Thread: This is Not My America Any More.

Hi Grey:

So far, there are four of us committed to forming and exploratory committee on this...I've put together a private message board where I am hoping the talks will progress. Please send me a PM and I will send you the link to the message board...once everyone has joined up we'll open up discussions.

Pinto Bean

greyparrot wrote:

lc0130 - What a terrific post! IMHO, folks that come here legally are every bit as American as those that stepped off the Mayflower.

I agree, Greyparrot! lc0130 is a wonderful example of how immigrants become Americans. Thank you lc0130, for respecting our laws and our country

Pinto, CYE.

As far as stopping the mass invasion goes, we all hope our leaders will wise up and stand up for the real Americans thay are supposed to represent and end this nonsense. But this country is finished without mass deportations of ALL illegals AND their prolific litters of children, U.S. born or otherwise. If we just stop the invasion, although great, would not stop those illegals already here from taking over the country by the sheer numbers of anchor babies they can produce.

I have heard them speak so many times saying how us Americans are a dying race, and how they intend to reconquer America simply by outbreeding us. And given the fact that they all get free healthcare and delivery services for all these babies, not only are we losing our coutry, we are actually paying for our own destruction, and they know it, and are laughing in our faces all the while.

We need to make it clear to our so-called leaders that not only is Amnesty or Guest Worker programs not acceptable, but that all illegals MUST be returned to their home countries, along with all their anchor babies too. Otherwise, everything we have been fighting for is all a lost cause.

I see it everyday in my hometown, illegals not only taking over, but actively breeding at astronomical rates, for the purpose of reconquering America and turning it into a Mexican nation. Everywhere I go, I see every Mexican woman of child bearing age with a double or triple stroller full of babies, with another dozen kids behind in tow, none speaking a word of English, with absolutely no intention of learning it or attempting to assimilate, they know that it is only a matter of time until they outnumber English speaking real Americans, so we will all have to learn Spanish in order to just survive.

We just cannot allow this to happen, or future generations of Americans will have to live in a third world toilet like the ones these so-called immigrants claim to be fleeing from.

Reptile:

I cannot say I disagree with much of your assessment, and in fact birth rates of the illegal aliens of Latino decent lend credence to your ascertions on the issue. I know from personal experience based on just the one house next to me, that this God Fearing Latino Catholics seem to embrace the concepts of LARGE families, and a dislike of any means of birth control.

That being said, think we have to be somewhat diplomatic in how we present that argument to avoid looking like racists even if what we are saying is based on facts. I am angry, you are angry, and we have a right to be, but I've learned over the years, that if we are to wage a successful fight ending in victory, we have to harness that energy and present it in a way that delivers a positive message in supporting and moving forth our arguments on the issues.

You present your factual arguments in a way that portrays stereotypes of the illegal alien, and even if they are on some level true, the images portrayed see people dismiss us as bigoted racist buffoons, rather than people rightfully upset who are presenting serious factual information on the issues for serious debate.

If I state that recent statistics from the PEW report have identified children born to illegal aliens as the fastest growing birth sector of American Society, it makes exactly your point, but sounds so much more acceptable. In short, it's not what we say, but how we say it that counts, and the pro Amnesty crowd is already trying to play the race card and paint us all out as a bunch of rabid red neck bigots.

Pinto Bean

Pinto,

I've been trying for an hour but I STILL can't say it any better than that!

After reading everything here are my thoughts

1: America as we know it today was built on the idea of equality, so why is it that you believe that americans have more rights?
2: The reason that you have not mentioned that Americans are loosing their jobs and "Illegals" are taking them is because "Illegals" come here for a better life and they are willing to work for whatever is given to them no matter the price, whereas many americans nowadays believe a job is a right, not a privalege.
3: I am against illegal immigration, but instead of fighting it why can't we find a way to work with it, and make it easier to immigrate?

My last question to every member, how many of you have put yourselves in their shoes?

Originally Posted by imsur-cuz-urlic

After reading everything here are my thoughts

1: America as we know it today was built on the idea of equality, so why is it that you believe that americans have more rights?
2: The reason that you have not mentioned that Americans are loosing their jobs and "Illegals" are taking them is because "Illegals" come here for a better life and they are willing to work for whatever is given to them no matter the price, whereas many americans nowadays believe a job is a right, not a privalege.3: I am against illegal immigration, but instead of fighting it why can't we find a way to work with it, and make it easier to immigrate?

My last question to every member, how many of you have put yourselves in their shoes?

Go through the posts here,There are hundreds,if not thousands of posts about just this subject! This is one of the problems of illegal immigration! They have drove our wages down to nothing, knocked legal American citizens out of their jobs because THEY WILL WORK CHEAPER! The law breaking companies that hire the illegals want SLAVE LABOR and that's what they get. Americans who have had their wages depressed(like I did) and those out in unemployment lines because of illegals, are FED UP with it! And the illegals have no respect for themselves if they allow companies to hire them at slave wages. All this and the fact that THEY BROKE OUR LAWS is what is making people so angry. Put yourself in the American citizen's shoes, lose everything you have worked for because someone snuck across our border illegally and took your job, then see why we oppose illegal immigration!

Originally Posted by imsur-cuz-urlic

After reading everything here are my thoughts

1: America as we know it today was built on the idea of equality, so why is it that you believe that americans have more rights?
2: The reason that you have not mentioned that Americans are loosing their jobs and "Illegals" are taking them is because "Illegals" come here for a better life and they are willing to work for whatever is given to them no matter the price, whereas many americans nowadays believe a job is a right, not a privalege.
3: I am against illegal immigration, but instead of fighting it why can't we find a way to work with it, and make it easier to immigrate?

My last question to every member, how many of you have put yourselves in their shoes?

I have a feeling this is a troll post.. will just say that this attitude is one I come across many times with people b/c they just don't see the big picture.

Being American will lose much of it's meaning if coming here illegally is made to be ok by George Bush...

Originally Posted by imsur-cuz-urlic

After reading everything here are my thoughts

1: America as we know it today was built on the idea of equality, so why is it that you believe that americans have more rights?
2: The reason that you have not mentioned that Americans are loosing their jobs and "Illegals" are taking them is because "Illegals" come here for a better life and they are willing to work for whatever is given to them no matter the price, whereas many americans nowadays believe a job is a right, not a privalege.
3: I am against illegal immigration, but instead of fighting it why can't we find a way to work with it, and make it easier to immigrate?

My last question to every member, how many of you have put yourselves in their shoes?

Equal Rights and protection under the law applies to those who are legally here. If I go out and break our nation laws in whatever fashion, I have to pay a price, be it a fine, restitution or even time in prison. Those who come to America illegally are already starting off on the wrong foot because by doing so, they are criminals. Furthermore, when the take a job working under the table (the underground economy) and are not filing their tax returns and paying taxes, they have committed yet another crime in America.

Let's look at this equality based on this premise...if and illegal alien is in this country illegally, and is not paying taxes, it gives him or her and unfair advantage over those living here legally. They in fact and deed can afford to work for less money, because their pay is NET, verse gross pay. When a day laborer is handed a crisp American one hundred dollar bill, it's ALL THEIRS. If and American were working above board for that same crisp American one hundred dollar bill, they are not going to see all of it. With worker's comp, FICA, local, state and federal taxes, maybe union dues and other deductions, they are looking at a net of around $62.00 To end up with the exact same in pocket amount of net income, the American has to earn $160.00 a day if they are going to ABIDE BY OUR LAWS, and pay their taxes in support of the great American Society that we have built over these past two hundred years. So, in reality, these illegals again are deliberately ignoring one of our basic precepts of the American democracy, which is EQUAL RIGHTS...when they are coming here and working illegally, they actually have enhansed rights, have a better position to bargain from in getting a job because they CAN AFFORD to work for less money than legalized Americans, and still be ahead of the game at the end of the work week.

You state that illegals are coming here for a better life...does that give them the right to steal that BETTER LIFE from those already here? Do you really believe that is a just and fair argument for those coming here illegally? We want a better life, so we have decided to illegally invade your country and steal your way of life and make it ours...we are sorry this means you will be living in poverty down, but GET OVER IT, we are not leaving. America has absorbed more of the world's huddled masses than any other nation, we have far more liberal immigrations rules than almost any country in the world, including Mexico...but, there is a limit to our generosity, there is a limit to how many people we can absorb in any given period of time, and that limit has been WAY OVER TAXED. Curious here for the sake of argument...lets say that America agreed to absorb those already here, and give them a means to earn legal citizenship. Would everyone else in these Latino nations including Mexico be willing to respect and honor a moratorium on immigration for say a period of ten years? Would the rest of those who say they would migrate to America agree to this....it's a rhetorical question, as we both already know the answer to the question.

As to three...again, we have a very generous, even overly generous immigration policy, and NONE OF US have a problem with those who have abided by our laws and immigrated here legally. The problem is with those who have come here illegally, who are not willing to abide by our laws, are not willing to accept that we simply cannot absorb every one in the world that wishes to live here...I am guessing, that short of zero restrictions on the number of people that can come here, that you are not going to be happy, that I and the rest of this board would be wasting our breath in trying to convince you that our cause is a just one.

Put myself in their shoes...When I was six years old my Dad lost his business when the Sherman Williams Paint company decided they wanted his market share and opened up a paint shop three doors down from his in a small rural town and sold paint at a loss until he was defeated. We were broke, lost our home, has to live in a rat invested apartment and lived on one meal a day...oatmeal, and that went on for six months before my father was able to land a job as the manager of and auto parts store over the river in Louisville Kentucky. I've been in those shoes, I grew up POOR AS DIRT wearing my older brother's hand me downs, and going to school with shoes that had the soles duct taped to the tops. Life was not easy, we did the best we could, worked hard and eventually found a certain level of prosparity in life, and began living the American Dream...BUT, WE DID IT LEGALLY, we abided by the rules and the laws of the United States of America, and there is nothing wrong with any of us expecting, even demanding that those who come to this fine and wondrous land find their dreams in that same fashion...within the confines of our laws.

Pinto Bean