Thread: Counter report by Marquis on Economic Warfare :K Freedman

Let's dive right in ...

Here's the link to the main report

http://www.scribd.com/doc/49755779/Econ ... -D-Freeman

Page 3

The second phase appears to have begun in 2008 with a series of bear raids targeting U.S. financial services firms that appeared to be systemically significant.
An initial bear raid against Bear Stearns was successful in forcing the firm to near bankruptcy. It was acquired by JP Morgan Chase and the systemic risk was averted briefly. Similar bear raids were conducted against various other firms during the summer, each ending in an acquisition. The attacks continued until the outright failure of Lehman Brothers in mid-September. This created a system-wide crisis, caused the collapse of the credit markets, and nearly collapsed the global financial system.

Wikkipedia says about bear sterns

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bear_Stearns

As investor losses mounted in those markets in 2006 and 2007, the company actually increased its exposure, especially the mortgage-backed assets that were central to the sub prime mortgage crisis .

A September 21 report in the New York Times noted that Bear Stearns posted a 61 percent drop in net profits due to their hedge fund losses


Here’s the link to the new york times article explaining how it’s not surprising that Bear sterns stock took a huge tumble downward ….

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/17/busin ... .html?_r=1



As for Lehman Brothers , I just finished a book called a colossal failure of common sense the inside story of the collapse of Lehman brothers .. I don’t care for the author as a person (greedy ,arrogant wall street fat cat ) but the book does depict what seemed to be happening as I understood it looking in from the outside , so if anyone want’s to know why Lehman brothers went down , it’s a definite must read …

From wikkipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehman_Brothers

A March 2010 report by the court-appointed examiner indicated that Lehman executives regularly used cosmetic accounting gimmicks at the end of each quarter to make its finances appear less shaky than they really were


In 2008, Lehman faced an unprecedented loss to the continuing sub prime mortgage crisis Lehman's loss was a result of having held on to large positions in sub prime and other lower-rated mortgage tranches when securing the underlying mortgages; whether Lehman did this because it was simply unable to sell the lower-rated bonds, or made a conscious decision to hold them, is unclear. In any event, huge losses accrued in lower-rated mortgage-backed securities throughout 2008. In the second fiscal quarter, Lehman reported losses of $2.8 billion and was forced to sell off $6 billion in assets.[44] In the first half of 2008 alone, Lehman stock lost 73% of its value as the credit market continued to tighten


The reason the stock dropped so dramatically is because the company was failing …

According to the book I read about Lehman , one of the main reasons their stock dropped so quickly is because of a man named David Einhorn who publicly announced that he had no faith in them and was actively shorting them .


http://nymag.com/news/businessfinance/47844/index4.html


Page 15

Outside forces at work
There is sufficient justification to question whether outside forces triggered ,capitalized upon, or magnified the economic difficulties of 2008. This paper examines possible sources and impacts of those outside forces. All other things being equal, the economy and markets may have suffered a normal downturn, but it would likely have been more of the magnitude of a serious recession coupled with a bear market as have been endured multiple times over the past 70 years. The near collapse of the global economic system with a corresponding depression that would have dwarfed the 1930s, however, seems excessive to the expected economic weakness. Yet, there we stood in September 2008.

Here the author goes all SCARY again … ohhhh … he says that we should have endured a normal downturn ala serious recession instead of almost outright depression … to this all I have to say to the author is DUDE , DID YOU JUST READ WHAT YOU YOURSELF WROTE LEADING UP TO THIS PARGAPGAH ? Freaking A ! wall street JUST got taken out ( because of their own debt levels , greed etc which you admitted ) and the nations two largest and most powerful mortgage providers got taken down as well … maybe the author lives out in the remote woods somewhere , and he DOESN’T understand how vital the construction , new home industry is to the united states economy .. But YAH , I’d think losing the entire housing market in this country and getting the financial sector wiped out at the same time would lead to a depression … YA THINK ?



Over the next few pages the author goes on to talk about the run up of oil and possible reasons for that …

I can agree with the possibility that oil producing nations might have attempted to run up the price in order to MAKE MORE MONEY , not to hurt our country .. After all if OPEC and the other countries in the region wanted to devastate our economy , all that they would have to do is stop selling to us … BAM , game over …

The author doesn’t address the other issues of peak oil which may have contributed to the run up in oil prices ( because oil is a finite resource and once it’s gone it’s gone )

PAGE 27 or 26

False rumors and naked short selling continued in Lehman stock until the bank finally failed in mid-September. By then, the amount of failed-to-deliver trades was more than 1,600 times greater than the amount just three months earlier.
The stock had fallen to near zero. As with Bear, Lehman collapsed despite having sufficient capital to meet all requirements until just before the end. The constant rumors, combined with
the stock decline hampered the firm‘s ability to raise capital or conduct business. Without
the rumors, Lehman would likely have been in a position to continuing operating or at least find a business partner and retain some level of shareholder value. This, in turn would have likely prevented the need for the TARP bailout and avoided much of the market and economic dislocation that took place.

WRONG WRONG WRONG ….

Lehman brothers had been manipulating their earnings and playing ledger keeping games well before the end .. ( book says as much ) .. Sure they had money on hand , but they DIDN’T and possibly couldn’t have enough money to cover their LOANS (should really call them bets ) which were going bad … obviously I can have 1000 dollars in my bank account today , but if I’m going to have a debt against my account in two months for a million dollars , then there’s a serious problem .. Solvent today , insolvent tomorrow .. Same with Lehman brothers ….

The real questions are WHO began the attacks, HOW were they accomplished, and WHY? These questions are addressed in this report.


I can answer that one for you , anyone who wanted to make money shorting those companies , and anyone who had stock in them … so folks understand this , if you want to short a company , or you have stock in a failing company and you go to pull it out before they collapse , this author views you as a terrorist and or traitor …

I stopped reading it … the author is caught up in the failure of Lehman brothers and bear sterns , it’s like he just can’t accept that they would fail , I wonder if he had stock in either of them ?

Want to know why they failed ? It’s not because of middle eastern terrorists , it’s because of greed , pure all consuming greed …The only thing the traders at those two companies cared about was their year end bonuses , that big fat pay day …

I think the guy who wrote this report needs to see THIS …


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksSPZTZES0

But where is your evidence that nation states hostile to the US did not use financial tools to exploit the major weakness in America which is greed and greedy people?

I believe this report within the pentagon makes it clear there were problems here in the US.

The point of the report is claiming there is evidence of an additive component being used against America as a form of economic warfare designed to escalate these existing problems.

Why is it so hard for you to believe that our enemies would exploit weaknesses? Isn't that what enemies like China and Saudi Arabia do?

Or do you contest that China and Saudi Arabia are our enemies and that they lack the expertise and will to conduct these kinds of attacks on us?

I think you have a point that Americans should not displace all blame for these problems on foreign powers, but I feel you are overreaching by trying to claim that foreign powers are not conducting an economic attack on the US using traitors inside the US that are helping our enemies for personal political and financial gain.

W

william , if i took gasoline and lit my home on fire , burnt it down , and then someone walks up with a lit cigar and throws it into the ruble , who burnt down the house ?

There is not a doubt in my mind that at some point , some country or rich group of individuals attempted some sort of economic shorting in order to cause our nation harm .. but the reality is 90 % of what occured was due to our own desgin ...

The governments of china and saudia arbia would not intend to cause us harm because to the rulers of those respective nations, the seconday effects would be obvious and devistating ...

i read in the wall street journal yesterday or the day before that china has even MORE us treasuies than was suspected , something like a trillion dollars and two hunreds billion ...

The primary goal of china is to maintain ORDER ... the united states helps china to maintain order by giving all of those restless little citizens a nice factory to slave away at for 15 hours a day , 6 days a week ..

as for saudia arbia , why would they seek to destory our economy , we're the largest auto driving nation on earth , and we consume more oil than everyone .. without our money for their oil , the royal palaces will go dark , not to mention that the oil checks wich every citizen of saudia arabia gets ( think of it like the casion checks that native americans get ) would stop coming .

Originally Posted by marquis

Let's dive right in ...

Wikipedia says about bear sterns,

As investor losses mounted in those markets in 2006 and 2007, the company actually increased its exposure, especially the mortgage-backed assets that were central to the sub prime mortgage crisis .


From wikipedia

A March 2010 report by the court-appointed examiner indicated that Lehman executives regularly used cosmetic accounting gimmicks at the end of each quarter to make its finances appear less shaky than they really were

Want to know why they failed ? It’s because of greed , pure all consuming greed.

That and government agencies abetting lending to unqualified borrowers. No outside interference needed.