Thread: Illegal Alien children guaranteed k-12 education? Federal?

My town board is starting to disucss our crowded schools. Is there any merit to what these two posters have posted below?! Could this issue be on a referendum? I had always thought that it was a federal issue. Last week there was news of a Chicago principal who was fired because he refused to let anymore students enter -his school was overcrowded already. I looked at the class lists at my children's school -crowded and heavy with the last names from the country below us. Anyway, I think there was a illegal alien child in this area who a district didn't want to admit and the state of Illinois said they would deny the district any state funds. So what if cities and states started tackling this issue as well?! I've heard so many tales of illegals having cousins and other relatives come up here so they could attend the schools...

http://www.waukegan.org/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5514
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Danno
Senior Member



702 Posts
Posted - 08/27/2006 : 13:28:20
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I'd like to start a movement to put the issue of the school district having to educate those who are not legally admitted to this country on a referendum.

It would not allow our school district to use any funds from taxpayer sources for the education of children who were not legally admitted into the United States.

I'm assuming a petition would be necessary to start the process.

Does anyone know the process of how to put an issue to referendum?

Could this even be done by referendum or would it have to be done by a legislative body?



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Originally posted by celerity

I think this a futile movement.

1. Supreme Court already ruled on this.

WAUKEGAN CANNOT OVERRULE THE U.S. SUPREME COURT.


2. The United States Constitution is the supreme law of the land and guarantees everyone who resides in the United States to a free and public education.

WAUKEGAN CANNOT OVERRULE THE CONSTITUTION

3. Federal Law and statutory codes all include the education of undocumented immigrants.

WAUKEGAN CANNOT OVERRULE CONGRESS

4. The Illinois School Code guarantees certain rights to ESL/Bilingual students

WAUKEGAN CANNOT OVERRULE THE ILLINOIS STATE GENERAL ASSEMBLY

5. Governor Blagojevich, the only governor in the country, established a special office to help undocumented immigrants and was courageous enough to sign a declaration in support of comprehensive immigration reform, the bill jointly sponsored by Ted Kennedy/John McCain which would provide a path to citizenship for undocumented immigrants.

WAUKEGAN CANNOT OVERRULE AN EXECUTIVE ORDER SIGNED BY THE GOVERNOR OF ILLINOIS

While not officially citizens, they are human beings and are entitled to basic human and civil rights. Education falls under the civil rights and human rights umbrella.

What has happened in some other states are statewide referenda that eliminate bilingual education, forcing instruction to only be in English. California did this. I don't know if Illinois has a referendum policy and what the procedure is, you can try to get that accomplished. I don't think it's a good idea, but hey this is a democracy.

Also, in the meantime, if you care about the future of the Waukegan Public Schools which have a reverberating effect on so much in Waukegan, you should be caring about how do we best educate the undocumented immigrants who are here, because their test scores affect the Waukegan Schools and by extension Waukegan as a whole.



"Though I may disagree with what you say, I will defend to the death your right to say it."
--Voltaire--

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DANNO

I think you may be mistaken on many of your points. I doubt your no. 2 point is correct. I don't think the Constitution guarantees an education to illegal aliens. I doubt your no. 3 point as well. I don't think there are any such federal laws.

True the Supreme Court has already ruled on this but anything can be challenged and go back to the supreme court for a new ruling.

The case that went before the Supreme Court dates to 1982 and came out of Texas appeals court and is titled Plyler v. Doe. You can read it here:

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/g ... &invol=202

I believe this court conceded that education is not a fundamental right of illegal aliens.

The case was decided on a close 5 to 4 voteto begin with and the dissenting opinion is especially good. Please read it.

Justice Berger, in the dissenting opinion, said: "If the State is to deny a discrete group of innocent children (illegal immigrants) the free public education that it offers to other children residing within its borders, that denial must be justified by a showing that it furthers some substantial state interest."

The state of Texas failed to address that important issue at that time and never went back to show a substancial burden on the state finances for having to educate illegal aliens. And the burden is certainly greater now than it was in 1982 in that regard.

I believe it would be possible to show that such a denial of a free education "furthers some substantial state interest".
I believe that is all that would be required to prevail. Of course it would probably need to go all the way back to the supreme court.

If the state or even our local school district enacted a policy that denied a free education to illegal aliens it would most certainly be challenged. I could go all the way back to the Supreme Court and be decided in favor of the denial too. The climate is much different now than it was in 1982.

So does anyone know how to get it on a referendum?

Every kid in the US, legal or illegal, is, indeed guaranteed a K-12 education. And guess who foots the bill?

Every kid whose parents don't make enough money (and millions of illegals fall into this category) is guaranteed a free breakfast and lunch along with his/her free education. Guess who foots that bill?

Every kid under the age of 19 is guaranteed free medical care including innoculations, medicine, etc. And guess who foots that bill? And do you realize that many of these kids under 19 already have more than one kid for you to support?

I'd love to see these federal laws change. And I applaud every single state that is standing up to the fools like Ted Kennedy who gave all these illegal aliens these privileges and forced us to pay for them.

It would be worth while having the referendum even if it needs to be followed up with court case so that the politicians could see where the citizens stand on the issue. The heavier the support the more likely the politicians are to have the proper follow through.

This also is similar to the issue of birthright citizenship which is also likewise an just interpretation no a law.

If you were to point out to Mexicans in Mexico their lack of services to their illegals (that we offer Mexican illegals here) they would asert to you tooth an nail that the expectation of the services are not protected by civil rights. You can not expect to bnefit by vioating Mexican laws.

Y'know, it seems the illegals have figured out how to get representation without taxation...

Until someone can remove Pyler VS Texas 1981, local laws and provisions going after the k-12 illegals will fail in Federal courts.

This is what killed CA Prop. 187 in the 90's.

W

socalcracker
ALIPAC New Recruit!


Joined: Aug 18, 2006
Posts: 9

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 6:47 pm Post subject:

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It would be great if one state could get to be the first to get this through--so that we, the taxpayers, don't have to educate the illegals.

If not, then maybe the affected and concerned school districts could do something innovative--like corporations have done with telecommuting. Only it would be tele-educating, for qualifying students. ONE teacher,
with assistant(S), the BEST teacher, teaching a single subject. With a handful of teachers, the entire school district could be serviced--for qualifying students. This could be an optional program--with selected criteria--like, must be fluent in English. One or two days per week, the students could actually go to school (or go whereever) to meet with teacher assistant--who can certify that students learned what they needed to learn (and administer additional testing).

All non qualifying students could be packed into EXISTING school buildings and taught in the traditional way--until they can qualify for the alternative. No one said that students have to be taught in school buildings--as far as I'm concerned, bring in all those unused Katrina trailors or put up some Arpaio pink tents.

At least the students who WANT to learn, and who don't want to drop out,
wouldn't have to subjected to metal detectors for most of the week.

CA voted to abolish bilingual education, but many schools still teach in Spanish, especially here in San Diego, they just call it 'Migrant Education' now. On our cable access TV, there is what they call ITV, the local eduational channel, and every night they list school job openings, and they list all kinds of openings for teachers who can speak Spanish. They are looking for ESL teachers, Migrant Education teachers, etc. So although the people voted to end bilingual education here, it is alive and well.

On the local news one time, they had a story of when Gov. Arnold was visiting some classroom, and in the background on the wall were words in Spanish. You know how they have wall posters and such, these were all in Spanish, I even thought I saw a Mexican flag poster on the wall. And Arnold is smiling and talking like nothing is wrong. If I walked into that classroom, I would be like "what the hell is this crap? This is America, we speak English", but no, he was looking as though everything was A-OK.

In some schools here, marching band has been replaced with Mariachi, I'm not kidding, all these Mexican kids wearing black and red Mariachi costumes with the bigs sombreros and frilly balls hanging down playing their giant guitar and trumpets. How long until they replace football with soccer. Maybe they'll replace basketball with cockfighting.

Arnold is not even an American in my mind. He has no idea in his heart and mind what it means to be an American.

How would he like it if 20mil Mexicans moved to Austria?

How would he feel about it then?

[/b]It is true, families bring their nephews and nices to get free education here. Of course, taxpayers pay for it, and no one says a word.

I even thought I saw a Mexican flag poster on the wall. ....
In some schools here, marching band has been replaced with Mariachi, I'm not kidding, all these Mexican kids wearing black and red Mariachi costumes with the bigs sombreros and frilly balls hanging down playing their giant guitar and trumpets. How long until they replace football with soccer. Maybe they'll replace basketball with cockfighting.

There are people working in El Paso TX school offices who have mexican flags on the wall over their desks!

And, yep, those mariachis really irk me.

The Mexican kids cross the border from El Paso to play soccer on week ends. Of course, probably some of them actually LIVE in mexico and just stay with Auntie Maria all week to go to American schools and get extra welfare dollars for the Auntie. After all, all it takes is a fake birth certificate.

Are there roosters crowing in San Diego neighborhoods? There are in El Paso. Cockfighting is illegal in TX but apparently raising roosters in the city isn't illegal! I was in the post office one time when a guy was MAILING a rooster to someone.