Thread: N.C. bills focus on immigration: Gheen sighting reported.

http://www.alipac.us/article380.html

May 01,2005
Barry Smith
Freedom Raleigh Bureau
Topics: Legislation, Illegal Immigration, Republican, Democrat, laws, crimes, campaigns
RALEIGH - You normally think of immigration battles being fought in Washington or along the Mexican and Canadian borders.

Read the latest headlines about illegal immigration.

This year, immigration has become a hot topic in the halls of the Legislative Building. Bills designed to both assist illegal immigrants and to make it more difficult for them to obtain things such as a driver's licenses or qualify for in-state college tuition and other assistance have been introduced in the General Assembly.

"These efforts have nothing to do with legal immigrants," state Sen. Hugh Webster, R-Alamance, said during a recent news conference, called to support some of the bills combating illegal immigration and in opposition to the tuition bill. "It is all about criminal conduct. We are being overrun by illegal immigrants, people who have thumbed their nose at our law."

The debate over the immigration issue has become aggressive. And one sponsor of the in-state tuition bill said that some of the calls he has received over the bill have taken on a nasty tone.

Rep. Jeff Barnhart, R-Cabarrus, said that some opponents of the bill have left racial slurs on his voice mail.

"It's constant," Barnhart said. "Half of the e-mails or phone calls I get are mad at the whole immigration system."

Federal issue

Another sponsor of the bill, Rep. Paul Luebke, D-Durham, agreed that many of the people upset with the bill are angry at the nation's immigration system.

"The anger that many people show really should be directed toward their federal representatives - their congressman, senator, president - who are unable to pass a bill," Luebke said.

"I'm 100 percent in favor of the feds doing something," Barnhart said about the immigration problem. "That doesn't mean I'm going to take it out on their kids."

Bill Gheen, president of Americans for Legal Immigration PAC, is often seen in the halls of the Legislative Building encouraging lawmakers to oppose the in-state tuition bill and support some of the bills that tighten up on illegal immigration.

"Rapid illegal immigration will destroy this state," Gheen said. "My organization is trying to prevent a backlash against all immigration."

When asked if he was opposed to illegal immigration or to immigration per se, he replied, "It's both. We can't handle 3 million third-world illegal aliens per year. Legalizing them would even bring more."

He said that the organization is trying to stem the tide of illegal immigration by securing the nation's borders, removing rewards and incentives to come here - such as obtaining a driver's license or receiving in-state tuition benefits - cracking down on employers who intentionally hire illegal immigrants, and by allowing police to deport illegal immigrants after they're convicted of crimes.

"A license is a privilege, not a right," Gheen said in support of the bill aimed at preventing illegal immigrants from obtaining a driver's license. "They don't need licenses to drive to jobs that it's illegal for them to have."

In-state tuition

In arguing against the in-state tuition bill, Gheen said that "90 percent of North Carolinians can't be wrong."

He was referring to online polls, which are not considered scientific, that showed up to 90 percent of those responding voicing their opposition to the bill.

Yet a recent Elon Poll, conducted by Elon University, showed North Carolinians favoring in-state tuition for illegal immigrants by a 49 percent to 41 percent margin.

He said that the Elon Poll was "a bogus poll" and took issue with the wording of the question asked. The question asked if respondents supported or opposed in-state tuition for illegal immigrants if the immigrants met the qualifications of the bill, such as being attending high school in North Carolina for four years and agreeing to apply for legal immigration status.

Gheen said that the question should have simply said: "Do you support in-state tuition for illegal aliens?"

Luebke said that the poll shows that the people are beginning to support the bill, despite critical reviews it has gotten on some talk radio stations.

"When the firestorm subsides, people can see the fairness aspect for children who did not come here voluntarily and the importance of an educated bilingual labor force in our state," he said.

The in-state tuition bill, the one that has fostered the most debate of all the immigration-related bills this session, is in a holding pattern while supporters gauge public opinion and clarify legal issues that have been raised, Luebke said.

One issue raised by Gov. Mike Easley and legislative staff members relates to a federal law that says that if a state provides such benefits to illegal immigrants, it also must provide them to out-of-state students.

Barnhart said that, under the bill, illegal immigrants would not replace legal North Carolina residents in gaining admission to the universities and community colleges. Instead, he said that the illegal immigrants would compete for slots designated for out-of-state students. He added that such students would not receive preferential treatment.

http://www.alipac.us/article380.html

Elon University Poll Numbers Don't Add up to 100%.

49 + 41 = 90

SO WHERE IS THE OTHER 10%

WHERE IS THE OTHER 10%

OH WHERE OH WHERE IS THE OTHER 10%

Aren't you just sick of the lies, tricks, deceptions, deceits of these people??

Where in the heck is the other 10% of the poll??

I'll tell you where it is--it's in OPPOSITION to the in-state tuition bill which makes it ACTUALLY:

49% Favor 51% Oppose NC HB 1183

AND in the USA, that means the MAJORITY OPPOSE NC HB 1183!

Give it up before you discredit yourselves any further....how do I know the 10% was in Opposition? Because if it had been in favor, they would have counted it instead of throwing it in the trash or stuffing the poll sheets in their pockets. These were students interviewing mainly students who were mislead into believing that these people were ALMOST CITIZENS...which of course they aren't and won't be and nothing about citizenship is required by the proposed law.

North Carolina has no jurisdiction on citizenship.

And ask youself another question: Why in the world would North Carolina need to have a bi-langual work force? Do these people know something about what's afoot? Do they know more than they're tellin'?

I demand to know--why Senator Luebke thinks "when the firestorm subsides, people will see the fairness of the legislation and the need for a bilingual workforce in our state".

Say What?????

Only a Globalist would think that....and folks, that 'aint gonna happen.

We are not going to let these people dissolve the United States of America and turn it in to an over-populated, under-paid, two language, Third World Nation of Drones serving the Globally Elite!

Not now. Not ever.

Stand Up. Speak. E-mail. Call. Fax. Write. Stand the Guard. Whatever it Takes to Protect our Precious United States of America, if not for yourself, then for the next Generation of Americans.

This country belongs to them and it is not ours or anyone else's to give away to foreign agents of foreign governments to line the pockets of the Globally Elite.

We are the Americans, the Eternal Custodians of these United States.

I'll be sending this to Barnhart and to as many email addresses I can find for anyone who might take the time to read it, including the media. Feel free to cut and paste and please be sure to use a link back to Alipac in all correspondence!

Good morning. Please let me start by saying how badly I feel that people feel they must stoop to sending you racially motivated emails and phone calls. As a past recipient of such, I can understand your contempt and dismay at those tactics.

However, I can also stipulate that the people who feel it necessary to do this must obviously think their views are NOT getting heard -- or at the very least, not being paid attention to. You know yourself that if you feel you are being ignored, you get angry.

As a native of NC for 48 years, with my entire family on both sides being the same, I must say I am not in favor in the least of HB 1183. I believe that it will only increase the flow of illegal aliens into our state, as if we needed that with the way NCDMV hands out REAL FAKE driver's licenses and IDs. I was a recipient of the email from Mr. Hurder stating that the officers were not there to enforce immigration but to work on driver's licenses and IDs. Sweetening the pot by allowing in-state tuition for illegal aliens will only add to the overwhelming influx we are experiencing now. While I believe this is despicable, there is little the tax paying citizen voters of NC can do about it except on election day. And on election day, some people just vote for the lesser of what they believe to be the two evils running.

You and others have stated that no legal citizen will be displaced by any illegal alien. However, I find that hard to believe since, because of their heritage, they are considered a minority and therefore, regardless of grade point averages at high school graduation, they will be given "priority" and will displace legal citizens of NC and the USA. Can you or anyone else guaranteed that every University will NOT consider their heritage and NOT give them minority placement preference?

Do not misunderstand when I say minority placement. If a person applying for admission to a University or College (some believe they are not the same) is already a Legal Citizen of the USA, that is perfectly acceptable. However, if their parents are illegal aliens, the parents should be dealt with at that time as it will be obvious on the application that they are illegal on the background checks most Universities are doing now. They should be dealt with as well as the employer where they work. Especially the legal citizen employer. It is as much (or more) the fault of the employer who works illegal aliens at low wages and they should not be allowed to get by with it or continue doing so. If the applicant is an illegal alien, and the background check shows such, they should not be allowed admission to the College or University. Neither should felons -- and they cannot get in, so why should an illegal alien who is attempting to break the law and continues to do so, not be denied acceptance due to their criminal behavior?

If the illegal alien is applying for citizenship, they had plenty of time in the years they have spent establishing residence in NC to become a legal citizen. If they have said they will apply, it should be a necessity for them to take the classes they need, including English, and get their citizenship BEFORE they are allowed to graduate and the time they can attend the college should be limited before establishing legal citizenship. They should take those classes FIRST and receive their citizenship. They should not receive in-state tuition unless they are citizens, period. They should not be allowed into the University system as out-of-state admissions either, if they are illegal aliens. It is not fair to the rest of the children attending, nor to their parents,for those children to have to attend classes with criminals. That is why the background checks are done and also since the application specifically asks if you have broken any laws, they must say YES as a matter of integrity. If they say no, they should not be allowed to attend as they do not tell the truth regarding their criminal behavior.

At UNCW, there have been numerous problems with applicants who have written NO when it should have been YES on their applications regarding criminal behavior. Even though they are LEGAL citizens, they get the boot when the University or College finds out they lied on the application. Why is an illegal alien any different? Criminal behavior is criminal behavior, period.

So far as being a bilingual society, with employers preferring bi-lingual employees, why should that be necessary when an illegal alien must first learn English before receiving citizenship? As the legal immigrants who came to our Country in the past 200 or so years have done, these aliens need to learn to speak English and USE it. If they used it, they would become fluent in it in a short time, particularly if they are young students who learn faster than older students like you and me. But it should not be necessary for legal citizens to "bend" so much to accommodate illegal aliens or legal immigrants. They should learn and speak English. When settlers came to America, they learned English. Immigrants who came after that, learned and spoke English. Why should the criminal illegal immigrant have any choice in the language they must speak to live here? If they want to be Americans, they should be willing to learn the language of Americans and that language is English.

Thank you for taking the time to read this email. I hope you do not consider it to be hate mail or racial in any way shape or form. Especially because you do not know my race and this letter is not about race. It's about criminal behavior in our society being rewarded to the illegal alien.

Our children, when considered criminal, must go to jail or prison. Why should an illegal alien be treated differently?

The courtesy of your reply is requested,
Your name, your city, etc.

Please visit this website for more views on this topic and many others regarding illegal aliens.
http://www.alipac.us/ftopicp-12865.html#12865

"It's constant," Barnhart said. "Half of the e-mails or phone calls I get are mad at the whole immigration system."

Do you think? Get a clue.

"I'm 100 percent in favor of the feds doing something," Barnhart said about the immigration problem. "That doesn't mean I'm going to take it out on their kids."

So you think that it is helpful to pass the buck. Why don't you help enforce the law? What part of "illegal" don't you understand?

One issue raised by Gov. Mike Easley and legislative staff members relates to a federal law that says that if a state provides such benefits to illegal immigrants, it also must provide them to out-of-state students.

Barnhart said that, under the bill, illegal immigrants would not replace legal North Carolina residents in gaining admission to the universities and community colleges. Instead, he said that the illegal immigrants would compete for slots designated for out-of-state students. He added that such students would not receive preferential treatment.

Not is Barnhart wrong, he seems to have a problem reading. If you provide in-state tuition for illegals in NC, they you have to do the same fo any other US citizen, regardless of state of residence. Do you really want to give preference to an illegal over a US citizen?

Not is Barnhart wrong, he seems to have a problem reading. If you provide in-state tuition for illegals in NC, they you have to do the same fo any other US citizen, regardless of state of residence. Do you really want to give preference to an illegal over a US citizen?

I certainly do not. Not now. Never!

If they give in-state tuition to illegal aliens, they should be REQUIRED to give it to every legal citizen from any state in the USA.

Period!

Judy,

That poll is nowhere close to being accurate. The missing 10 percent are supposedly those that neither support or oppose.

I'd like to have our own poll run by the pros but that would cost at least 5 grand.

W

William, go to the news&observer website on the new question they put up. Some of the members of that forum got the actual poll results. The poll had all types of ranges of support or opposition which they "factored" in.....the 10% is missing....I asked "Where is the 10%" and even those in favor of the bill....educators I think....COULDN'T ACCOUNT FOR IT. The conclusion of that forum...which has a bunch of "scientific" type regulars on it....could not account for the missing 10%. So, they tried to cheat with a poll taken by advocates in a vulnerable setting of a university....and they still lost.

Someone posted that the poll was taken by students of students.

Also Elon University is a United Church of Christ school.

I wouldn't worry about the poll. It does need to be challenged because it was SO DIFFERENT than the other 3 or 4 polls taken in North Carolina and SO DIFFERENT than the national polls taken by national media on the entire immigration question.

If we paid for a poll, they'd just claim it was rigged.

"Rapid illegal immigration will destroy this state," Gheen said. "My organization is trying to prevent a backlash against all immigration."

Exactly! Good words, William. This was the point I tried to get across to the Open border bunch. If we don't correct this problem very soon, there will be a backlash against illegals and American Mexicans, because too many people are knee jerk reactionaries. I don't want blood spilled because some liberal do gooder is pushing people to hard to subsidize their selfish wants.

WELL SAID William and AuntB!!