Thread: Arguments Against Idiots: Ramos & Campean

Got this in Glenn Beck newsletter today. ( searched didn't see it)


Arguments against Idiots: Ramos & Compean

August 4, 2008 - 11:07 ET
How to win the argument de jour with logic and facts

The issue:

'Border Agents: Ramos & Compean'

What the liberal whiners say:

1. 'They were rogue cops, who shot an unarmed man in the butt'
2. 'They didn't report the shooting, and made the crime worse by disposing of the shell casings'
3. 'Hey, they were convicted by a jury of their peers'
4. 'The only ones who believe these guys are racist talk radio hosts

Your winning, logical, reasoned arguments:

1. Rogue cops? Ignacio Ramos had been nominated for "Border Agent of the Year" in 2005. Joe Compean, in addition to serving his country in the border patrol, also served honorably in the Navy. There was nothing "rogue" about either one of these agents. As for shooting an "unarmed" man in the back; the only one who says he was unarmed was the drug dealer (Aldrete-Davila) himself, and the prosecutors who gave him immunity to testify. Ramos and Compean maintain to this day, that they saw something shiny in his hand as he turned and pointed toward them. Do you believe a drug cartel mule, who'd been smuggling drugs since he was 14, or two men who'd devoted their lives to protecting their country?

2. The fact that they didn't report the shooting is often cited by U.S. Attorney, Johnny Sutton and repeated often in the press. However, filing a written report is NOT required, and there were 15 agents, including three supervisors on the scene by the end of the incident. It was well known to their supervisors. The disposing of the shell casings was a departmental problem...NOT a crime. A suspension or even dismissal from their positions should have been the harshest punishment they faced; not 11 & 12 YEARS in Federal Prison. No one even KNEW that the illegal alien smuggler had been hit by their fire.

3. Yes, a jury of peers who was told that drug smuggler Aldrete-Davila had never done such a thing before. He was simply trying to raise $2000 for surgery his mother needed, and he didn't even know what he was delivering. The prosecution knew this was a lie, and in fact, after having been given immunity for the drug bust to testify, plus free medical care and unlimited passes across the border, he was caught not once, but TWICE more...with drug loads totaling about a ton. Knowing this, and encouraging him to testify of these lies, the prosecution was guilty of suborning purjury. The witness had NO credibility, and the jury was lied to.

4. It's interesting that so many who hate the Bush Administration and everything it does, including firing eight U.S. Attorneys for political reasons, would now side with that same Bush Justice Department against two Hispanic Americans. Pasty white U.S. Attorney, Johnny Sutton, and his group of Casper the friendly ghost prosecutorial team, viciously went after two Hispanic law enforcement agents, using a gun charge in the commission of a crime statute to force mandatory 10 year federal sentences in this case...but the talk hosts who are fighting so vigorously for these Hispanic agents are somehow racist? Can you explain that to me?


http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articl ... 198/13366/

This case should be retried, and Mr. Sutton and gang: one thing comes to mind, and that is those folks should get a taste of the same medicine they have caused Ramos and Compean to suffer.

the only way this is going to get fixed is to go after the FOOLS at the Top of this pile of DUNG

El Presidente Jorge Boosh
Rogue Attorney Johnny Sutton

It's long past time for Trials in front of the People

4. It's interesting that so many who hate the Bush Administration and everything it does, including firing eight U.S. Attorneys for political reasons, would now side with that same Bush Justice Department against two Hispanic Americans.

Make no mistake about it . I still hate Dubya . He can pardon Scooter but not these agents tells me our president is a real hater of the public , just like his Daddy . Jeb got mad at us down here in FL when we didn't vote to make Spanish the state language . These bushy's are just plain Dictators.
What was allowed to happened to Ramos and Compean is beyond believe. Maybe the Neo-Cons are telling us to leave our own country if we don't like it cause we (Bushes) will do as we please .

Just make sure you have this information at hand. I didn't know about their commendations and their service. Facts are good to have on hand.

The recent Fifth Circuit Court decision nullified the "obstruction of justice" charge against Ramos and Compean, originally made against them for LYING about the incident. However, the voiding of the "obstruction of justice" charge indicates that the agents did NOT lie about the incident, they TOLD the TRUTH! And because of THIS, the REMAINING two charges--assault with a deadly weapon and discharging a firearm in the commission of a felony--should ALSO have been overturned because Ramos and Compean committed NO crime by firing on the drug runner, they were DEFENDING themselves! True, the drug runner WAS injured, but that was HIS fault, NOT that of the agents! This DISPROVES the two remaining charges the court unfairly upheld against Ramos and Compean, so there are NO justifiable grounds for their CONTINUED imprisonment!

The trial of the case was conducted firly and without reversible error,
Yeah Sutton jumped to this, he forgot to do an investigation, but, only took the word of an illegal drug runner, with the mexicos government their, and yet Sutton, failed to tell the jury the TRUTH and the WHOLE TRUTH, and all of what happened, and failed to give the evidence in court.

The fact that they didn't report the shooting is often cited by U.S. Attorney, Johnny Sutton and repeated often in the press. However, filing a written report is NOT required, and there were 15 agents, including three supervisors on the scene by the end of the incident. It was well known to their supervisors. The disposing of the shell casings was a departmental problem...NOT a crime. A suspension or even dismissal from their positions should have been the harshest punishment they faced; not 11 & 12 YEARS in Federal Prison. No one even KNEW that the illegal alien smuggler had been hit by their fire.

Why would you report a "SHOOTING" If you didn't think one occured? In the beginning of all this mess, I thought these two agents weren't sure if they hit him or not. They saw him get away in a waiting vehicle, seemingly okay, then this drug runner shows up a month later with a bullet GRAZE on his butt cheek? Give me a break! One of his homies probably shot him in the a$$ when they found out they could sue these guys as well as OUR government to get more money and weapons for their drug running operations.

What decent drug runner is going to transport drugs in the middle of the desert without being armed? The drug runner WAS armed and probably did bring his weapon up to fire on the BP Agents, but they were quicker on the draw, or his pistol jammed and he decided to turn tail and run.

This whole charade perpetrated by Johnny Sutton for the benefit of the Mexican government is too stupid to believe. Ramos and Compean need to be FREED NOW!

Just the fact that the appeals court judges took 7 months to decide if Ramos and Compean deserved another trial should raise some eyebrows. Was their decision coerced, threatened, or bought? Hmmm.

Originally Posted by tinybobidaho

Just the fact that the appeals court judges took 7 months to decide if Ramos and Compean deserved another trial should raise some eyebrows. Was their decision coerced, threatened, or bought? Hmmm.

Yes...Yes and YES....PROBABLY ALL THREE!