Joined: Feb 28, 2007 Posts: 2586 Location: San Diego, CA
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:29 pm Post subject:
eaglescout wrote:
IF you read the article it will be immediately clear. But you refuse or are intentionally playing dumb.
"Other than pointing out the agenda driven rhetoric of the author of the article you linked to,"
Well, if you read that far, you'd know that the original article is fake, as it is painfully obvious and proved so with every line.
Also, I don't think you read the mind of the author. If you haven't read the article, then how can you be sure it is "an agenda" and not an inferred statement.
If you saw a piece of crap article that's clearly and blatantly fabricated, I think it'd be safe to say the author was motivated to spin.
Don't be a cultural retard like Tancredo.
Thank you so much for proving my point. Ad hominem seems to be the strategy of you open borders types. You, like the author of the article you linked to, are tarring everyone who opposes illegal immigration as a "retard," a "xenophobe," or a "racist."
Hell, it is so obvious from your side when one says, 'used for xenophobic and racist agendas" who they are trying to discredit.
Joined: Feb 28, 2007 Posts: 2586 Location: San Diego, CA
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:39 pm Post subject:
From the article:
Too bad this article has made it half-way across the United States, and will be quoted to support xenophobic and racist agendas.
UPDATE: The fabricated article has made it’s way to about seven different “conservative” websites. Some offenders include: ALIPAC, Newsvine, The Federal Observer, MichNews, Shankradio, John Lillpop (who generally writes false propaganda), and of course, the fictitious writer: John W. Slagle.
So, was he or was he not labeling ALIPAC with a racist and xenophobic agenda? Even if correct, this guy should spend more time worrying about the actual criminal hypocrisy of the Mexican government, than worrying about any false allegations against them.
Too bad this article has made it half-way across the United States, and will be quoted to support xenophobic and racist agendas.
What's your point, exactly? Is that a bad inference somehow? Seems fairly logical to me. The article is fake, and who is going to use it? People with xenophobic and racist agendas. If you are not one of them, then don't worry about it.
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So, was he or was he not labeling ALIPAC with a racist and xenophobic agenda?
It's not clear from the article, so I'd say 'no'. The offense is publishing fabricated material.
Quote:
Even if correct, this guy should spend more time worrying about the actual criminal hypocrisy of the Mexican government, than worrying about any false allegations against them.
Joined: Feb 28, 2007 Posts: 2586 Location: San Diego, CA
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:52 pm Post subject:
eaglescout wrote:
Sorry, but that's an argument by association fallacy. I didn't actually insult you, unless you think Tancredo is a retard and you are one, too.
Um, you called Tancredo a "retard." "Don't be a cultural retard like Tancredo." Where is the fallacy again???
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Is that right? Where in the thread do I call you a xenophobe or a racist?
You called Tancredo a retard......I obviously agree with Tancredo's views -- this being ALIPAC and all......Also, I doubt you missed my avatar
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If you deserve to be discredited because your article is a fabrication, then what's the problem?
The problem is that even if discredited, the author throws the racist and xenophobe card out to anyone who quotes it -- see my last post. Unless the article is explicitly racist, then there is nothing racist about quoting it -- just a mistake......If I quoted an article saying the sky is not blue, does that discredit me as a racist, simply because I am discredited in general???
Joined: Nov 17, 2006 Posts: 4517 Location: California
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:55 pm Post subject:
eaglescout you can beat this argument into the ground. I saw the article, I posted the article, and now I have emailed MichNews asking them to address the article. With that said; neither BearFlagRepublic nor I are experts on the Mexican Constitution. I have no desire to be; and neither do any of us here need to be. The fact is that we are AMERICANS and we live under the AMERICAN Constitution. American sovereignty is what we care about. The point of the argument is that ALL of us here are completely against illegal immigration. Now instead of arguing about the Mexican Constitution why don't you do something about how MEXICO runs its country so MEXICO'S citizens can have a better life at home?
Joined: Feb 28, 2007 Posts: 2586 Location: San Diego, CA
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:58 pm Post subject:
[quote="eaglescout"]
Quote:
What's your point, exactly? Is that a bad inference somehow? Seems fairly logical to me. The article is fake, and who is going to use it? People with xenophobic and racist agendas. If you are not one of them, then don't worry about it.
Geez, its so obvious......Did you read my post?? He says it will be circulated by racist and xenophobic groups.....then UPDATE: and lists the organizations that it is being circulated on, and lists....ALIPAC. Why is this hard to understand the authors inference?
Quote:
It's not clear from the article, so I'd say 'no'. The offense is publishing fabricated material.
Then he makes the logical leap that quoting incorrect info is racist -- see my sky is blue analogy.......
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Why is that?
It would be a better use of his time......Actual criminal negligence of the mexican government is far more important than what is or is not written in their constitution.
Joined: Nov 17, 2006 Posts: 4517 Location: California
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:08 pm Post subject:
Let's see:
Article 32 of Mexican Constitution as of 2002 states:
Mexicans will be preferred to foreigners in equality of circumstances, for all classes of concessions and all employment, duties, or commissions of government for which the quality of citizenship is not indispensable.
Joined: Nov 17, 2006 Posts: 4517 Location: California
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:17 pm Post subject:
OOOH OOOH! I love this part! Can we have this President Bush? Nah, we can't trust the Executive of the Union here to do it but DHS can!
Article 33 - Foreigners are those who do not possess the qualities determined in Article 30. They have the right to the guarantees of Chapter I of the first title of this Constitution, but the Executive of the Union has the exclusive right to expel from the national territory, immediately and without necessity of judicial proceedings, all foreigners whose stay it judges inconvenient. Foreigners may not, in any manner, involve themselves in the political affairs of the country.
Um, you called Tancredo a "retard." "Don't be a cultural retard like Tancredo." Where is the fallacy again???
You said "Ad hominem seems to be the strategy of you open borders types." you are implying I am an open border type by association. That's a logical fallacy.
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You called Tancredo a retard......I obviously agree with Tancredo's views -- this being ALIPAC and all......Also, I doubt you missed my avatar Rolling Eyes
Correction: I told you not to be a cultural retard like he is.
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The problem is that even if discredited, the author throws the racist and xenophobe card out to anyone who quotes it
No, it doesn't specifically say all. It says it will be used by those people. It doesn't say it will ONLY be used by those people.
Quote:
Unless the article is explicitly racist, then there is nothing racist about quoting it
Geez, its so obvious......Did you read my post?? He says it will be circulated by racist and xenophobic groups.....then UPDATE: and lists the organizations that it is being circulated on, and lists....ALIPAC. Why is this hard to understand the authors inference?
You are engaging in wishful thinking and mind reading. Did you ever consider the statements were not related?
Then he makes the logical leap that quoting incorrect info is racist -- see my sky is blue analogy.......
Your analogy didn't make any logical sense.
Quoting incorrect info is not racist. You are reading stuff that's not there.
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It would be a better use of his time......Actual criminal negligence of the mexican government is far more important than what is or is not written in their constitution.
Smearing an entire country is pretty bad, too. Besides, there are similar horror stories about the United States. Maybe you should focus on that, or start calling yourself a hypocrite.
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