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  1. #1
    Senior Member zeezil's Avatar
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    Real facts on REAL ID

    Real facts on REAL ID

    THE WASHINGTON TIMES EDITORIAL

    To listen to the paranoid debate now taking place over the REAL ID Act in Congress, some state legislatures and the blogosphere, one might think that this legislation was some Bush administration plot to create a national identity card and spy on innocent Americans. The reality is much more serious and mundane. In the wake of the Oklahoma City bombings and the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, there is a need to set some kind of minimum standards to ensure that driver’s licenses and other forms of government-issued identification cannot be tampered with and used by terrorists.

    Timothy McVeigh used a fraudulent South Dakota driver’s license to rent the Ryder truck in Oklahoma that was used to bomb the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City in 1995, killing 168 persons. The Sept. 11 hijackers fraudulently acquired 17 driver’s licenses from Florida, California and Arizona, including four duplicates. They also obtained 13 state-issued IDs from Maryland, Virginia and Florida. The IDs were used to open bank accounts, find housing, rent cars and board aircraft on Sept. 11. Ziad Jarrah, the hijacker who piloted the plane that crashed in Shanksville, Pa., and Hani Hanjour, who crashed his plane into the Pentagon, had both obtained Virginia IDs by fraud. Three Salvadoran immigrants living in Virginia (one a legal permanent resident of the United States and the other two illegal aliens) helped four of the Sept. 11 hijackers use fraudulent identification in order to obtain Virginia-issued identification cards.

    The Sept. 11 commission recommended that the federal government “set standards for the issuance of birth certifications and sources of identification, such as driver’s licenses.â€
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  2. #2
    Senior Member jp_48504's Avatar
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    So if a terorists wants to do their dirty deeds, they will need a Drivers' Licence? Oh and of course no DMV worker would ever hand out a fake DL. If the Feds wanted to stop illegals from getting a DL, they would enforce our immigration laws and secure our borders. They would also be a bit more stringent about who they allow into our country.

    The Washing Times says that this is not a National ID card, yet all the information is shared with all 50 states, the feds, other countries and private corporations. The DMV even calls it a "National Identification System."

    Check this bouble sepak out from the NC DMV Web Site

    Nuts and Bolts of the REAL ID Act

    The REAL ID Act mandates that each state issues driver's licenses only to people who can prove either U.S. citizenship or legal alien status using up to four pieces of identification. This includes a certified birth certificate, Social Security card, or passport. Furthermore, each state must digitize the verified ID documents and keep them on file for seven to 10 years, along with digital photos of the license holders. States must keep personal information in a national database that motor vehicle departments across the country could access.

    All American drivers would have to renew their licenses by 2013, and those without the new license would need to show a passport or other federally approved ID in order to travel by airplane or enter a federal building.
    NOW FOR THE DOUBLESPEAK
    Many mistake the REAL ID for a national ID card―which it isn’t. In fact, these licenses are not even issued by the federal government. While many states already keep on file the information about all their drivers that is required by the proposed REAL ID regulations, the federal government is not requiring the states to share the license holder info it doesn’t already have.

    http://www.dmv.org/news-alerts/real-id.php#tz_NC
    So our information must be stored in a national database but its not a National ID card? What else would you call it?
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    Boy, they really like to put a spin on things ! I don't like the REAL ID. It seems to me like "big brother" getting the low down on every single one of us. I have visions of the gestapo pounding on my door in the dead of night, and confiscating all my weapons etc. Am I wrong ? I heard Lou Dobbs talking about it, and I think he's FOR it ? OK, I confuse easily, but I'm really sitting on the fence with this one.
    IT'S NOT HOW YOU GET IN, IT'S HOW YOU GET OUT

  4. #4
    Senior Member jp_48504's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicie
    Boy, they really like to put a spin on things ! I don't like the REAL ID. It seems to me like "big brother" getting the low down on every single one of us. I have visions of the gestapo pounding on my door in the dead of night, and confiscating all my weapons etc. Am I wrong ? I heard Lou Dobbs talking about it, and I think he's FOR it ? OK, I confuse easily, but I'm really sitting on the fence with this one.
    I dont know. Makes me wonder why MTV is putting out videos like this.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTOuq4pY10o

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiCZgvUE ... re=related

    As far as weapons confiscations go, just look what happened in New Orleans after Katrina.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4

    ABC World News
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sm5PC7z7 ... re=related


    Computer system overloads, DMV shuts down statewide
    Submitted by WWAY on 7 January 2008 - 6:58pm.READ MORE: News | New Hanover County News | Transportation

    » e-mail this story | discuss | print

    WILMINGTON -- There was a massive statewide shut-down at the Department of Motor Vehicles today. The DMV stopped issuing driver licenses and ID cards because of an overloaded computer system.

    The DMV can be a frustrating place. Add a bogged-down system and that makes for plenty of unhappy customers.

    Employees at the Market Street DMV say from the very first customer Monday morning, the computer system just wasn't working properly.

    After a call to Raleigh they heard about the national system being down.

    By halting issuances in North Carolina, the DMV hopes to help the national system recover. In the meantime, people needing to get or renew licenses and ID cards just need to wait.

    Rebecca King was trying to renew her license. She said, "It's just aggravating that I pretty much rearranged my entire day like I said, to come out here and get my license renewed. It's irritating but there's nothing really much I can do about it now."

    Homer Tuazon was also renewing his license. He said, "It's a little frustrating because I tired to get off early from work today and come to find out there's nothing I can do for now."

    There's no word yet on when the system will be up and running again.

    If you need to go to the DMV, call ahead to ask if the system is working.

    http://www.wwaytv3.com/computer_system_ ... de/01/2008
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  5. #5
    MW
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    Thanks for the article, Zeezil. It's a welcome change to see something other than hyperbole from bloggers and groups like La Raza (illegal immigrant advocates) on the REAL ID Act.

    Timothy McVeigh used a fraudulent South Dakota driver’s license to rent the Ryder truck in Oklahoma that was used to bomb the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City in 1995, killing 168 persons. The Sept. 11 hijackers fraudulently acquired 17 driver’s licenses from Florida, California and Arizona, including four duplicates. They also obtained 13 state-issued IDs from Maryland, Virginia and Florida. The IDs were used to open bank accounts, find housing, rent cars and board aircraft on Sept. 11.
    We can't hide from the facts. If someone has a better idea to stop rogue governments (state legislatures) from issuing driver's licenses to illegal aliens and potential terrorist, I'm all ears. Until a better mouse trap comes along, I'll support the REAL ID Act. I realize REAL ID is not perfect, however, it's a step in the right direction. I firmly believe we need everyone playing from the same rule book where the requirements for driver's licenses are concerned. Terrorism and illegal immigration are national problems that will require national solutions. Just my opinion.

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" ** Edmund Burke**

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  6. #6
    Senior Member jp_48504's Avatar
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    A Real ID is not an id system that can be trusted or supported unless you are for shredding the US Constitution. I don't support LaRaza or Illegal Immigration and I dont appreciate being grouped in with them. I take that as a personal attack and an insult.



    Watch the Videos MW.
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  7. #7

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    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    " A Real ID is not an id system that can be trusted or supported unless you are for shredding the US Constitution. I don't support LaRaza or Illegal Immigration and I dont appreciate being grouped in with them. I take that as a personal attack and an insult. "

    My sentiments exactly !
    IT'S NOT HOW YOU GET IN, IT'S HOW YOU GET OUT

  8. #8
    MW
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    JP wrote:

    I don't support LaRaza or Illegal Immigration and I dont appreciate being grouped in with them. I take that as a personal attack and an insult.
    I didn't group you with them! Notice I said illegal immigrant advocates. I know you're not an "illegal immigrant advocate." My exact words:

    It's a welcome change to see something other than hyperbole from bloggers and groups like La Raza (illegal immigrant advocates)
    I apologize for any misunderstanding my words may have caused.

    Watch the Videos MW.
    I'm not really interested in the opinion of MTV. However, I did watch the videos. Actually, the videos helped to make my point (more hyperbole).

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" ** Edmund Burke**

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  9. #9
    Senior Member zeezil's Avatar
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    OK, everyone kiss and make up
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  10. #10
    MW
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    Zeezil wrote:

    OK, everyone kiss and make up


    Shucks, I'm not mad at anyone, and I did apologize for any misunderstanding my posts may have caused.

    The great thing about ALIPAC is the fact that we all agree on a lot more than we disagree on.

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