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  1. #1
    Senior Member Brian503a's Avatar
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    Chicago: Chaos ends immigration debate before it starts

    http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?sectio ... id=4144639

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    Chaos ends immigration debate before it startsPolice clear church to maintain order
    By Karen Jordan
    May 4, 2006 - Chaos at a Chicago church Thursday night cancelled a planned debate on immigration before it started. It got so out of control that dozens of police officers stepped in. One person was arrested for disorderly conduct.

    The Logan Square church had planned to facilitate a debate on both sides of the immigration reform issue, with the Minutemen and the Illinois Coalition of Immigrant Rights. But the coalition backed out Wednesday night out of concern that the meeting would turn violent. There was no violence. But there was a lot of shouting and yelling before the meeting even got started.

    "This is America. We're supposed to have two sides whether we like the other side or not," said Rev. Dan Wood, 4th Congregational Church.

    Wood said his original plan was to bring together both sides of the immigration reform debate. But when the minutemen was the only group represented, the forum was over before it began. Supporters of immigration rights began shouting at organizers of the event and at the spokesperson for the Minutemen, Rosanna Pulido.

    Before the event started, immigration rights supporters rallied outside of the church saying the Minutemen stance on illegal immigration is racist.

    "Inviting the Minutemen into this community is like inviting the KKK into a largely black community," said Rehada Khan, anti-Minuteman defendants.

    Tempers flared in the church.

    "This is domestic terrorism," said one anti-Minutemen individual.

    "Neither side was really heard. The police had to clear out the church but not before one more confrontation.

    "Anarchists and communists. There is an alliance between communists and anarchists and the pro-immigration lobbyists," said Pulido.

    Many were escorted out of the church by the police. There was reportedly only we one arrest.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Brian503a's Avatar
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    http://cbs2chicago.com/seenon/local_sto ... 05305.html

    May 4, 2006 10:05 pm US/Central

    Unruly Crowd Shuts Down Immigration Debate
    One Person Was Arrested


    (CBS) CHICAGO The immigration battle heated up in Chicago Thursday night as demonstrators on both sides of the issue exchanged words in a Logan Square standoff.

    It was supposed to be a debate between the anti-immigration reform Minutemen and immigration reform supporters at the Fourth Congregational Church.

    CBS 2’s Alita Guillen reports the entire event was shut down before it really began.

    The event only lasted about 10 minutes because it got so out of control. Police broke up the debate before any issues were even discussed.

    Church leaders had hoped to hold a debate on immigration reform by bringing together opposing groups: The Illinois Minuteman Project and the Illinois Coalition for Immigrant Refugee Rights.

    But fearing for their safety, the Coalition backed out and encouraged those who were thinking about attending the debate to avoid the event.

    “It became pretty obvious to us that this was going to be a circus. This wasn't going to be a chance to really sit down and talk about the issues,” said Gabe Gonzalez with the Illinois Coalition for Immigrant Refugee Rights.

    “We don’t need reform. We need enforcement of our current law,” said Evert Evertsen with the Minutemen Project.

    Organizers decided to hold a question and answer forum anyway. Instead, they got chaos. It’s more proof that immigration reform is as heated an issue on the streets of Chicago as it is in Washington.

    “I would have thought in the house of God we wouldn't have had this problem,” said Rev. Dan Wood.

    In the end, it was a disappointing night for just about everyone after what started off as a peaceful service quickly turned to a free-for-all at the Fourth Congregational Church.

    Emotions ran high inside the church, and Chicago police escorted an unruly man out just minutes after the National Anthem was sung.

    “My daughter-in-law speaks better Spanish than you two do,” he said.

    Tensions were even higher outside the church.

    “They should learn how to respect the house of God,” said Pastor Onex Rosado.

    In the end, one person was arrested for criminal trespass.

    The church actually organized the event, and the people behind it were extremely disappointed. When asked if they would consider a different type of forum, they say at this time they are stunned but not giving up on bringing the two sides together.
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  3. #3
    Administrator ALIPAC's Avatar
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    No respect for our laws. No respect for the civic process. No respect for the 1st amendment. No respect for the house of God. No respect for holy ground.

    Anarchist, socialists, illegal aliens all working together.

    W
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  4. #4
    Super Moderator Newmexican's Avatar
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    Again, the definition of domestic terrorism from the US Code
    US Code 802, Section 2331 Read sction 5
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/ ... -000-.html


    TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 113B > § 2331 Prev | Next

    § 2331. Definitions


    Release date: 2005-08-03

    As used in this chapter—
    (1) the term “international terrorism” means activities that—
    (A) involve violent acts or acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State, or that would be a criminal violation if committed within the jurisdiction of the United States or of any State;
    (B) appear to be intended—
    (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
    (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
    (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
    (C) occur primarily outside the territorial jurisdiction of the United States, or transcend national boundaries in terms of the means by which they are accomplished, the persons they appear intended to intimidate or coerce, or the locale in which their perpetrators operate or seek asylum;
    (2) the term “national of the United States” has the meaning given such term in section 101(a)(22) of the Immigration and Nationality Act;
    (3) the term “person” means any individual or entity capable of holding a legal or beneficial interest in property;
    (4) the term “act of war” means any act occurring in the course of—
    (A) declared war;
    (B) armed conflict, whether or not war has been declared, between two or more nations; or
    (C) armed conflict between military forces of any origin; and

    THIS SECTION

    (5) the term “domestic terrorism” means activities that—
    (A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;
    (B) appear to be intended—
    (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
    (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
    (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
    (C) occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States.
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  5. #5

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    Agreed but I also have to say Rev. Dan Wood was a moron for thinking it could be debated peacefully. I do not understand what he hoped to accomplish. It was not going to change the national viewpoint. And if he thought it would educate people that was a mistake as well. A debate is a war of words and ideals. Rarely is it educational on the issues themselves. If anything is to be learned from it, it is only which person is the best with words. I think of debates as contests.

  6. #6
    Administrator ALIPAC's Avatar
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    I don't think he is a moron for expecting people to act civilized instead of like a pack of wild animals.

    He was just doing things the American way. Now he has become educated to the darkness we face growing on our streets.

    W
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  7. #7
    Senior Member Brian503a's Avatar
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    Looks like the police are getting ready for more trouble this weekend.

    http://www.rrstar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art ... /105050035

    Published: May 5, 2006

    Local News: Rockford
    Police prep for Minuteman protest

    By Mike Wiser
    ROCKFORD REGISTER STAR

    ROCKFORD — Police will shut down an eight-block area of downtown Saturday and the Rockford Public Library will close for the day in anticipation of a possible protest to an anti-illegal-immigration group.

    The Illinois Minuteman Project, a state chapter of the group best known for posting volunteer border patrols in southwestern states, has scheduled a town hall meeting from 1 to 5 p.m. in the Rockford Public Library’s auditorium.

    The group has distributed 125 tickets for the meeting, and only those people with tickets will be admitted.

    Law enforcement authorities will accommodate protesters, with limitations.

    Rockford Deputy Police Chief Theo Glover said officers will block off an area bounded by Jefferson and State streets, the Rock River and Church Street. The area will be closed to vehicle and pedestrian traffic.

    Police will direct protesters, if any show up, to a staging area in the parking lot directly across from the library where they can rally.

    It’s still not known how many might show up. Julio Salgado, the primary organizer of the recent pro-immigrant marches in the Rock River Valley, did not return calls Thursday.

    Last Sunday, Salgado said two options were being considered for the arrival of the Minuteman group: either ignore the group’s gathering or show up “with more than 3,000 people.”

    Glover said that based on conversations with the Salgado and others, he anticipates some type of showing but has no firm number.

    Nonetheless, Glover said, extra police have been called in for duty.

    “I don’t want to say a number, but we’ll be prepared,” he said.

    A spokeswoman for the Rockford Public Library, Emily Kicklighter, said the library will be closed Saturday at the request of law enforcement officials.

    Thursday, a petition with 600 to 650 names was sent to library Executive Director Frank Novak asking the library not to allow the Minuteman Project to host the meeting, Kicklighter said.

    “Part of the mission of the library is a free and open dialogue,” she said. “We don’t discriminate against political views.”

    Evert Evertsen, Minuteman membership coordinator, said that if there is a protest, the message to town hall meeting attendees will be the same as always.

    “We just ignore them,” he said. “Simple as that.”

    Evertsen said the group has come to expect friction when it hosts meetings.

    “The anarchists, the communists and the socialists all see us as their opposition,” he said. “They’re opposed to the one weapon we have, knowledge. We don’t have a political agenda; we just want the government to enforce the laws they have on the books.”

    The group also routinely finds support, he said.

    The 125 tickets to the Saturday event were taken in 11 days, he said. Based on that, past experience and the number of inquiries the Minuteman Project has received, Evertsen said, he expects a Rockford chapter of the Illinois group to start up soon.

    “For sure,” he said. “I can guarantee it.”

    Staff writer Mike Wiser can be reached at 815-987-1377 or mwiser@rrstar.com.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Brian503a's Avatar
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    http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?sectio ... id=4147354

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    Leader of local Minutemen no stranger to protest
    By Chuck Goudie
    May 5, 2006 - The immigration debate heated up at a church on Chicago's Northwest Side Thursday night. In the middle of the shouting match were the Illinois Minutemen, a group against illegal immigration. The head of that group is no stranger to public protest.

    Chaos ends immigration debate before it starts
    The founder of the Illinois Minutemen is a woman. Her name is Rosanna Pulido, and even though she lives in Rockford, she spends much of her free time in metro Chicago stirring up the melting pot of immigration. The Minutemen want illegal immigrants out and US borders secured so more can't get in.
    You may have seen Pulido on the ABC7 news Thursday night in a volatile immigration face-off on the northwest side. What was supposed to be a neighborhood immigration discussion became a yelling contest when only the Illinois Minutemen showed up, leading into the war of words by the group's founder, the daughter of Mexican-American Parents.

    "I accepted the invitation. So did the other side. And not last week did they pull out, they pulled out last night. I think that is inconsiderate," said Pulido.


    Pulido, who turns 50 next week, was raised in Wrigleyville, and now runs a senior citizen transportation service. A year ago, she spent a few days with national Minutemen along the Arizona-Mexico border that has become a sieve for illegal immigrants. The former 9-1-1 operator returned home to form the Illinois Minutemen, aimed at keeping Chicago from becoming "a sanctuary city."

    "If you read the Minutemen's standard operating procedures, we're courteous with everyone, we cooperate with all law enforcement and we don't discriminate against anyone for any reason. And if you violate those procedures, you're not a Minuteman anymore," Pulido said.

    Pulida cut her political teeth as an election coordinator for the National Rifle Association. She is a familiar figure at counter-liberal protests. She dressed as the Statue of Liberty outside a Hillary Clinton event in 2003, among protesters accusing Senator Clinton of being a liar and guilty of treason. Her Illinois Minutemen, she claims now 450 strong, has clashed with free immigration supporters and local police on several occasions the past six months.

    The Minutemen want US officials to crackdown on illegal immigrants, drug dealers and terrorists who come across our borders, and they want politicians who won't stop the influx to be voted out of office. Leaders of the national organization, called the Minutemen Civil Defense Corps, say that they now have 120,000 members.

    To supporters, this is a group of patriotic Americans who want to keep America strong. Detractors equate the Minutemen with The Ku Klux Klan, intent on splitting families and segregating communities. But until the immigration issues are sorted out, the Minutemen and the woman who leads them in Illinois, say they will exert political pressure and exact public protest to retake the borders.
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  9. #9

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    People who want to secure our borders are equated with the KKK??? That's quite a stretch.

    People who want legal immigration are rascists??? Another stretch.

    Now...how on earth can these folks who want to break our laws on a daily basis expect those same laws to protect them?? I can't figure that one out.

    MJ

  10. #10
    Senior Member Brian503a's Avatar
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    It appears the police kept this meeting from getting out of hand.

    http://www.rrstar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art ... /105060036

    Published: May 6, 2006

    Local News
    Few protesters greet small crowd at Minuteman meeting

    By Mike Wiser
    Rockford Register Star

    ROCKFORD — Blocked off and barricaded, downtown Rockford was practically empty Saturday, if one wasn’t counting cops.

    For about two weeks, police had planned for keeping order in the event that a scheduled town hall meeting of the Illinois Minuteman Project at the Rockford Public Library would be met with protesters, possibly numbering into the hundreds or, even, thousands.

    Hours before the meeting started just after its scheduled start time of 1 p.m., police swept the area with a bomb-sniffing dog, pulled a mobile command vehicle near the library, shut down streets and stationed their officers as well as some from the Rockford Park District, the Illinois State Police and the Winnebago County Sheriff’s Department in and around the perimeter.

    They needn’t have worried.

    Maybe a dozen protesters showed up, making the ratio of police officer to protester about three-or-four-to-one.

    On the flip side, the Minuteman Project meeting in the library’s auditorium attracted about 60 people.

    The showing was much more than the protester contingent, but still below expectations, according to Illinois Minuteman Project Director Rosanna Pulido who said the group had over 300 requests for tickets to the event that was limited to 140 spots.

    Pulido said turnout wasn’t necessarily the point.

    “What’s important is we’re getting people involved ... and I hope that every one here talks to two people about what they heard here,” Pulido said.

    What they heard is that immigration, legal and illegal, into the United States will strain our natural and financial resources if left unchecked.

    “Wanting to limit the number of people coming into the country is no more anti-immigrant than a couple who decides to have only two children is anti-child,” said keynote speaker Dave Gorak, executive director of the Midwest Coalition to Reduce Immigration.

    Gorak played a video of Roy Beck of Numbers USA, a group that lobbies for stricter immigration quotas in the United States.

    Like Beck, Gorak said any anger people feel toward immigrants is misdirected. That anger should be directed at politicians in charge of making policy.

    One such politician on hand was Jim Oberweis, a dairy owner and investment manager who has run for both the United States Senate and the Governor’s office.

    “The public focus is shifting and there’s no easy solution,” said Oberweis, who said he came to Rockford because of his friendship with Pulido.

    He said he supports much of the Sensenbrenner bill — the piece of legislation sponsored by F. James Sensenbrenner, the Milwaukee area Republican, that has been a rallying point for marchers across the country — although, he says, it still needs further work.

    “I think there needs to be clarification on parts like how making illegal status a felony would make churches who help illegals felons,” Oberweis said.

    “That’s not the intent, the intent is to go after these coyotes (a person who shepherds illegals across the border) and human smugglers.”

    Paul Klein, a Minuteman from Des Plaines, said he believed the group found a receptive audience in Rockford and hoped it would get more people involved.

    Which, Pulido said, is the focus of the movement.

    “Shame on you if you vote in November and don’t know what the candidate’s stance on immigration is,” Pulido said, as she encouraged the gathering to apply pressure to elected officials.

    “We have to get up off our couches and do something,” she said.

    Meanwhile, finding something to do probably occupied the time of the police stationed around the downtown Saturday.

    Rockford Deputy Police Chief Theo Glover didn’t know the exact number, but said there were “over 30” officers called in to work the area Saturday. He said police did turn some people away who were not there specifically to protest or if they wanted to get into the Minuteman meeting without tickets.

    He said police did not know exactly how many people intended to show up because the organizers themselves did not know going into the weekend.

    “It may look bad,” Glover said, noting there were a lot of police with little to do.

    “But on the other side of the coin, we know this is a passionate issue for both sides. We wanted to make sure we were prepared for anything and we were.”


    Staff writer Mike Wiser can be reached at 815-987-1377 or mwiser@rrstar.com
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