Thread: Advocates of splitting California into six states gathering signatures

Advocates of splitting California into six states gathering signatures


Molly Kelley, 62, of Klamath River, holds up a State of Jefferson flag as she folds it inside the Klamath River Community Hall in California. (Francine Orr / Los Angeles Times)

HARRIET RYANcontact the reporter

Advocates for Six Californias, a plan to split the state up 6 ways, are holding a petition drive this weekend

Good day, future citizen of West California!

You may find yourself greeted thusly as you head into a supermarket or drugstore in Los Angeles on Saturday morning.

Advocates for Six Californias, a plan to split the Golden State into a half dozen separate states, are holding a petition drive this weekend to get their plan on the ballot in 2016.


Tom Knorr, holds a State of Jefferson flag in Corning, Calif. The idea of forming their own state has been a topic among local secession dreamers for more than a century in the state. (Terry Chea / Associated Press)

The idea is the brainchild of Timothy Draper, a venture capitalist from Menlo Park – or as he hopes to some day call it, the state of Silicon Valley. Draper has sunk $2 million into signature gathering for the proposal. He maintains it will break bureaucratic deadlock in Sacramento (proposed state of North California) and attract more business.

"California has become the worst managed state in the country," he told The Times this spring. "It just is too big and too ungovernable."


L.A. NOWTwo more Northern California counties may support breakaway state
SEE ALL RELATED

Draper, a political independent, needs about 808,000 signatures by July 18 to get the measure on the ballot in two years. He has said he hassupport from the Oregon border (proposed state of Jefferson) to San Diego (South California), but the plan has been given almost no chance of success by some experts and ridiculed by Democrats and Republicans alike.

Anna Morris, spokeswoman for Six Californias, said in an e-mail that the group has collected “a significant amount of signatures and are hoping to get the remaining signatures we need this weekend.”

“For people who put our chances at zero, we say that we are dedicated to challenging the status quo and are hopeful that Six Californias will be the much needed refresh for state government,” she said.

Joe Rodota, the co-chair of OneCalifornia, an opposition group, downplayed the significance of getting signatures on a petition.

“This is just a process that pretty much any well-funded interest can pursue,” said Rodota, former cabinet secretary for Gov. Pete Wilson.

The real challenge, he said, is ballot approval and “it’s just very difficult to get a yes vote historically.”

Times political columnist George Skelton called Six Californias “crazy” and “really crackpot,” but he noted that attempts to break up the state have been around since its inception and can be highly diverting if never successful.

“Go ahead and put this thing on the ballot,” he wrote in April. “We could use some fun.”

harriet.ryan@latimes.com
For legal news, follow @latimesharriet

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/l...621-story.html

This will go now where and accomplish absolutely nothing,

just like the Texas seceding from the union deal

and from 2009

http://www.alipac.us/f19/desperate-c...states-148447/


May. 21, 2009

Why the heck 6 states? I see that as a clear attempt for stronger liberal control of the House and Senate. I could see cutting it into 2-3 states but no more. But 2-3 states would leave 1, probably 2 strongly Conservative/Republican.

California, the most populous state in the United States and third largest in area, has been the subject of more than 220 proposals to divide it into multiple states^[1] including at least 27 serious proposals.^[2] In addition, there have been various calls for the restoration of the California Republic, which would entail secession from the United States.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partiti..._in_California

Whats Cali's population though w/o Immigrants, illegal aliens, and anchor babies? Those sort of things are what should be looked at. US Citizens are meant to elect our leaders, and in doing so pick our laws. But if a state like Cali gets to split into many states when 1/2 the population or more don't have the legal right to vote or should of never been in the country in the first place it would doom the rest of us.

We really need the US Census to differentiate between Citizen, Legal Immigrant, and Illegal Alien. Representation should ONLY be split based on Citizens.

Originally Posted by ReformUSA2012

Whats Cali's population though w/o Immigrants, illegal aliens, and anchor babies? Those sort of things are what should be looked at. US Citizens are meant to elect our leaders, and in doing so pick our laws. But if a state like Cali gets to split into many states when 1/2 the population or more don't have the legal right to vote or should of never been in the country in the first place it would doom the rest of us.

We really need the US Census to differentiate between Citizen, Legal Immigrant, and Illegal Alien. Representation should ONLY be split based on Citizens.

Anchor babies are U.S. citizens under current Federal Laws.
They shouldn't be, but the are.
California has no say in that matter.
Legal immigrants have the ability to become U.S. citizens under Federal Law.
California has no say in that matter.
Federal laws count all people in the census.
California has no say in that matter.
It is the Federal Governments responsibility to control the border.
They do a very poor job of it.
The Federal Government says all kids must be given an education, at taxpayer expense.
No state can get out of it.
Federal laws say anchor babies are eligible for welfare, foodstamps , medicare , etc.
No state has a say in any of these matters.
Looks like the Federal Government is responsible for all of these problems.

There have been more than 220 attempts to split CA.
None of them have worked.
And this one won't either.

California, the most populous state in the United States and third largest in area, has been the subject of more than 220 proposals to divide it into multiple states^[1] including at least 27 serious proposals.^[2] In addition, there have been various calls for the restoration of the California Republic, which would entail secession from the United States.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partiti..._in_California

Advocates for splitting California into six states verify signatures

CAPTIONTom KnorrTerry Chea / Associated Press
Tom Knorr holds a State of Jefferson flag in Corning, Calif. The idea of forming their own state has been a topic among local secession dreamers for more than a century in the state.


CAPTIONState of Jefferson FlagFrancine Orr / Los Angeles Times
Molly Kelley, 62, of Klamath River, holds up a State of Jefferson flag as she folds it inside the Klamath River Community Hall in California.


CAPTIONState of Jefferson flagFrancine Orr / Los Angeles Times
Molly Kelley, 62, of Klamath River, holds up a State of Jefferson flag as she folds it on Nov. 20, 2013.


CAPTIONYrekaJeff Chiu / Associated Press
Pedestrians cross Miner Street in Yreka, Calif. Yreka, the would-be capital of the State of Jefferson, began as part publicity stunt, part political gesture.


CAPTIONSiskiyou CountyFrancine Orr / Los Angeles Times
Main Street is quiet, with very little traffic, in the small town of Etna, Calif., in scenic rural Scott Valley, in Siskiyou County. The county is one of several that backs separating much of Northern California into its own State of Jefferson.

HARRIET RYAN, JOSEPH SERNAcontact the reporters

Advocates of splitting California into six states work to verify signatures from weekend petition drive

Proponents for a plan to split up California into a half-dozen separate states were working feverishly Monday to verify signatures gathered from across the state over the weekend in support of a petition to get the measure on the ballot, officials said.

[W]e are dedicated to challenging the status quo and are hopeful that Six Californias will be the much needed refresh for state government.- Anna Morris, spokeswoman for Six Californias

The Six Californias idea needs 808,000 signatures by July 18 to qualify for the ballot in two years. The idea is the brainchild of Timothy Draper, a venture capitalist from Menlo Park – or as he hopes to some day call it, the state of Silicon Valley.

Draper has sunk $2 million into signature gathering for the proposal. He maintains it will break bureaucratic deadlock in Sacramento (in the proposed state of North California) and attract more business.
"California has become the worst managed state in the country," he told The Times this spring. "It just is too big and too ungovernable."

lRelatedL.A. NOW
Advocates of splitting California into six states gathering signatures SEE ALL RELATED

Draper said he has support from the Oregon border (proposed state of Jefferson) to San Diego (South California), but the plan has been given almost no chance of success by some experts and ridiculed by Democrats and Republicans alike.

Anna Morris, spokeswoman for Six Californias, said in an email Monday that it would take awhile to verify signatures gathered over the weekend, but that the group plans to release the tally once it's completed.

“For people who put our chances at zero, we say that we are dedicated to challenging the status quo and are hopeful that Six Californias will be the much needed refresh for state government,” she said.

Joe Rodota, the co-chair of OneCalifornia, an opposition group, downplayed the significance of getting signatures on a petition.


“This is just a process that pretty much any well-funded interest can pursue,” said Rodota, former cabinet secretary for Gov. Pete Wilson.

The real challenge, he said, is ballot approval and “it’s just very difficult to get a 'yes' vote historically.”

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/l...623-story.html

California is the most populous state and the third-largest state, geographically.

One of its 58 counties is larger geographically than the nine smallest U.S. states – and larger than the four smallest ones combined.

http://watchdog.org/142040/greenhut-split-california/

Critics of California split see dystopian visions

By Steven Greenhut / May 5, 2014

SACRAMENTO — Most critics of wealthy political activist Tim Draper’s initiative to slice up California into six states have depicted this as an interesting “thought experiment” designed mainly to spark some discussion about our arguably “ungovernable” current state. Some critics, however, have been apoplectic about the idea.


A NEW CALIFORNIA: California is the most populous state and the third-largest state, geographically. One of its 58 counties is larger geographically than the nine smallest U.S. states – and larger than the four smallest ones combined.

An article in Huffington Post argues that “6 California’s” would be “a dystopian nightmare,” with writer Kathleen Miles raising dark visions from the novel, “Atlas Shrugged”: “It would be Ayn Rand’s dream come true: separate states for rich people and poor people. (I)t’s just the latest troubling sign that the rich are … increasingly seeking to break away from the middle- and lower-classes, depriving them of tax revenue and choking off much-needed resources.”

I can’t think of many signs that the rich are fleeing the poor, let alone that America is turning into “Atlas Shrugged,” but Miles is sure something nefarious is going on.

In Rand’s not-so-subtle plot, wealthy entrepreneurs get so tired of being regulated and taxed to benefit “looters” (e.g., government officials, welfare recipients, crony capitalists) that they quietly opt out of society. They build a new “state” in Galt’s Gulch. As they take their money and talents with them, the remaining society disintegrates.

But the Miles thesis, based on noticeable differences in poverty rates between some of the new states, only works on the most superficial level.

Yes, Draper is a venture capitalist who would emerge as a kingpin in the newly formed and ultra-wealthy state of Silicon Valley. But Tim Draper as John Galt (the lead “Atlas” character) misses the central fact that doesn’t quite fit the liberal dark vision.

Large numbers of rich conservatives aren’t trying to divorce themselves from the poor, liberal masses, as Miles supposes. Rather, less-affluent conservative-minded people are the ones most likely to file for divorce from California’s wealthy liberals – and some have been wanting to do so for a very long time. It’s the opposite of what the HuffPo writer asserts. Poorer regions want to be freed from richer ones.

Draper has been pushing a statewide initiative — originally slated for November 2014, but more likely to be ready for the November 2016 ballot — that would divide this 38-million-population state into six separate states.

California is the most populous state and the third-largest state, geographically. One of its 58 counties is larger geographically than the nine smallest U.S. states – and larger than the four smallest ones combined.

Since the state’s beginnings, people have proposed efforts to chop it up into smaller parts – so the Draper idea isn’t really unusual. The state varies dramatically in terms of geography (mountains, deserts, agricultural valleys, wealthy coastal suburbs, dense cities), politics and culture. Currently, the Los Angeles area and the San Francisco Bay Area are so heavily populated that people in other regions feel as if they have no say in their state government — and those metro areas are very liberal politically. Draper argues that the state is ungovernable and that letting different regions go their own way will help break the dominance of those two areas and promote self-government.

His plan is to create six states. The far-north rural counties would become the state of Jefferson – named after a secession movement that got its start around World War II and continues to this day. It even has its own flag. The agriculturally oriented Central Valley (along with the Sierra Nevada Mountains and “Gold Rush” foothills) would be Central California. The Sacramento area and Napa wine country would be included in North California. The Bay Area would be its own state called Silicon Valley. Los Angeles and some of the wealthy Central Coast would be West California.

The rest of Southern California would be South California.

My biggest question is why Draper, a politically independent entrepreneur, would want to be in a state with San Francisco. But combining that deep blue area into one state would certainly make it easier for the other new states.

Of the six states, Jefferson has the highest poverty rate (20.8 percent), yet it is the state that, as mentioned, already has a full-blown secessionist movement. If HuffPo were correct, then this most-impoverished region would be most opposed to Draper’s idea – yet its residents have been itching to leave for decades.

One also might sense secessionist fervor in the poor but agriculturally lush San Joaquin Valley, which would be the heart and soul of Central California.

Farmers in those parts are tired of having their water controlled by voters in places such as LA and San Jose rather than, say, Fresno. For a sense of the anger, check out the ubiquitous protest signs that line the 5 freeway along the arid, western edge of the valley, where farmers complain of state and federal efforts to take away “their” water.

Again, this is one of the most economically troubled regions in the state and a region most eager to go its own way.

Even Riverside County supervisors have voted in favor of exploring the creation of a new state. That county would be part of Draper’s wealthy, coastal South California, but many people in the Inland Empire, the more arid and blue-collar areas where Riverside is located, would be happy to be disconnected, politically speaking, from the enthusiasms of Santa Monica and East LA.

New boundaries wouldn’t stop them from catching a Dodger’s game or flying to San Francisco for a concert, but it would allow this more conservative area to pursue policies better suited to its largely suburban, right-leaning region.

Draper’s Silicon Valley along with West California and North California would become even bigger petri dishes for the “progressive” policies that dominate the Capitol. They would get much more of what they have now, which brings to mind Mencken’s saying that democracy is the theory that the people deserve to get what they want, “good and hard.”

Congress would have to approve the new states, and one can imagine that many of them would not welcome another 10 senators from post-California.

The “6 California’s” idea, though, is not about changing the national political dynamic. It’s about providing better representation for the people who live in each state and giving them the means to better chart their own political future.

Each new state could pursue policies that best suited their own voters without being so dominated by two mega-metropolitan areas and their odd priorities.

For instance, efforts to tax and even ban hydraulic fracturing are coming almost entirely from coastal enclaves, whereas residents of Kern County and other parts of the state’s agricultural heartland are eager for the high-paying jobs and local revenues. Democrats and Republicans there would like to develop their oil resources, but are being stymied by the concerns of big-city environmental priorities. That’s just one of many examples of how the current set up is holding back entire regions.

The United States was formed by colonists who revolted against a distant empire that had become out of touch and oppressive. The resulting system of federalism is based on the idea that small political units govern better than big, far-off ones because they are closer to the people. There’s nothing sacrosanct about any existing boundaries, and this has nothing to do with the rich trying to offload the poor or any such dystopian Ayn-Rand-inspired future. To many Californians breaking up would let them escape what they view as a dystopian present.

http://watchdog.org/142040/greenhut-split-california/