You be the judge. How does this video strike you?
Comments?
(Pay attention to the minister's words)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFj0HdW2iDs
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You be the judge. How does this video strike you?
Comments?
(Pay attention to the minister's words)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFj0HdW2iDs
Whoever is the richest rules the day. Black or white, white or black, it's the rich who are removed from poverty and don't really care about either group.
Human nature doesn't change. Power changes hands throughtout history and the richest win everytime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CCUSA
I totally agree.
I don't think the argument is that abstract. This video is about a rich land that belonged to a people before invaders entered in and raped, pillaged and burned it. Now that the "tables have turned", the video approaches the subject as if these people who benefited from the national exploits are somehow innocent bystanders.Quote:
Originally Posted by CCUSA
The Minister summed it up very nicely. 8)
What you've said reminds me exactly of what the reconquistas are saying vis-a-vis the US except they omit the part of stealing the land from the Native Americans.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
I don't think racism and bigotry are ever justifiable. It's hypocrisy to take the moral and ethical high ground if you practice racism and bigotry. I feel affirmative action is nothing but approved racism. I didn't really see any proof that the government of South Africa was oppressing the white minority. Hopefully ethnic cleansing won't be an aspect of S. Africa's future.
Behold your future if the invasion is not stopped. Most of the blacks now in South Africa were imported from other African countries as cheap labor. There were not that many blacks originally in South Africa. In the Cape Town area the natives had more brown colored skin, they were decimated pretty much the same way American Indians were.
While there may be parallels, the intricate diverging points clearly outweigh addressing the two countries' history as congruent in the scopeQuote:
Originally Posted by Sam-I-am
of invading Europeans.
Agreed.Quote:
I don't think racism and bigotry are ever justifiable. It's hypocrisy to take the moral and ethical high ground if you practice racism and bigotry.
This is a common point brought up by those that have lived "the good life" under either apartheid or Jim Crow. But I don't draw a link betweenQuote:
I feel affirmative action is nothing but approved racism.
apartheid and affirmative action. In the video people were starting businesses and free from the strain of European domination. And naturally the workforce became more reflective of the population.
Neither did I but that didn't stop those people's charges of discrimination.Quote:
I didn't really see any proof that the government of South Africa was oppressing the white minority.
I hope not.Quote:
Hopefully ethnic cleansing won't be an aspect of S. Africa's future.
Forgive me if I don't bow to your obvious superior knowledge of Africa, it's culture and her people. :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowman
But your baseless pontification on the subject is "amazing"! 8O
On the other hand, I did ask for your "thoughts".
I thought at first you were describing Rhodesia/Zimbabwe. The tables have turned there as well. And what an African run communist paradise it has become.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Three points:Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen_Bucks
#1. The name of the country is Zimbabwe. You have had since April 18, 1980 until now to get to learn the name. It has been over 27 years! Why the resistance to calling an African nation by it's name?
#2. Since you exposed your motivation in an almost Euro-textbook fashion, your credibility, with me at least, is worthless. Of course that declaration doesn't carry any weight, but I just thought I'd let you know before you waste your time trying to reply to me.
#3. Not one person mentioned Zimbabwe, either in the video or post comments. Why don't you stick to the subject of this thread?
Moorian!
My brother!
It's funny how, in this post, not one person has managed to spell out the word: apartheid.:lol:
I liked the video.
After viewing it, I don't think there is any reason African Americans and South Africans shouldn't draw stronger ties and work together.
Could it be this simple?
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/b...n/KarmaCop.jpg
Well, I did spend some time in South Africa during the apartheid period, so I had a chance to learn about their history and culture. My point was the white South Africans brought many of the blacks in as cheap expendable labor, the same as what many Americans are doing now with Latino illegal aliens. In the end it didn't work out too well for many of the white South Africans, and the same will happen here if we don't stop illegal immigration. Current Americans will be forced through "affirmative action" and "quotas" to support amnestied illegal aliens and their children, even though most Americans never benefitted from the illegal labor. Just like what is now happening in South Africa.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Yep, that's about it. When I was in SA, most if not all of the white middle class had a black maid and gardner. One of the white business owners comments went like this: "The Asian immigrants make good supervisors and office workers, the blacks are good reliable hard production workers. The problem is the blacks breed like flies". A lot of whites were worried about the end of apartheid, and were looking to move to Australia. Sound familiar?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Who did you learn this history from? The invaders or the Natives?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowman
Were there not people there already? For instance, the KhoiKhoi?Quote:
My point was the white South Africans brought many of the blacks in as cheap expendable labor, the same as what many Americans are doing now with Latino illegal aliens. In the end it didn't work out too well for many of the white South Africans, and the same will happen here if we don't stop illegal immigration.
As far as all the "special treatment" that you allege, I know for a fact that it was one generation ago that many Americans had to deal with Jim Crow, but conveniently, you don't mention or remember that...Quote:
Current Americans will be forced through "affirmative action" and "quotas" to support amnestied illegal aliens and their children, even though most Americans never benefitted from the illegal labor. Just like what is now happening in South Africa.
And BTW, I lived in South Africa for a substantial time.
What is this resistance that you refer to?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
How do you know my motivation? Are you telepathic like the Amazing Kreskin, or something? Please DO NOT put words in my mouth!Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Doesn't Zimbabwe(formerly Rohodesia) border South Africa? Doesn't South Africa currently have a problem with an influx of starving Zimbawean illegal "economic migrants" flooding across the border because of the utterly corrupt, mis-management of Zimbabwe by the totalitarian communist dictator Mugabe? Or did I miss something?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Well, we have to end apartheid for one. And slow down the nuclear arms race, stop terrorism and world hunger. But we can't ignore our social needs either. We have to stop people from abusing the welfare system. We have to provide food and shelter for the homeless and oppose racial discrimination and promote civil rights while also promoting equal rights for women but change the abortion laws to protect the right to life yet still somehow maintain women's freedom of choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimrod
We also have to control the influx of illegal immigrants. We have to encourage a return to traditional moral values and curb graphic sex and violence on TV, in movies, in pop music, everywhere. Most importantly we have to promote general social concern and less materialism in young people.
You may read well but your comprehension is taking a beating! Reread my sentence about the date. Couple that with your response about "Rhodesia", then reconcile that with the statement about 27 years...Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen_Bucks
I didn't need to "put words in your mouth", your limited knowledge of Africa paired with a non-historically justified use of Rhodesia gave you away.Quote:
How do you know my motivation? Are you telepathic like the Amazing Kreskin, or something? Please DO NOT put words in my mouth!
Good boy! It was sho' nice of you for using the term 'formerly Rhodesia', to distinguish between the two. But I still have one contention: who was talking about Zimbabwe in the first place? Stay on subject or perhaps you need to watch the video in the first post again.Quote:
Doesn't Zimbabwe(formerly Rohodesia)...{Snip!}
:lol:
This is sad. Moorian, he wasn't ready!
That poor Mr. Bucks is trying with all of his might to regurgitate all of that "inspired knowledge" to combat you but it is falling flat by the wayside.
Malcolm and Marcus was right! :D
Which party is the invader and which native? Depends on your perspective, right? If you say the whites are the invaders, then do you consider whites in the US are invaders also?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Yes, there were people there already, many of them were black, some were brown. They were all supressed the same way Americans supressed the American Indians. This was a couple hundred years ago, later after the South Africans started mining they decided to import other Africans for mine labor. Is this correct or not? What am I leaving out?Quote:
Were there not people there already? For instance, the KhoiKhoi?
Wasn't this thread about South Africa? Why do you bring up Jim Crow? I was saying we will have to give affirmative action to amnestied illegal aliens and their kids. I said nothing about black Americans. What is you point?Quote:
As far as all the "special treatment" that you allege, I know for a fact that it was one generation ago that many Americans had to deal with Jim Crow, but conveniently, you don't mention or remember that...
There are two groups of non-whites in South Africa, the original inhabitants who I compare to American Indians, and the imported black and Asian workers who are similar to our legal and illegal (mainly Latino) immigrants today. I was not comparing either of the groups to black Americans.
What years did you live there? I was there for one month in 1985.Quote:
And BTW, I lived in South Africa for a substantial time.
South African govt threatens to take land from "abusive" farmers
JOHANNESBURG (AFP) — South Africa's agriculture ministry caused a flurry of disquiet among the country's farmers this week by threatening those who mistreat their workers with land expropriation.
"We are obviously disturbed by the persistent reports of abuses on farms," Agriculture and Land Affairs Minister Lulu Xingwana told a national conference in Johannesburg on Thursday of the Food and Allied Workers Union that represents farm workers.
"This is in keeping with the law of the land: for those people who are not keeping (within) the law, the government has the right to expropriate."
Land reform and redistribution are sensitive topics in a country where the minority white population still owns the vast majority of land -- a relic of oppressive colonial and apartheid policies.
Xingwana came out in support of her deputy minister, Dirk du Toit, who was criticised by opposition parties for having referred in parliament the previous day to a lingering "medieval" attitude among farmers.
"My deputy minister knows what he is talking about," Xingwana told the conference.
In response to a question about farmers who lay off and evict workers unlawfully, Du Toit told MPs on Wednesday: "Those people who don't want to hear, we are not only going to take them to court, we are going to also take their land away from them."
This drew a sharp response from the country's largest farmers' union, Agri SA, which claims a membership of 30,000.
"Since the beginning of the year not a single case of illegal farm eviction has come to Agri SA's attention. Our conclusion is therefore that the Deputy Minister also regards legal evictions as unfair", it said in a statement.
Agri SA said it would raise its objections with President Thabo Mbeki and demand a clarification or retraction.
"Let them write a letter to the president and let's discuss the issue," the president's spokesman Mukoni Ratshitanga said on Friday.
The main opposition Democratic Alliance has slammed Du Toit's statement as racist for implying that all white farmers abuse their workers.
"As a senior member of the (ruling) ANC, he (Du Toit) stood up and made racist remarks about white farmers, insinuating that all of them assault their farm workers," the party's land affairs spokesman Maans Nel told parliament on Thursday.
"What sort of message are these senior people of the ANC sending out to farmers who are overwhelmingly positive about land reform and South Africa?"
Hostility is rife in South Africa's farming sector, with concern about rural crime and farmer murders on the one hand, and complaints of ill treatment of farm workers, mostly black and coloured (of mixed race) on the other.
"There are serious tensions," Xingwana said in January.
Some white farmers fear they are the political targets of farm murders, 86 of which were reported in the past financial year.
And farm workers often complain of ill treatment by farmers whom they accuse of impounding their livestock, refusing to allow them to bury their family members on farms, or demolishing their homes.
Mbeki's government aims to redistribute 30 percent of the country's agricultural land to blacks by 2014.
But the pace has been criticised as too slow by many. Some critics fear that growing impatience among landless blacks could cause a repeat of the violent land grabs in neighbouring Zimbabwe in which more than 4,000 white farmers were ousted at the turn of the century, causing a dramatic downturn in agricultural production.
The South African authorities do admit that threats of expropriation have had beneficial effects, with land owners being more inclined to accept the government's price offer for their properties.
"These farmers have become more supportive because we are cracking the whip," the country's chief land claims commissioner Tozi Gwanya told AFP last year.
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gIl ... 5oKynqHWMw
===============================================
It looks like the communist ANC is running things rather nicely for themselves. I wouldn't be at all surprised if South Africa changed its name in the future to Lumumba, or some such. Will starvation soon follow as it has in the former Zimbabwe? Only time will tell...
Have you lost your mind, young man? Africa has always been the native land of Africans! Dutch Boers and Brits are not native to South Africa!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowman
Please read Post number 7 in this thread...Quote:
If you say the whites are the invaders, then do you consider whites in the US are invaders also?
The whole coast, down and around the Cape, had trade with the Arabs and the Indians. Kiswahili has many borrowed words from their interactions. No doubt, some merchants set up shop in Africa and started families. And so on...Quote:
Yes, there were people there already, many of them were black, some were brown.
Are you talking about those invades that we call Boers? The British?Quote:
They were all supressed the same way Americans supressed the American Indians.
I think the operative word is 'oppress' instead of 'suppress'.
OK... Most, for sure, came with the legal permission of SA.Quote:
This was a couple hundred years ago, later after the South Africans started mining they decided to import other Africans for mine labor.
You are correct in one sense. You didn't state that it was a couple hundred years ago.Quote:
Is this correct or not? What am I leaving out?
Because I don't see any difference between Jim Crow and apartheid. Do you have a better definition?Quote:
Wasn't this thread about South Africa? Why do you bring up Jim Crow?
False. In Texas, Hispanics are considered white. Back in the '40s they were allowed to go to white schools under the Treaty of Guadalupe. In the prison system they are counted as white so "the system" can say that they are arresting just as many whites as blacks. When in fact, they are arresting Latinos. I am in law enforcement, I know what I'm talking about.Quote:
I was saying we will have to give affirmative action to amnestied illegal aliens and their kids.
I made a definitive comparison between Africans on both "sides of the pond". American Indians to me are of no comparison.Quote:
I said nothing about black Americans. What is you point?
I see your point. Please read Post Number 7 in this thread really carefully.Quote:
There are two groups of non-whites in South Africa, the original inhabitants who I compare to American Indians, and the imported black and Asian workers who are similar to our legal and illegal (mainly Latino) immigrants today. I was not comparing either of the groups to black Americans.
I lived there from 80-83, 88-89, 94-95Quote:
What years did you live there? I was there for one month in 1985.
So then, you are in league with the ANC minister. The ANC: a communist organization. May I remind you that communism is the most lethal ideology the planet has ever seen with the deaths of upwards of 100 million last century. And you are on their side, backing these mass murderers. What's next for you? A youtube video love letter from Pol Pot? Championing Adolf Hitler next, are you? Have you no shame?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Look whose now putting words in people's mouth! :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen_Bucks
I am a man of precision. If someone that I personally don't like, happens to say something I agree with, then so be it. That doesn't make me a card carrier or a cheerleader.
Owen Bucks, you are out of your league; I knew it from the first time you posted in this thread.
Unless you have something constructive, I will not abide your silly posts!
Good day!
(Just an assumption)
HAHAHAHAHAHA! :lol:
The words you cannot use on ALIPAC is expressed on Youtube!
Give me a break!
If you want a raw convo, PM me! 8)
The English, the English and the English.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowman
They thought they could pull off what Alexander the Great did. They messed around in India, South Africa, Australia, The Middle East, France, Scotland, Ireland, Canada, the US, Hong Kong... Every time they stuck their imperialistic noses in, it's become a disaster for the recipient country.
They are the worst invaders of modern time. Not only that, they consumed irreplaceable resources like the Tigers in India, looted treasures like the Star of India Diamond, and they took every national treasure they could get their hands on like the Rosetta Stone, pieces of the Parthenon...
Dixie
Did you ever do the Argus Tour bicycle ride? It is the largest organized bike ride in the world. The hardest part is learning to ride on the left side of the road!Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/b...nedict_XV1.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Dixie
No, I never had the pleasure. :cry:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowman
First you post a link about impoverished whites in S.Africa. These are the same ones who willingly gave up control of the government peacefully to communists. Next you gloat over their suffering. Then you tell me it is VERBOTEN to mention the former Rhodesia. Next you praise a known communist. Then you invite me to engage in an expletive filled private posting match, I suppose because the fallacy that was your argument has became rather apparent.
If black South African communists(of which you are enamoured) adopt the Zimbabwean collectivist agriculture model, which border will the hungry black people next cross to escape starvation?
"If someone that I personally don't like, happens to say something I agree with, then so be it." is equivilent to saying that Hitler wasn't all bad becasue he made the trains run on time.
I recognize a spanked man when I see one. You are flailing your arms trying to grasp onto somthing that will sustain your argument. It hasn't happened yet, so I will bow out of talking to you, unless you have something to say that is of importance to the topic at hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen_Bucks
PS
(Hint: Start a topic about Zimbabwe if you want me to talk about Zimbabwe)
Just my 2 cents, but it was Mussolini that had the reputation for making the trains run on time... 8O
(According to Snopes, this is a false statement as well... :wink: )
There are parallels that's for certain. But some of these Afrikaaners (or whatever they call themselves) families have been in S. Africa for hundreds of years. I suppose they could all be deported, but then, of course, Europe could respond in kind.
Neither did I but that didn't stop those people's charges of discrimination.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
I hope not.[/quote:3tqvl182]Quote:
Hopefully ethnic cleansing won't be an aspect of S. Africa's future.
It just seemed to me that the Afrikaaners were asking for affirmative action that's why I brought it up.
If we're going to trade atrocities maybe we should mention the slavery the Egyptians imposed on the Jews for thousands of years, or maybe the fact that the pyramids were all built on slave labor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Do you think De Beers and all of the other Euopean interests would leave Africa without a fight?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam-I-am
Come clean Sam!
Listen, I've never, in public, passed judgment on European treatment of people by other European people, even though I might think they are wrong. When Hitler murdered 6 million Russians that happened to practice Judaism, did you ever see me bring up an atrocity of that magnitude?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam-I-am
Anne Frank and the rest murdered in Europe were actually a Russian stock of people. Not really Jews.
Look at this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews
Jews are an African people.
Here's something that would shake your little Euro-mind:
DNA Evidence
http://www.uoregon.edu/~jbloom/race/general/lemba.htm
Here's more if you need it...
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/israel/familylemba.html
And to back that up...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habesha_people
Sam, if you respond without having read the links, how can we have a discussion on the facts?
Didn't Nigeria nationalize it's oil reserves? I'm not positive if it was Nigeria. South Africa could simply nationalize the De Beers industry, unilaterally. This might not be a bad idea either. After all, what the hell has De Beers ever done for the African people?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFomorian
Sam,
You didn't think I was going to "let you off the hook" that easily, did you?
I answered 2 different points in two different posts.
It's been over 1 hour and you have not answered in the same fashion.
I will give you more time to "digest" the material before you reply.
Karma Police
is one of my all time favorite songs ever, performed by one of my fav groups Radio Head
Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LeLAELIxKY
"This is what you'll get when you mess with us!"
"For a minute... I lost myself! I lost myself!"
I'm glad the hispanics are taking over and getting rid of that evil language: English. What did they ever give us except for "Presumption of Innocence".Quote:
Originally Posted by Dixie