Thread: "Jobs Americans Won't Do" again.....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100927/ap_ ... ion_jobs_4

Despite economy, Americans don't want farm work


By GARANCE BURKE, Associated Press Writer Garance Burke, Associated Press Writer – Mon Sep 27, 11:57 am ET
VISALIA, Calif. – As the economy tanked during the past two years, a debate has raged over whether immigrants are taking jobs that Americans want. Here, amid the sweltering vineyards of the largest farm state, the answer is no.

Most Americans simply don't apply for jobs harvesting fruits and vegetables in California, where one of every eight people is out of work, according to government data for a federal seasonal farmworker program analyzed by The Associated Press.

And the few unemployed Americans who apply through official channels usually don't stay on in the fields, a point comedian Stephen Colbert — dressed as a field hand — has alluded to in recent broadcasts on Comedy Central.

"It's just not something that most Americans are going to pack up their bags and move here to do," said farmer Steve Fortin, who pays $10.25 an hour to foreign workers to trim strawberry plants for six weeks each summer at his nursery near the Nevada border. He has spent $3,000 this year ensuring domestic workers have first dibs on his jobs in the sparsely populated stretch of the state, advertising in newspapers and on an electronic job registry.

But he hasn't had any takers, and only one farmer in the state hired anyone using a little-known, little-used program to hire foreign farmworkers the legal way — by applying for guest worker visas.

Since January, California farmers have posted ads for 1,160 farmworker positions open to U.S. citizens and legal residents seeking work.

Only 233 people applied after being linked with the jobs through unemployment offices in California, Texas, Nevada and Arizona. One grower brought on 36 U.S citizens or legal permanent residents. No one else hired any.


"It surprises me, too, but we do put the information out there for the public," said Lucy Ruelas, who manages the California Employment Development Department's agricultural services unit. "If an applicant sees the reality of the job, they might change their mind."

The California figures represent a small sample of efforts to recruit domestic workers under the H-2A Guest Worker Program, but they provide a snapshot of how hard it is to lure Americans to farm labor — and to get growers to use the program.

Fortin is one of just 23 of the estimated 40,900 full-time farmers and ranchers in California who petitioned this year to bring in foreign farmworkers through legal means, the government data showed. The Labor Department did not respond to a request for comment about the findings.

More than half of farmworkers in the United States are illegal immigrants, according to the Labor Department, and another fourth of them were born outside the country. Proponents of tougher immigration laws — as well as the United Farm Workers of America — say farmers are used to a cheap, largely undocumented work force, and say if growers raised wages and improved working conditions, the jobs would attract Americans.

So far, a tongue-in-cheek effort by Colbert and the UFW to get Americans to take farm jobs has been more effective in attracting applicants than the official channels.

The UFW in June launched the "Take Our Jobs Campaign," inviting people to go online and apply.

About 8,600 people filled out an application form, but only 7 have been placed in farm jobs, UFW President Arturo Rodriguez said.

Colbert joked to a House Congressional committee Friday that spending a day picking beans in upstate New York for an episode was "really, really hard."

Colbert's comedic activism makes a point Fortin is familiar with. Some Americans referred for jobs at his nursery couldn't to do the grueling work.

"A few years ago when domestic workers were referred here, we saw absentee problems, and we had people asking for time off after they had just started," he said. "Some were actually planting the plants upside down."

Economists have long argued over whether local workers would take jobs in the field if wages rose. Philip Martin, a professor of agricultural and resource economics at the University of California, Davis, said because so few farmers participate in the H-2A program, the data's limitations make it hard to draw national conclusions. Under current conditions, the figures show the work force will remain almost entirely immigrant, he said.

"Recruitment of U.S. workers in this program doesn't work well primarily because employers have already identified who they want to bring in from abroad," Martin said. "I don't think a lot of U.S. workers are going out there looking for a seasonal job paying the minimum wage or a dollar more."

The Labor Department collects the same data about H-2A visa applications for all 50 states, but does not make it publicly available. In response to a Freedom of Information Act request from AP, the agency said it would provide some records for nearly $11,000, but it was not clear whether the information would show how many Americans had applied for farm labor jobs nationwide.

Even California officials say the guest worker program needs fixing, despite a reform effort announced in February by Labor Secretary Hilda Solis meant to boost efforts to fill crop-picking jobs first with domestic workers.

Benjamin Reynosa, who was picking ruby-colored grapes in 90-degree heat near Fowler Friday morning, said he often is the only U.S. legal resident on seasonal crews. He said most people hear about the jobs through word of mouth or signs tacked outside rural stores, not the electronic registry.

"I've been working in agriculture for 22 years and I can tell you there are very few gringos out here," said Reynosa, 49, of Orange Cove, said. "If people know English, they go to work in packinghouses or sit in an office."

In Tulare County, where the unemployment rate is above 16 percent, job seekers on a recent morning crowded around computers at the job development agency. Staff appeared unaware the guest worker program required them to advertise the jobs.

"We just don't advertise those kinds of farmworker jobs," said Sandi Miller, program coordinator for the county's work force investment board.

Amid the U.S. Army flyers posted in the lobby, however, under the heading "HOT JOB LEADS" was an ad for a farmworker position, preferring someone with Spanish fluency and tractor maintenance skills.

Miller said later it was the first she had seen such a notice. She hadn't received any applications, she said.

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Do you think farm businesses that use undocumented workers should be punished?
Vote now 83%Yes, 17%No.

The illegals seem content to hang out at Home Depot and do jobs that Americans WILL do.

This article is mostly biased, but actually does give some of our side....But for some reason, still decided to go with the extremely slanted and inaccurate title. From this very article you can see agricultural economist Phillip Martin explain why the jobs aren't being taken by Americans still -- the wages are still too low for the jobs to be attractive to Americans, and not enough agricultural employers take part in programs seeking Americans. Also, it says that most these jobs depend on "word of mouth" notification for applicants, while most Americans apply for jobs online, the jobs do not have electronic aplications. The unemployment centers said they did not know about these jobs. And some of them require Spanish fluency!!!!

Bottum line is: The illegals need to be gone from these proffessions before we can fairly and accuratey determine whether American will do them. No more competition with Third World wages and conditions. As long as illegals are in these fields it is HIGHLY inaccurate to say Americans will not do them.

Oh, and please vote in the poll:


Do you think farm businesses that use undocumented workers should be punished?
Vote now

83% Yes

17% No

What they fail to state is the working conditions for English speaking Americans in these jobs. How many times have people told me about the harrassment that Americans get when trying to work along side Hispanics. This doesn't just apply to jobs in agriculture, but in canneries and in construction. Jobs that Americans have done for years. I have heard over and over from Americans the treatment they receive. The illegals want these jobs for their compadre's and once they have a foothold in an industry they do everything they can to make it so uncomfortable for Americans that they end up quitting.

They have the numbers, the rudeness, foreign language and intimidation on their side. If Americans stand up for theirselves they are called racists. Until our politican step back and see the true picture of what is going on and listen to Americans in the workplace, rather than the illegals sob stories, nothing will change.

Ditto that Monterey Sherry!

There are NO jobs that Americans won't do. end of story. But to work alongside illegals is quite literally taking your life into your hands - risking your life. Anybody who denies this fact is either an ignorant fool or has an agenda.

Some of the comments below the article:

This article should read: Despite all the taxpayer support to farmers over the years and booming agricultural profits, farmers are unwilling to hire their American neighbors and pay living wages.

I want one of these jobs, can someone give me a ride to cali? I am an american ,born and raised,and I make less than an honest wage now. I don't have the cash to get out to cali but if someone is willing to buy me a bus ride then I will give it my best.

There are plenty of people, many of them students, in the East that would be willing to do this. The problem is getting the labor at point A to the farms at point B on the other side of the nation economically.

http://billingsgazette.com/news/state-a ... 03286.html

I did not post the full article because it has a heavy duty copyright claim and other restrictions at the bottom.

There is a federal grant program that teaches children of migrant workers, which makes the pay for the migrant workers worth more than it would be for an American. This program costs (in this town in this article) about $70K to teach about 300 children and $400 million is earmarked annually for the migrant children program.

Now, if that $400 million were divided up and paid to Americans in addition to the $10 or so per hour paid to work on the farm, I'll bet it would approach a living wage.

http://www.pbs.org/now/politics/migrants.html

1.3M migrant workers into $400M is $307.00 each.

The article says US citizens, which I find odd given everyone claims Americans won't do the work.

Originally Posted by Watson

http://www.pbs.org/now/politics/migrants.html

1.3M migrant workers into $400M is $307.00 each.

The article says US citizens, which I find odd given everyone claims Americans won't do the work.

From the Cesar Chavez part of the article:

In recent years surplus labor has eroded the UFW's gains and today few farm workers are organized.

"Jobs Americans won't do," and "labor shortage," YEAH RIGHT. As it says, illegals are surplus labor. Which is obvious in our economy with stagnated wages and health care coverage and pensions disappearing. This surplus labor has killed Chavez's union. How "progressive' for liberals to defend the union busting of a hispanic civil rights hero. How "economically profound" for free marketeers to claim we have a labor shortage.