Thread: Cheney: Credit Checks Aren't Illegal

Jan 14, 12:27 PM EST


Cheney: Credit Checks Aren't Illegal


WASHINGTON (AP) -- Vice President Dick Cheney said Sunday the Pentagon and CIA are not violating people's rights by examining the banking and credit records of hundreds of Americans and others suspected of terrorism or espionage in the United States.

Rep. Silvestre Reyes, D-Texas, the new chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, said his panel will be the judge of that.

National security letters permit the executive branch to seek records about people in terrorism and spy investigations without a judge's approval or grand jury subpoena.

"The Defense Department gets involved because we've got hundreds of bases inside the United States that are potential terrorist targets," Cheney said.

"The Department of Defense has legitimate authority in this area. This is an authority that goes back three or four decades. It was reaffirmed in the Patriot Act," he said. "It's perfectly legitimate activity. There's nothing wrong with it or illegal. It doesn't violate people's civil rights."

In a statement Sunday, Reyes promised that his panel would take a careful look at those claims.

"Any expansion by the department into intelligence collection, particularly on U.S. soil, is something our committee will thorough review," Reyes said.

"We want our intelligence professionals to have strong tools that will enable them to interrupt the planning process of our enemies and to stop attacks against our country," he said. "But in doing so, we also want those tools to comply fully with the law and the Constitution."

The Pentagon and the CIA, to a lesser extent, have used this little-known power, officials said. The FBI, the lead agency on domestic counterterrorism and espionage, has issued thousands of such letters since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.

The letters have generated criticism and court challenges from civil liberties advocates who claim they invade the privacy of Americans' lives, even though banks and other financial institutions typically turn over the financial records voluntarily.

The vast majority of national security letters are issued by the FBI, but in rare circumstances they have been used by the CIA before and after Sept. 11, according to a U.S. intelligence official. The CIA has used these noncompulsory letters in espionage investigations and other circumstances, the official said.

The New York Times, which reported Sunday on the expanded use of the technique by the Pentagon and CIA, said military intelligence officers have sent the letters in up to 500 investigations.

Cheney was interviewed on "Fox News Sunday."

http://link.toolbot.com/ap.org/55024

How do you think they catch these guys? If you are expecting these people to turn themselves in, you'll be waiting a long time. They found many terrorists this way.

The government has most likely encroached on the Rights of many innocent American citizens while doing this, there is a very fine line here and I think those that came before us said it best.

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it."
Thomas Jefferson

"The preservation of the sacred fire of liberty and the destiny of the republican model of government are justly considered... deeply, ...finally, staked on the experiment entrusted to the hands of the American people."
George Washington

"Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action."
George Washington

"I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations."
James Madison

"We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it. We have staked the future of all of our political institutions upon the capacity of mankind of self-government; upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves, to control ourselves, to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God."
James Madison

"A nation which can prefer disgrace to danger is prepared for a master, and deserves one."
Alexander Hamilton

"A nation which can prefer disgrace to danger is prepared for a master, and deserves one."
Alexander Hamilton

This is an excellent quote, and sums up my feelings on the war in the middle east. We would rather disgrace our country by making fools out of our politicians, and ourselves, than having the nerve to face our real enemy.

April, what reccomendations do you have on catching terrorists? Rules in everyday life and rules of war are two different things. By doing battle with the government over common sense decisions will destroy our nation. If we allow terrorists to overtake our country, we will not have opportunities like we have now to discuss these issues.

Originally Posted by April

The government has most likely encroached on the Rights of many innocent American citizens while doing this, there is a very fine line here and I think those that came before us said it best.

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it."
Thomas Jefferson

"The preservation of the sacred fire of liberty and the destiny of the republican model of government are justly considered... deeply, ...finally, staked on the experiment entrusted to the hands of the American people."
George Washington

"Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action."
George Washington

"I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations."
James Madison

"We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it. We have staked the future of all of our political institutions upon the capacity of mankind of self-government; upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves, to control ourselves, to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God."
James Madison

"A nation which can prefer disgrace to danger is prepared for a master, and deserves one."
Alexander Hamilton

You're blaming the wrong people. If we want to point fingers, we need to be pointing them at ourselves. The banks to whom we pay billions of dollars (trillions cumulatively) are the culprits, yet we continue to enable them. Do you ever read what you sign? Your bank signature agreement authroizes the bank to turn over all sorts of records to the federal government when so requested. The government did not create this authority. You did when you didn't read the fine print.

Part and parcel to the liberty we claim in this nation is the unlimited right to contract. If you want to sell yourself into slavery, that's your right. If you want to waive any or all of your rights, that's also your right.

No, IMO I am not blaming the wrong people. The government along with a whole list of other establishments are encroaching on our rights and I am not recommending that the government not go after terrorists. I am simply saying the govenment has and will continue to encroach on our basic rights if we are not vigilent and do not speak out. Not only terrorist desire to take away our freedom of speech but our government could also very well be headed in that direction. It is important to remain vigilent on all levels. IMO these quotes from our forefathers are excellent on any issue that involves government.

CrocketsGhost,
I agree with you in part. but the banks can refuse you service if you refuse to sign.

Just like the Real ID, which is Voluntary, you are not allowed to drive, work, fly, open a bank account, collect social security or enter a federal building.

I say it’s a combination of both. But when it is a needed service and they force you to sign away your rights in order to use it. How do you get around it. I went to the doctor last year and refused to sign the statement that allows them to share my information with other entities nor would I provide them with my SS number and the office manager made a phone call to some unknown person, gave them my name and said I refused. I wonder what list I'm on now??? I don’t have to give my SS number when I pay for my own health care and I will not allow them to share my medical records with anyone. If I want to do so, I'll have them make a copy and I'll take it to them myself.


Either way "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

Vice President Dick Cheney said Sunday the Pentagon and CIA are not violating people's rights by examining the banking and credit records of hundreds of Americans and others suspected of terrorism or espionage in the United States.

I don't see the big deal here. The government already knows how much money I make since my employers inform them each year and I have to file a tax return. As long as it doesn't effect my credit raiting, I could care less if they look at my bank records or pull a credit report. They are not looking at everybody's records or just being nosey.

If they are conducting an investigation into terrorism or espionage and already have a few hundred suspects I don't see a problem with the governmet looking at their financial records to either eliminate suspects or further an investigation.

If they are conducting an investigation into terrorism or espionage and already have a few hundred suspects I don't see a problem with the governmet looking at their financial records to either eliminate suspects or further an investigation.

That is correct. Cool Avatar!

"I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations."
James Madison