Thread: Obama is right, we have lost 3.6 million jobs, but ---

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tell us Mr. Obama, how many of those lost jobs were federal political plum jobs with an excessive salary and a top of the shelf medical plan which poor wage earners living Harlem, South Philly, Newark, N.J., etc. finance with a tax upon their earned wages?

Seems to me Mr. Obama, your FEDERAL EMPLOYEES ARE DOING JUST FINE:

Are you considering a government job? The federal government employs over 2,700,000 workers and hires hundreds of thousands each year to replace civil service workers that transfer to other federal government jobs, retire, or leave for other reasons. Average annual salary for full-time federal government jobs exceeds $67,000. The U.S. Government is the largest employer in the United States, hiring about 2.0 percent of the nation's work force. Federal government jobs can be found in every state and large metropolitan area, including overseas in over 200 countries. The average annual federal workers compensation, pay plus benefits, is $106,871 compared to just $53,288 for the private sector according to the United States Bureau of Economic Analysis

And how many of those blessed with these political plum jobs, Mr. Obama, have helped to regulated our businesses and industries into stagnation and have chased most of our nation’s manufacturing base to other countries which respect a nation’s manufacturing base?


Now, Mr. Obama, let me do this in crayon for you.


We all know people are losing their jobs, especially in retail sales. And they are loosing their jobs because wage earners, after federal wage withholding takes place and shrinks their take home pay, they can barely meet their necessities of life and have little or no money left to buy a few extra things which in turn hurts our nation’s retail sales! Did you see that Obama? Wage earners cannot afford to buy a few extra things each week because the federal government confiscates their earned wages, which is then used to fund the outrageous salaries and benefits of your federal work force!

How about suspending the tax on earned wages, particularly on wage earners living in Harlem, South Philly, Newark N.J., in other words, end the wage tax on working people who earn $67, 000 or less, which is less than the average salary for a federal government worker? Ending the wage tax on these people would allow them to buy a few extra things each week, which in turn would help retail sales and would instantly create four to five million retail jobs. The federal revenue lost could be made up by a tax on specifically chosen articles of luxury, e.g. on those very expensive SUVs many government employees are privileged to enjoy.

Unlike your borrow-and-spend government plan, Obama, which is a plan destined to lead to hyper inflation in a couple of years and would put our nation's children into a slavish debt situation with its outrageous borrowing, allowing wage earners to keep their paychecks would put existing money into the hands of working people rather then into the hands of folks in government and there would be no need to borrow, nor would there be a threat of inflation.

Come now Obama, you can level with me. Isn’t the object of your plan to keep your federal political plum job holders happy and wage earners poor by taxing their subsistence so you may then bribe them with their own money during election time? I’m sure you must have learned this when studying the birth of our Constitution: A POWER OVER A MAN's SUBSISTENCE AMOUNTS TO A POWER OVER HIS WILL ____ Hamilton, No. 79 Federalist Papers


JWK


[i]Black working people who support Obama are absolutely correct when they say, as a general statement, [b]“its all about the Benjaminsâ€

We can fund this cut in taxes by actually forcing elected officials to pay taxes like the rest of us pay. All perks and bribes from lobbyists will be taxed at the highest rate. Oh and that cushy pension? It is gone, If SS is good enough for us, it is good enough for them, they can collect when they turn 67 like the rest of us. I am not heartless, I understand that there are additional expenses having to reside in Washington and at home, so we will take some of the public works money and build barracks for our elected officials. We will even give them officers barracks with only two to a room and a chow hall downstairs for their meals. There will be no professional chefs, we will allow the 5 branches of the military to rotate lending a few cooks to see that they get the same breakfast, lunch and dinner that the real public servants get, you know, the ones laying their very lives on the line.

We need the FairTax and we need it now.

www.fairtax.org

Originally Posted by Judy

We need the FairTax and we need it now.

www.fairtax.org

Judy,

I do not want to turn this into a discussion about the alleged fair tax, but what we really need is to return to our Constitution's original tax plan and that can be accomplished by adding the following words to our Constitution:

The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money

The alleged "fair tax", by its very legislative language, would in fact extend Congress’s taxing power to reach a new subject matter, the people’s property, real and personal, and tighten the iron fist of government with a whole new tax code to enforce the alleged fair tax.


JWK

Originally Posted by johnwk

Originally Posted by Judy

We need the FairTax and we need it now.

www.fairtax.org

Judy,

I do not want to turn this into a discussion about the alleged fair tax, but what we really need is to return to our Constitution's original tax plan and that can be accomplished by adding the following words to our Constitution:

The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money

The alleged "fair tax", by its very legislative language, would in fact extend Congress’s taxing power to reach a new subject matter, the people’s property, real and personal, and tighten the iron fist of government with a whole new tax code to enforce the alleged fair tax.


JWK

No, by its very language it repeals all taxes from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, and inheritances presently on the books and through sister legislation calls for the repeal of the 16th Amendment in its entirety.

It taxes only sales transactions of new products and services and has nothing whatsoever to do with property, real or personal, and tightens not the iron first of government, it returns power to the people, who now control the purse strings of the federal government and any state government that chooses to follow suit and enact State FairTaxes.

It by its language repeals 77,000 pages of existing mandated tax code, shut downs the IRS 12 months after passage, requires destruction of all IRS records, prohibits any future funding for such an agency .. and replaces it with 10 simple pages of law about a tax that is collected by the states who then forward the monies to the US Treasury Department.

www.fairtax.org

For a family of 4 that earns $50,000 a year, the FairTax is worth over $16,000 a year in new expendable income.

Here's the calculation:

Average Household Income is $48,000 a year. I’m going to use $50,000 to make the calculations easier.

A family of four that earns $50,000 in wages pays 7.65% in social security tax and approximately 15% in federal income tax. This amounts to $3,825 in social security savings and assuming adjusted gross income of $40,000 another $6,000 in federal income tax. This family no longer pays the $3,825 in social security taxes or the $6,000 in federal income tax, so they take home $9,825 a year more in expendable income under the FairTax. In addition, they will receive the Rebate if they want it in the amount of $6,440 per year. The combined new expendable income for this family of 4 is $9,825 + $6,440 or $16,265 a year. Add in the savings on filing tax returns of $175 a year and this family is now enriched by $16,440 a year by the FairTax. That’s over $16,000 more on an estimated previous take home of $40,000 (after tax) or a 40% increase in the typical family’s net expendable income.

The same applies to our businesses and industry but of course at the much higher corporate rates. Individuals and businesses go home with all their money. Businesses pay no tax at all as it should be. Individuals pay tax after essentials, which are tax-free with the monthly Rebate, after which US citizens control our economy and for the first time since 1913, our corporations will care what we think and what we want instead of their PayPals in the US Congress.

When you have your money, you have the power. When you have your money and the freedom to spend and pay taxes or hold back and spend less and when you do, pay less tax, then you control the US government for the first time since 1913 with our businesses and corporations watching our back because for the first time since 1913, American business and American citizens are on the same team with the same goal: sustainability and prosperity.

www.fairtax.org

Originally Posted by Judy

No, by its very language it repeals all taxes from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, and inheritances presently on the books and through sister legislation calls for the repeal of the 16th Amendment in its entirety

Judy,

I’m not interested in your talking points. The alleged fair tax repeals nothing. Only a constitutional amendment can repeal Congress’s powers. But tell me, why would you not support the following words being added to our Constitution instead of the alleged fair tax?

The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money

Adding these words to our Constitution would accomplish what the architects of the alleged fair tax claim they want to accomplish. PERIOD.


JWK

Originally Posted by johnwk

Originally Posted by Judy

No, by its very language it repeals all taxes from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, and inheritances presently on the books and through sister legislation calls for the repeal of the 16th Amendment in its entirety

Judy,

I’m not interested in your talking points. The alleged fair tax repeals nothing. Only a constitutional amendment can repeal Congress’s powers. But tell me, why would you not support the following words being added to our Constitution instead of the alleged fair tax?

The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money

Adding these words to our Constitution would accomplish what the architects of the alleged fair tax claim they want to accomplish. PERIOD.


JWK

I do support repealing the 16th Amendment and have no objection to the additional language you propose, except for the "any other lawfully realized money" nor would any proponent of the FairTax. The proponents of the FairTax have worked for over a decade to eliminate income tax permanently and forever. They've spent millions of hours and millions of dollars in this effort. But the FairTax is a tax on sales of new products and services, and is a tax on lawfully realized money because it's a sales tax on the money exchanged for these products and services, so I could not agree with that part of your language.

The proponents of the FairTax have to have an alternative tax in the form of a law in place BEFORE the 16th Amendment is repealed. Otherwise, you have no tax to replace the revenue.

What do you want to tax?!! People? Property?

The FairTax legislation repeals 77,000 pages of existing Internal Revenue Code that taxes income, wages, salaries, earnings, profits, inheritances, interest, dividends, gifts and gains and replaces these taxes with 10 pages of law that taxes retail sales of new products and services purchased for non-business purposes 1 time at the final point of sale at 1 rate.

I'm not really interested in your talking points either. It's a view I've seen before. But I'll ask you the same question I asked them, why would you oppose the FairTax when it repeals all the federal mandatory taxes you seem to object to and replaces them with a national retail sales tax on the voluntary purchases of new products and services which gives businesses all their earnings and individuals all their income free from federally mandated taxation and uses the voluntary purchases of new goods and services purchased for non-business purposes to fund our government? It makes no sense to me for anyone to oppose such a massive improvement because they want to repeal the 16th Amendment before having another tax in place to replace the revenue. The only thing better is no federal tax at all but that would mean no federal government and I don't support dissolving our union. Sorry!

The FairTax is very similar to what was established by our founding fathers who used tariffs, which were taxes on products and services, to fund our government.

But of course, you're free to your opinion that for 10 years has maintained the status quo, resulted in another decade of manipulation of our people by a mandated tax code that determines who becomes President and who doesn't, who becomes a Congress Critter and who doesn't, that's robbed our people of their livelihoods and assets, and contributed more than it's fair share to the economic collapse of the United States.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Unite ... ral_budget

An interesting fact about taxes and government spending is this:

US taxpayers pay $1.2 Trillion in all individual federal incomes taxes, not counting Social Security and MediCare taxes, while our government spends $580 Billion a year in 4 programs, MediCaid, SCHIP, unemployment and welfare, or 47% of all our tax receipts collected from individuals.

That's during the "good times".

During the bad times we're in now, the $580 Billion is going to soar and the $1.2 Trillion is going to drop like a rock. As the $1.25 drops, so do all the other taxes paid by corporations who have declining revenues due to declining sales due to declining expendable income from consumers and earners.

So who pays these individual income taxes? Through 2006, here's who:

http://www.ntu.org/main/page.php?PageID=6

60% of these taxes are paid by the top 5% of earners with adjusted gross incomes of $153,000 a year which is after all their deductions.

86% of these taxes are paid by the top 25% of earners with adjusted gross incomes of $64,000 a year which is after all their deductions.

So 86% of $1.2 Trillion in total federal individual income taxes is $1 Trillion and paid by the top 25% of earners while the remaining 14% of these taxes are paid by the lower 75% of individual earners, yet the lower 75% of earners are the group that uses the $580 Billion in MediCaid, SCHIP, unemployment and welfare.

The existing tax code is self-destructive and by design has manipulated and devoured our nation into national bankruptcy.

That's one of the reasons why I support the FairTax.

www.fairtax.org

Originally Posted by Judy

Originally Posted by johnwk

Originally Posted by Judy

No, by its very language it repeals all taxes from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, and inheritances presently on the books and through sister legislation calls for the repeal of the 16th Amendment in its entirety

Judy,

I’m not interested in your talking points. The alleged fair tax repeals nothing. Only a constitutional amendment can repeal Congress’s powers. But tell me, why would you not support the following words being added to our Constitution instead of the alleged fair tax?

The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money

Adding these words to our Constitution would accomplish what the architects of the alleged fair tax claim they want to accomplish. PERIOD.


JWK

I do support repealing the 16th Amendment and have no objection to the additional language you propose, except for the "any other lawfully realized money" nor would any proponent of the FairTax.

Exactly! They want Congress to still have power to lay and collect taxes calculated from profits, gains, and other forms of income. The alleged fair tax is another socialist idea to expand Congress’s taxing power to reach the people’s property, real and personal, while keeping alive Congress’s power to calculate taxes from profits, gains and other “incomesâ€

Originally Posted by cayla99

We can fund this cut in taxes by actually forcing elected officials to pay taxes like the rest of us pay. All perks and bribes from lobbyists will be taxed at the highest rate. Oh and that cushy pension? It is gone, If SS is good enough for us, it is good enough for them, they can collect when they turn 67 like the rest of us. I am not heartless, I understand that there are additional expenses having to reside in Washington and at home, so we will take some of the public works money and build barracks for our elected officials. We will even give them officers barracks with only two to a room and a chow hall downstairs for their meals. There will be no professional chefs, we will allow the 5 branches of the military to rotate lending a few cooks to see that they get the same breakfast, lunch and dinner that the real public servants get, you know, the ones laying their very lives on the line.

Great post Cayla! I love it!


Regards,

JWK


The servant has become the master over those who created a servant and the new servant pays tribute by taxation to a gangster government which ignores our most basic laws…our constitutions, state and federal.