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Thread: Trump supports completion of Dakota Access Pipeline

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  1. #11
    MW
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    This whole "conflict of interest" issue is a fabricated issue by Hillary Shrills with no more meat on its bones than the Miss Piggy story.

    There is nothing wrong or illegal about our electing a Billionaire to be President. There is no law, rule, ruling or regulation that requires him to divest of his fortune, simple because we did. There is nothing at all that requires him to stop promoting his name, his reputation, his accomplishments, his family or his business.

    We have ignorant people in the media trying to discuss something as an issue, that is not an issue.

    Approving the Dakota Access Pipeline is not an conflict of interest with the people of the United States, regardless of who does it or what they own when they do. The Dakota Access Pipeline is an ordinary common-place pipeline project. It doesn't touch the Indian Reservation. It's not on their lands. It is a perfectly legal, and apparently environmentally safe pipeline, per the approvals of the EPA, and without an environmental objection or natural security issue, no President has any authority to disapprove it.
    It's beyond me how you can sit there with a straight face and defend something like this. There is no difference in this and a judge who had his wife, kidnapped, raped and murdered sitting in judgement of someone that is accused of the exact same thing. Since a sitting President cannot recuse himself from making decisions where a conflict of interest or lack of impartiality is possible, it's best he not put himself in such a position. Personally, I'm not looking to see Trump impeached before finishing his term in office.

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  2. #12
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    He probably couldn't stop it at this point. Again, I don't know much about it.

    How many people in this country could we elect or nominate that would not have some potential conflict. The idea of their putting their business in a 'blind trust' is just silly.

    How many people who are against this pipline, would be willing to call up the people handling their investments and tell them to dump energy stocks? How many who have relatives working in the energy field would do that?

    This is one of those problems we have in this country that has no
    quick or easy answers.

    We need to question and criticize the new President when we think he is wrong, support him when we think he is right.

    Also, if we - out here in 'deplorable land' would live our lives, and spend our monies in ways that would make a difference in our country and in our own lives, our country would be better and we would be better.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    I can't believe that you would sit there and compare approval of a natural gas pipeline that meets all the conditions required for approval to a woman being kidnapped, raped and murdered. Four state environmental agencies have approved it as has the US Army Corps of Engineers, which reports to Barack Obama. What is the issue? What is the conflict? You don't think Trump would approve the pipeline if he didn't own stock in the pipeline company? I think Trump will approve all pipelines that meet all the legal, environmental and construction requirements.

    A "conflict of interest" is when you do something wrong because you have a personal conflict with what is right. There is no conflict with right. Right is right. There is no reason not to approve the pipeline when all the agencies have done their jobs and signed off on it. The only reason the President signs a permit on this pipeline to begin with is national security and trade issues because the natural gas is coming from Canada and requires permission to enter our country through the pipeline.

    Canada is a friendly country, there are no American natural gas companies complaining about it, there are no environmental issues according to our laws, rules and regulations and there are no trade issues such as jobs being stolen.

    If there is some reason not to approve it, what is it?
    Last edited by Judy; 12-02-2016 at 10:40 PM.
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  4. #14
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    nntrixie wrote (excerpt):

    How many people in this country could we elect or nominate that would not have some potential conflict. The idea of their putting their business in a 'blind trust' is just silly.
    I absolutely disagree. Furthermore, he should also divest in any stocks he owns in companies that are regulated or do business with the federal government.

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" ** Edmund Burke**

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    We have a Clean Water Act for a reason - like you & yours & theirs health. Why should mr frack be EXEMPT from that law... oh $$$$

    "No man may poison the people for his private profit."
    —Theodore Roosevelt

    Areas are being ripped up for very dirty fuel sources in USA & Canada - our beautiful lands ripped up.. . What is the problem with progressing to non-toxic forms --- oh $$$$ for the rich guys is in gas & oil.....

    Expand clean, renewable energy instead - no toxicity, plenty of jobs. Leave space for wilderness and inhabitants.


    e.g.
    Reindeer existing in USA..@ a dozen, British Columbia @ 1400....Alaska lost 50% of their caribou population in the last 3 yrs
    America’s Gray Ghosts: The Disappearing Caribou

    By JIM ROBBINSOCT. 3, 2016




    At last count, there were about 1,354 mountain caribou in 15 subgroups in southern British Columbia. Credit David Moskowitz BONNERS FERRY, Idaho — The only caribou left in the contiguous United States are here in northern Idaho where they number about a dozen and live deep in the forests of the jagged Selkirk Mountains, near the Canadian border. Because they are so rarely seen, the caribou — America’s version of reindeer — are known as gray ghosts.
    They may very soon become real ghosts: These animals are among the most endangered species in the lower 48 states.
    “Right now, predation is the biggest problem, primarily wolves and cougars,” said Norm Merz, a wildlife biologist with the Kootenai Tribe of Idaho, which has contracted with the United States Fish and Wildlife Service to create a plan to revive the population. Not that long ago, hundreds of the animals lived in the United States.
    Part of the problem is that the Selkirk herd is international. The caribou can be found in the snowy old-growth forests of Idaho and extreme northeast Washington, but spend about 90 percent of their time in southern Canada. The threat to the animals there is so serious that Canadian government sharpshooters began killing wolves from helicopters. In the Selkirk Mountains, they have killed just 19 so far.
    Widespread wolf culls further north in Alberta are credited with saving the Little Smoky caribou herd in the Peace River region. But the price was high: About 1,000 wolves were killed over a decade.
    The Selkirk herd is not the only one so greatly imperiled. At last count, there were some 1,354 mountain caribou in 15 subgroups in southern British Columbia. Ten years ago, there were thousands. Today, all are in steep decline and listed as endangered in Canada, primarily because of wolves.
    Wolf predation, though, is a symptom of a much bigger and far more difficult problem. The fundamental cause of the caribou decline is the unanticipated ecological consequences of development.

    Habitat destruction from logging, mining and resource extraction activities threaten the animals.



    The steep mountain forests where the caribou dwell are part of an inland temperate rain forest, a unique ecosystem characterized by frequent precipitation and the only one inland. The centuries-old cedar and hemlock trees, and the lodgepole and whitebark pines in the high country, are home to a lichen that the southern herds of so-called deep-snow caribou depend on.

    For decades, the forest has been fragmented by clear-cutting, road building, oil development and mining. Where the forest has grown back, it is dominated by willows and other small trees favored by moose, deer and elk.

    In 2009, wolf numbers began surging in southern British Columbia, northern Idaho and northeastern Washington, drawn to the abundant prey. The population of mountain caribou dived, including the Selkirk herd, which then numbered about 50.

    Wolves focus primarily on moose and deer, but in the last two years, wolves have killed two caribou in the Selkirks; cougars killed another one. Yet another was killed by a car on Highway 3 in Canada, where salt on the road lures wildlife.


    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/04/sc...-columbia.html
    Last edited by artist; 12-03-2016 at 10:03 PM.

  6. #16
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    It's so sad to hear about the lost and declining species, it's everywhere and the main cause is development driven by population growth. There was a reason Americans and I think many European nations as well subscribed voluntarily to zero population growth. That truly is the only way we're going to save the planet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MW View Post
    nntrixie wrote (excerpt):



    I absolutely disagree. Furthermore, he should also divest in any stocks he owns in companies that are regulated or do business with the federal government.
    Pres. Bush was trying to get some kind of bill concerning medical benefits. Some congressman was spearheading and giving all kinds of professional pro information. I believe he was a doctor and his family was quite large in medical hospitals, etc.

    Someone asked if that might not be a conflict of interest and the public was told, 'No, he has put his holdings in a blind trust."

    At the time, I thought does a blind trust mean he has lost his memory and doesn't realize he stands to benefit or his family?

    That is beyond belief.

    In a perfect world, we could demand they divest themselves of everything. Sadly, we don't live on one of those and it is getting less so every day.


    I would like someone to come up with a system that would happen.

    Believe me, I am not one who usually defends corporate and business people and pretend they don't do skullduggery. Actually, I am not defending it now and I do absolutely understand what you are saying and don't disagree at all.

    Now, we could have voted Hillary in - all her money is in the 'foundation.'

    I understand what you are saying, but I just don't see how it is possible.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    It's so sad to hear about the lost and declining species, it's everywhere and the main cause is development driven by population growth. There was a reason Americans and I think many European nations as well subscribed voluntarily to zero population growth. That at truly is the only way we're going to save the planet.
    Yes, it saddens me to think of the species that are disappearing.

    Clean water is the thing that concerns me the most. Several years ago,
    they did some research and announced that a large portion (I want to say half, but don't remember for sure) of all rivers and lakes in Texas were undrinkable, unfishable and unswimmable (is that a word.)

    A young man who was a childhood friend of my sons put a new roof on a house we had in East Texas. He was remembering about playing on the spring fed creek that ran through our property we owned when our children were small and how if they got thirsty, they would drink from the creek. He said he wouldn't even consider drinking from in creek in the county now.

    We had three wells on the property - all tested at almost pure. About 10 years after we sold it, the owner said he had to cap the wells, fence off the creek because the water made his horses sick.

    So I understand the angst over pipelines, etc. Again though, I don't see how PE Trump could stop it, assuming he wanted to.

    Yes, they sold us on zero population growth and it made sense - still does. Now they are saying the reason we need illegals is because we aren't having children any more.

  9. #19
    MW
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    nntrixie wrote (excerpt):

    So I understand the angst over pipelines, etc. Again though, I don't see how PE Trump could stop it, assuming he wanted to.
    I don't know much on the details in regards to the current pipeline protest that is going on. However, Trump can make sure the Keystone Pipeline doesn't get built. Well, that is assuming the U.S. Congress doesn't pass a veto proof bill, which they don't have the support for right now. Sadly Trump supports the Keystone Pipeline, which means approval will probably get passed early in Trump's presidency. The only reason it hasn't already received approval is because Obama, along with the majority of Democrats, have been opposing it.

    I've been a conservative Republican my entire voting life. Although, even I'll admit that the Republican's are hard on the environment.
    Last edited by MW; 12-03-2016 at 12:07 PM.

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  10. #20
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    I'm SHOCKED that a billionaire businessman has some of his money invested in stocks of major US corporations! SHOCKED, I tell you! Yawn.

    BTW, I wonder if the writers of these leftist propaganda hit pieces use any of those evil petroleum products? I'm sure the communist zealots don't even see how hypocritical they are. See #3 here: http://townhall.com/columnists/johnh...e_to_be_around

    You don't get gas in your cars to go to your leftist political rallies without pipelines, morons! Oh and BTW anthropogenic global warming is a scam!
    Last edited by patbrunz; 12-03-2016 at 12:44 PM.
    All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing. -Edmund Burke

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