Thread: *** GUTIERREZ/FLAKE AMNESTY is Unveiled!!!!!

Hey all.

After a cursory overview of just a few of the general provisions of the bill (HR1645 'FlakeG') - note - I have not read the bill yet, only certain parts of it I've jotted down a handful of questions. I'm just trying to spur some thought as everyone here has his/her own unique perspective on these issues and collectively we're more likely to catch errors/problems than any one of us. Maybe you all can add some new ones, thoughts on the ones here, etc. etc.

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Re: Background/Security Checks...

Selective service registration requirement - automatically voids a large proportion of prospective male applicants.

Are the background checks going to be done with universal and mandatory fingerprint checks? (all other forms rely to some degree on self-reported information relating to identity, history, family, etc). The fingerprint is the one true invariable biometric measure which can be compared against existing US law-enforcement databases to check for past criminal behavior.

What happens if an illegal has a criminal history and does not apply under the program for legal residency?

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Re: Arrival Date: 1 June 2006...

How are we to know for sure those that 'arrived' on June 1, from those that 'arrived' on June 2. If you were an illegal that had come later, wouldn't you also find a way to say that you arrived earlier as well? Do you think other illegals might do exactly that?

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Re: Re-enter the US legally...

For how long will they be required to exit the country? How will USCIS/USCPB monitor this/these movements? What happens if illegals simply don't comply with the exit requirement?

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Re: Payment of back taxes:

Will we allow exceptions for people that claim they cannot pay this amount? Considering that many illegals which come into the US via Mexico use professional 'coyotes' (smugglers) and frequently pay in excess of the $2000 amount, should we allow ANY exceptions to this 'fee/fine'?

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Other misc. questions:

How many people will ultimately apply for, and receive legal permission to remain in the country? Is there an upper limit?

How will USCIS find and remove those that DO NOT apply for residency under the program?

How will USCIS deal with 10 million+ residency applications when they already have a backlog of up to 1 million with processing times ranging from 3-12 months typically? What happens when USCIS isn't able to maintain such a workload?

How will the Federal government attempt to rectify past identify theft and document fraud perpetrated against US citizens in terms of using legal citizens' SSNs, etc.? How will these past costly criminal acts be adjudicated in favor of the US citizens who have been harmed, financially, professionally, etc? Which remedies are available?

How will we know that people are interested in becoming Americans - not just coming here to find a job - something that can be done in 100+ countries throughout the world?

Most Importantly: Mr./Ms Congressperson - Have you actually read the entire bill?
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Originally Posted by TexasCowgirl

Originally Posted by gofer

Originally Posted by 2ndamendsis

** take a look at the Co-sponsors names.

I must be very tired but it just hit me that most of them are hispanic names. Doesn't this seem very STRANGE???

I don't think I can pull into my memory, any other major piece of legislation that is sponsored by mostly one ethnicity...........

That's the FIRST thing that hit me! It's obvious what's in store for this country. It's like an inside takeover.

Notice also that they are primarily from TX., AZ, CA., FL., CO., IL., NY., NJ. I assume mostly democrats??!

My rep Ciro Rodriguez has his name on and he is a proud member of LULAC, so no surprises here. I will contact him next week but I am sure it will be useless since he is probably leading the southwest reconquista.

TC & EVERYONE
please think about this carefully.

NO CALL IS USELESS and the reason why is that when these horrible Non-Representative-Reps HEAR from the American people, they realize that we are onto their sneaky game!

These greedy, power hungry Reps & Senators all speak & plan their dirty deeds together. What they will be speaking about behind closed doors is the massive number of Americans that KNOW the TRUTH. The amazing number of Americans that are capable of READING & COMPREHENDING their garbage!

NO Call is useless!!! NO Post is useless!!!

And please, think about calling as many House Reps as you possibly can.
You are an AMERICAN and they are playing with our CONSTITUTION!!
Don't let them intimidate you...........that's all they have left in their bag of tricks.

Originally Posted by loservillelabor

The security of the US is all "subject to appropriations." Just words. We've seen how our "fence" is going, and then there's the pulling of funds for our troops going on right now.

It's pretty clear to see that this same logic is what produced the failed policy of 1986 (IRCA) by allowing the enforcement/legal provisions to be enacted 'as funds are available', at the same time, allowing for immediate residency for millions of illegal persons. Bingo - most of the enforcement stuff never happened, but most illegals were allowed to stay... and where are we now???
It's DejaVu all over again!

On the Geography of Sponsors of HR1645:

St|# of co-sponsors from state

(Border states):
CA 7
TX 7
AZ 4

(Florida-in many ways it's own special case; not technically a 'border state'):
FL 3

('Magnet states w/large populations of illegals):
IL 3
NY 2
CO 1
NJ 1
(PR) 1

PhredE wrote:

Most Importantly: Mr./Ms Congressperson - Have you actually read the entire bill?

It's been reported that 30% of the population of Washington, DC IS illiterate. Need I say more?

Re: Arrival Date: 1 June 2006...

How are we to know for sure those that 'arrived' on June 1, from those that 'arrived' on June 2. If you were an illegal that had come later, wouldn't you also find a way to say that you arrived earlier as well? Do you think other illegals might do exactly that?

They have said they will take the word of their families and friends on that. So there's nothing for us to be worried about there

Re: Payment of back taxes:

Will we allow exceptions for people that claim they cannot pay this amount? Considering that many illegals which come into the US via Mexico use professional 'coyotes' (smugglers) and frequently pay in excess of the $2000 amount, should we allow ANY exceptions to this 'fee/fine'?

Remember Ramos and Compean? Our government gave the drug smuggler a free "get out of jail card" to do his own thing. THEY will make the rules as they go along on that one.

How will the Federal government attempt to rectify past identify theft and document fraud perpetrated against US citizens in terms of using legal citizens' SSNs, etc.? How will these past costly criminal acts be adjudicated in favor of the US citizens who have been harmed, financially, professionally, etc? Which remedies are available?

Remember the word our government used last year concerning that? "FORGIVENESS"

How will we know that people are interested in becoming Americans - not just coming here to find a job - something that can be done in 100+ countries throughout the world?

That won't be a problem for too much longer........they will all have to go to other countries for jobs, because we won't have anymore jobs left here after our government gets done sending all our businesses out of this country.


That whole bill as they propose it won't mean anything at all. The illegals are over here to take our whole entire country and they have made no mention of that what - so - ever in that Bill. 1645 pages of pure and simple BS

The illegals are going to do another march again on May 1, 2007 just like last year. They will set our government straight........That's who our government listens to..........NOT US

Neese wrote:

I am extremely disappointed by our governmen's stance on illegal immigration. We were a proud and strong nation, and now we cater to Mexico and the people who so willingly break our laws. There is no excuse for our politicans to betray us like that.

Neese, we are ALL extremely disappointed by the actions of "our government". Sad to see our homeland destroyed by traitors, is it not?
We WERE a proud and strong nation. For several hundred years. Thanks to our "government" we no longer have a nation to be proud and strong for. Never again, UNLESS we can get all the corruptivness out of Washington, and I don't mean in a year or so.

I wrote Rep. Coble here in NC about a 6 page letter addressing the illegal immigration issue, the SPP issue, the NAU issue and the super highway going from the end of Mexico all the way through Canada. I wrote him about the Chemtrails that are so plentiful over our State. I wrote him about the SOLID White Buses being built here in our town. Took me 2 days to write that letter which I mailed him to him personally. Know what he said? ZILCH......NOTHING .........That was 2 months ago and I still have not heard one single word from him on that letter. I can tell you now how that makes me feel............like what I........an AMERICAN.........have to say doesn't matter to him one bit.

RUTH........great to see you!!!

Now, it's time for CALLS!
Now, it's time to let them know, every one of them, that we're on to the game!

Let's keep unraveling this monsterous piece of refuse and throw it right back at them, one FACT at a time.

They can squirm, they can wiggle........but they're NOT getting away from our grip this time One FACT at a time

SEC. 214. INCREASED CRIMINAL PENALTIES RELATED TO DRUNK DRIVING.
(a) Inadmissibility- Section 212(a)(2) (8 U.S.C. 1182(a)(2)) is amended--
(1) by redesignating subparagraph (F) as subparagraph (J); and
(2) by inserting after subparagraph (E) the following:
`(F) DRUNK DRIVERS- Any alien who has been convicted of 3 offenses for driving under the influence and at least 1 of the offenses is a felony under Federal or State law, for which the alien was sentenced to more than 1 year imprisonment, is inadmissible.'.
(b) Deportability- Section 237(a)(2) (8 U.S.C. 1227(a)(2)) is amended by adding at the end the following:
`(F) DRUNK DRIVERS- Unless the Secretary of Homeland Security or the Attorney General waives the application of this subparagraph, any alien who has been convicted of 3 offenses for driving under the influence and at least 1 of the offenses is a felony under Federal or State law, for which the alien was sentenced to more than 1 year imprisonment, is deportable.'.
(c) Judicial Advisal-
(1) IN GENERAL- A court shall not accept a guilty plea for driving under the influence unless the court has administered to the defendant, on the record, the following adivsal:
`If you are not a citizen of the United States, you are advised that conviction for driving under the influence, including conviction by entry of any plea, even if the conviction is later expunged, may result in deportation, exclusion from admission to the United States, or denial of naturalization pursuant to the laws of the United States.'.
(2) FAILURE TO ADVISE- Upon request, the court shall allow the defendant a reasonable amount of additional time to consider the appropriateness of the plea in light of the advisement set out in paragraph (1). If the court fails to advise the defendant in accordance with paragraph (1) and the defendant shows that conviction of the offense to which the defendant pleaded guilty may result in the defendant's deportation, exclusion from the United States, or denial of naturalization pursuant to the laws of the United States, the court, upon a motion by the defendant, shall vacate the judgment and permit the defendant to withdraw the plea and enter a plea of not guilty. If the record does not show that the court provided the required advisement, it shall be presumed that the defendant did not receive the advisement. The defendant shall not be required to disclose his or her immigration status at any time.
(d) Conforming Amendment- Section 212(h) (8 U.S.C. 1182(h)) is amended--
(1) in the subsection heading, by striking `Subsection (a)(2)(A)(i)(I), (II), (B), (D),AND (E)' and inserting `Certain Provisions in Subsection (a)(2)'; and
(2) in the matter preceding paragraph (1), by striking `and (E)' and inserting `(E), and (F)'.
(e) Effective Date- The amendments made by this section shall take effect on the date of the enactment of this Act and shall apply to convictions entered on or after such date.

I think I will call Rep Brad Miller's office on Monday & ask them to explain
sec 214 to me. We've had a rash of drunk driving fatalities in NC in the
last few months, including one in the last couple of days. Does this mean
I will be safer with my family? Seems to protect illegals from admitting
guilt on the pain of deportation.

HR 1557 is out rageous (Elvira Arellano) Can you imagine a bill just to give her legal residence, I am pissed and going to fax Judiciary committee on monday, how pathetic these people are, I am going to e-mail Lou Dobbs about it to.

Kate wrote:

There is nothing in this that is good for Americans, and if they were REALLY concerned about illegal immigration and border security, they would build the fence.

This is a farce, a sham, a travesty, and no wonder there are no other co-signers on this bill.

Anyone attaching their name to it should be ashamed and be running for cover!

Very True Kate, and every American should be outraged and stand united to make sure these traitors know that we are as MAD AS HELL AND WE ARE NOT GOING TO TAKE IT ANYMORE!

Lets see we have Sec 122(6)C,
Secretary of state and Sec. of Labor will work with apropriate officials from mexico regarding circular migration, including job training for citizens and Nationals in Mexico.

They are even more stupid than I gave them credit for if they thought the citizens would agree to a bill like this. All for Mexican National and nothing and I mean nothing for Americans, We can't even trust them to secure the border.

3 offenses and a felony before they do anything to drunk driver, why don't they just come out and say we aren't going to do anything to them until they kill one of you.
So now the U.S. is going to have seperate laws depending on race.
This also has to much NAU in it.
STUFF YOUR BILL (Gut and Flake)!!