Thread: Doofus: Exaggerating Illegal Immigration

Exaggerating Illegal Immigration

There are perhaps twelve million people in the United States today who are working here without the legal right to do so. This figure represents less than four percent of the US population of about 305,000. Yet, if you look around at the news media and online sources, you will find that most of our nation’s problems are being blamed on this group of people.

Every mention of a poor economy, of overcrowding in our cities, of the poor unemployment rate, of our lack or resources for health care, and so on, are blamed on these 12 million people. They supposedly use all of our resources, cause all of our crime, and are major users of our public services. If you are to believe the folks who make these claims, the solution to all of our nation’s problems would be to exclude the undocumented aliens from US jobs.

There are problems with that notion, though. For example, a recent National Public Radio report related the story of a town in Iowa where it has had to reduce operations drastically because of an immigration raid took away 10% of the town’s population, including half the workers at the plant. The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the jobs being done by these undocumented workers are those jobs that were unfilled by US citizens. The US has traditionally increased it’s labor force through immigration. The current administration has artificially reduced immigration targets. this leaves employers with few choices for filling their needs.

I am not in favor of illegal immigration. We will have to accept immigration as a given, though. as long as policies for how many may enter the US legally are not realistic. In other words, the solution to our “problemâ€

If you add in dependent anchor baby minors and quasi legals (those working foreigners who have the right to live but not to work here as dependents of cilitens and legal immigrants) then the much quoted Bear Stearns estimate of twenty million has some validity. It will not be long however before the galloping alarmists from CAPS throw out the inflated figure of 38 to 40 million on this thread.


It becomes difficult to make a tight argument against illegal immigration when the extent is clearly mis stated xenophobically as though every foreign born person in the Unted States is an illegal alien.

I know of no one who is looking for a job who couldn’t get it because the place was taken by an illegal immigrant. I am still looking for a case where someone can truthfully say that they want a job, but cannot have it because an illegal immigrant has taken it. I would challenge anyone to provide me with a specific example.

Howard Industries in Mississippi comes to mind.

Every mention of a poor economy, of overcrowding in our cities, of the poor unemployment rate, of our lack or resources for health care, and so on, are blamed on these 12 million people. They supposedly use all of our resources, cause all of our crime, and are major users of our public services. If you are to believe the folks who make these claims, the solution to all of our nation’s problems would be to exclude the undocumented aliens from US jobs.

That 12 million figure was from 10 years ago, but liberals STILL persist on using it. It's more like 20-40 million now, plus their anchor babies, so let's say 50 MILLION illegal aliens.

They are not entitled to American jobs, they are NOT permitted to work in the US, but they thumb their noses at our laws at will.

Most illegal immigrants are also contributing to society by paying taxes. They have the same tax withholding as the rest of us, and without the possibility of getting an eventual return on their Social Security payments. You will find that most actually do file tax returns as required by Federal law. They pay sales taxes, where applicable. If they own their homes, they pay property taxes.

LOL, oh yeah, I'm sure the employers of illegal aliens withold taxes from their "paychecks". LOL. Look at how the day laborers pay "taxes".

Oregon Secretary of State Bill Bradbury has noted on occasion that he doubts that many illegal immigrants are going to risk a Class A felony in order to vote. He adds that he would be happy to see a majority of the people who were actually legally eligible to vote to actually go register and then vote.

Yeah like illegal aliens obey our laws!

More importantly, our government and some of our citizens are causing trouble or fear for our Hispanic citizens and legal residents. There are about 45 million persons of Hispanic descent in the US, or about 15% of our population. I have heard te voices of too many people who presume that any person of Hispanic heritage is here in the US illegally. This cannot be further from the truth. I see too many places though where all our nation’s ills are blamed on this group of people. I encourage all of us to see through our bigotry and see our problems as they actually are. At the very least, if we need to find a scapegoat, at least let’s find the real problem.

This statement I have a major problem with. Illegal aliens come from all walks of life. The only ones who insist in making it a hispanic issue are those organizations who profit from illegal aliens who are hispanic. Their whining bores me and their agenda is crystal clear. The issue is people who do not respect the rule of law in this country. The issue is people who arrogantly believe we owe them anything at all. The issue is people who refuse to stick it out in their home countries, they'd rather come here and suck on the public teet.

These pro-illegal alien supporters need to see through their own bigotry and stop profiting off of illegal aliens. They should be helping these people in their own countries, not encouraging them to come here. We have had enough!

Originally Posted by Richard

If you add in dependent anchor baby minors and quasi legals (those working foreigners who have the right to live but not to work here as dependents of cilitens and legal immigrants) then the much quoted Bear Stearns estimate of twenty million has some validity. It will not be long however before the galloping alarmists from CAPS throw out the inflated figure of 38 to 40 million on this thread.

It becomes difficult to make a tight argument against illegal immigration when the extent is clearly mis stated xenophobically as though every foreign born person in the Unted States is an illegal alien.

You are starting your obfuscation agenda again, Richard. FIRST, CAPS has not said "38 to 40 million". They have stated, via their research that government figures are woefully low and incorrect. What they oficially state is the following:

The new report, "The Illegal Population Explosion: A Realistic Appraisal of its Actual Size, Implications for the Future, and Consequences for Public Policy Decisions and Citizen Activism," was released at a News Conference at the National Press Club in Washington, D.C.

Four experts who contributed to the 45-page study explained their findings that illegal aliens in the U.S. total at least 20 million, but perhaps as many as 38 million or more -- which far exceeds 8 to 12 million estimated by Homeland Security's Office of Immigration Studies[/b] new report, "Estimates of the Unauthorized Immigrant Population Residing in the United States, January 2006" (released August 31, 2007, see http://www.dhs.gov/ximgtn/statistics . The new study disputing the government figures was funded by Californians for Population Stabilization (CAPS) (www.capsweb.org) and published by The Social Contract Press (www.thesocialcontract.com).

I see nothing un-realistic about their figures and would never believe the "manipulated" government figures.

In this case expert is a subjective term there are people whose credentials are equally good and have lower estimates.
The CIS, FAIR and NumbersUSA all consider the estimate you have quoted as wildly inflated.


Outside of certain congressional districts the per centage of foreign born is lower than what it would have to be if you added the legal and illegal foreign born.


If you claim a larger extent of a problem to the general public than is actually there then the reality of the problem is going to be discounted. It detracts in convincing people that there is an actual problem.

Originally Posted by Richard

In this case expert is a subjective term there are people whose credentials are equally good and have lower estimates.
The CIS, FAIR and NumbersUSA all consider the estimate you have quoted as wildly inflated.


Outside of certain congressional districts the per centage of foreign born is lower than what it would have to be if you added the legal and illegal foreign born.


If you claim a larger extent of a problem to the general public than is actually there then the reality of the problem is going to be discounted. It detracts in convincing people that there is an actual problem.

FAIR, NumbersUSA, CIS are all IMMIGRATION study think tanks that generally utilize census statistics to comile their illegal immigration numbers. CAPS is a POPULATION study think tank that applies thier findings to national and California specific issues. To dismiss their study as you have without any refuting evidence is disingenious.

Originally Posted by Richard

If you add in dependent anchor baby minors and quasi legals (those working foreigners who have the right to live but not to work here as dependents of cilitens and legal immigrants) then the much quoted Bear Stearns estimate of twenty million has some validity. It will not be long however before the galloping alarmists from CAPS throw out the inflated figure of 38 to 40 million on this thread.


It becomes difficult to make a tight argument against illegal immigration when the extent is clearly mis stated xenophobically as though every foreign born person in the Unted States is an illegal alien.

HOW MANY ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS ARE REALLY IN OUR UNITED STATES???

There is endless speculation about how many illegal immigrants there are in our United States. Our politicians, especially the pro-illegal ones, love to use the number 12 million. They have been using that same number for the last four years, all while, each year, millions more illegals have invaded our United States.

Illegals have been swarming across our border ever since 1986, when amnesty was granted to the estimated 1.3 million illegal immigrants, who were here at that time, which turned out to be closer to 3.5 million.

In 2001, before any real concentrated border enforcement effort, it was estimated that the Border Patrol apprehended 1, out of every 7, illegal immigrants, attempting to cross our Southern border. Now, with a increased Border Patrol effort, and 300 miles of fencing, plus some vehicle barriers, along the almost 2,000 mile Southern border, it is estimated that the Border Patrol now apprehends 1, out of every 4, illegal immigrants, attempting to cross our Southern border.

So, realizing that we could grossly guestimate how many illegals came into our country each year, by multiplying available DHS statistics on Border Patrol apprehensions, by as much as 6, in the early years, and by 3 in the last couple of years, how many illegals do you think we now have in our country??

-------------SOUTHWEST BORDER PATROL APPREHENSIONS----------
----1999-------2000-------2001-------2002-------2003-------2004-------2005-------2006------2007------2008
1,537,000-1,643,679-1,235,718--929,809--905,065-1,139,282-1,189,108-1,071,972-858,638-611,721

In the last ten years, well over 11 million illegals have been apprehended at the border. If we used the lowest multiplier, that 1, out of 4, were apprehended, it still indicates that over 33 million illegals entered our United States, and that is just in the last ten years. How many more entered from 1987 to 1998??

Let's stop accepting, or believing, that there are only 12 million illegals in our United States. There are probably much closer to 40 million, if not more. We can even assume that as many as 20 million former illegals have since become legal over the past 22 years, and the numbers of illegals, here right now, could still be well over 30 million.

What is your best guess on the number of illegals in our country??

Support E-Verify for ALL employees, and let's begin taking our country back!!!

[quote]I am not in favor of illegal immigration. We will have to accept immigration as a given, though. as long as policies for how many may enter the US legally are not realistic. In other words, the solution to our “problemâ€

There are more intercepts by the US Border Patrol than there are people involved. This includes attempts at legal border crossing on cars, buses and airplanes as well as border jumpers. Three out of four people may be able to get through but the same person may get stopped more than once before either getting through or giving up. The number gtting in is well under three million a year. From my own knowledge I have met a man who was stopped several times on his own by bus before he managed to get through in a car with his elderly parents at rush hour. I also note that the US government estimate in 2000 was only eight million and not twelve million.