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  1. #51
    Senior Member Gogo's Avatar
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    They can already join. They just won't. They show military illegals getting their citizenship all the time. NO they're probably worried about the background checks. There again you have the quality of character argument. In any case, they should never ever be put in front of someone going through the system to gain entry the correct and legal way. That to me is the biggest argument. The people who want to come legally, want to be American's. They want to assimilate, they want to obey our laws and be good citizens. The illegals don't and they will never convince me otherwise.

    What we really need is a Taxpayer revolt. If they pass amnesty in any fashion we need a national taxpayer revolt then ask the government how they will function. Isn't paying taxes a law. Hey, if disobeying our laws coming into the country illegally is given a pass then they will have to give us a pass or we will file a huge discrimination lawsuit.
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  2. #52
    Equalizer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gogo
    They can already join. They just won't. They show military illegals getting their citizenship all the time. NO they're probably worried about the background checks. There again you have the quality of character argument. In any case, they should never ever be put in front of someone going through the system to gain entry the correct and legal way. That to me is the biggest argument. The people who want to come legally, want to be American's. They want to assimilate, they want to obey our laws and be good citizens. The illegals don't and they will never convince me otherwise.

    What we really need is a Taxpayer revolt. If they pass amnesty in any fashion we need a national taxpayer revolt then ask the government how they will function. Isn't paying taxes a law. Hey, if disobeying our laws coming into the country illegally is given a pass then they will have to give us a pass or we will file a huge discrimination lawsuit.
    Gogo, not Legally they can't.!!

    While there is a statutory requirement that only a United States Citizen may
    become a commissioned officer, this is not true for enlistment. Certain
    non-citizens can enlist in the United States Armed Forces. To be eligible to
    enlist, a non-citizen must:

    (1) Entered the United States on a permanent residence visa or has an
    Alien Registration Receipt Card (INS Form 1-551/I-551 greencard or stamped
    I-94), and

    (2) Established a bona fide residence, and

    (3) Established a home of record in the United States.

    The visa and/or "greencard" must have sufficient time remaining on it
    (expiration date) to be valid during the entire term on enlistment. While
    non-citizens may enlist in the U.S. Military, they are not allowed to
    reenlist (stay in beyond their first term of service), unless they first
    become U.S.Citizens. However, there are accelerated citizenship procedures
    for non-citizens on active duty. For details, see our article, U.S.
    Citizenship in the Military.

    I get lots of email from non-U.S. citizens, who do not live in the U.S.,
    asking how they can join the U.S. Military. Quite simply, you can't. In
    order to join any branch of the United States Military, one must either be a
    U.S. Citizen, or one must be a legal immigrant, currently living in the
    United States, with a "green card." The United States Military cannot and
    will not assist in the immigration process. In order to join the U.S.
    Military, one must legally immigrate first, and then apply to join the
    military, once they are living in the U.S.

    http://usmilitary.about.com/od/joiningt ... ndards.htm
    <div align="center">" Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore "
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  3. #53
    Senior Member Gogo's Avatar
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    Thanks for the clarification Equalizer.
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  4. #54
    Senior Member zeezil's Avatar
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    Excellent information, Equalizer. Does it make you as sick to your stomach, as me, that the DREAM Act purports to allow ILLEGAL ALIENS in to serve in order to obtain their green card?
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  5. #55
    Senior Member NOamNASTY's Avatar
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    None should be allowed into this nation,legal or otherwise until they learn to speak our language and learn our laws .

    Some immigrants turn out to be good Americans ,some never assimilate .

    Right now we are filled up and over flowing with immigrants and need to stop all from entering for awhile ,like 10 years or more .

  6. #56
    Equalizer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zeezil
    Excellent information, Equalizer. Does it make you as sick to your stomach, as me, that the DREAM Act purports to allow ILLEGAL ALIENS in to serve in order to obtain their green card?
    It sure does Zeezil.
    <div align="center">" Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore "
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  7. #57
    Senior Member Gogo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equalizer
    Quote Originally Posted by zeezil
    Excellent information, Equalizer. Does it make you as sick to your stomach, as me, that the DREAM Act purports to allow ILLEGAL ALIENS in to serve in order to obtain their green card?
    It sure does Zeezil.
    Do you see anything about background checks either?
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  8. #58
    Equalizer's Avatar
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    Gogo, I did not see anything about background checks but I am sure they still do them. I did find this.


    Lying to Get Into the Military is a Felony

    Let's get straight to the point. Knowingly giving false information or withholding required information on any recruiting form is a criminal offense (When the information would have made an individual ineligible to enlist, or would have required a waiver to enlist). It's not a misdemenor, it's not the same as getting a speeding ticket. It's a felony offense, punishable by a $10,000 fine and three years in prison. If you lie to get into the military, you are committing a felony. It's that simple. If you get away with it long enough to actually enlist, and are caught later, it's also a "military offense." You can be prosecuted for a violation of Article 83 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ), which states:

    "Any person who--

    1. (1) procures his own enlistment or appointment in the armed forces by knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment as to his qualifications for that enlistment or appointment and receives pay or allowances thereunder; or

    2. (2) procures his own separation from the armed forces by knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment as to his eligibility for that separation;

    shall be punished as a court-martial may direct."

    The Manual for Courts-martial (MCM) lists the maximum punishment for a violation of this article as: dishonorable discharge, reduction to the lowest enlisted rank, forfeiture of all pay and allowances, and confinement at hard labor for two years.

    The Enlistment Contract (DD Form 4/1) can't make this any more plain. Paragraph 13a of the contract (signed by the recruit) states:

    13a. My acceptance for enlistment is based on the information I have given in my application for enlistment. If any of that information is false or incorrect, this enlistment may be voided or terminated administratively by the Government, or I may be tried by Federal, civilian, or military court, and, if found guilty, may be punished.
    <div align="center">" Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore "
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  9. #59
    Senior Member Gogo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equalizer
    Gogo, I did not see anything about background checks but I am sure they still do them. I did find this.


    Lying to Get Into the Military is a Felony

    Let's get straight to the point. Knowingly giving false information or withholding required information on any recruiting form is a criminal offense (When the information would have made an individual ineligible to enlist, or would have required a waiver to enlist). It's not a misdemenor, it's not the same as getting a speeding ticket. It's a felony offense, punishable by a $10,000 fine and three years in prison. If you lie to get into the military, you are committing a felony. It's that simple. If you get away with it long enough to actually enlist, and are caught later, it's also a "military offense." You can be prosecuted for a violation of Article 83 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ), which states:

    "Any person who--

    1. (1) procures his own enlistment or appointment in the armed forces by knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment as to his qualifications for that enlistment or appointment and receives pay or allowances thereunder; or

    2. (2) procures his own separation from the armed forces by knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment as to his eligibility for that separation;

    shall be punished as a court-martial may direct."

    The Manual for Courts-martial (MCM) lists the maximum punishment for a violation of this article as: dishonorable discharge, reduction to the lowest enlisted rank, forfeiture of all pay and allowances, and confinement at hard labor for two years.

    The Enlistment Contract (DD Form 4/1) can't make this any more plain. Paragraph 13a of the contract (signed by the recruit) states:

    13a. My acceptance for enlistment is based on the information I have given in my application for enlistment. If any of that information is false or incorrect, this enlistment may be voided or terminated administratively by the Government, or I may be tried by Federal, civilian, or military court, and, if found guilty, may be punished.

    Thanks Equalizer. You know a thought occurred to me. The Dems are anti war, yet if they are pushing this for recruitment purposes that says more than their words. Actions ALWAYS speak louder than words.
    Join our efforts to Secure America's Borders and End Illegal Immigration by Joining ALIPAC's E-Mail Alerts network (CLICK HERE)

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