Thread: OR: Hearing on tighter license rules draws rally

Hearing on tighter license rules draws rally
01/12/2008
Associated Press

Representatives ranging from farm worker advocates to the Oregon chapter of the Minutemen Civil Defense Corps were at the Oregon Capitol Friday to support or oppose stiffer rules for driver's licenses for undocumented residents.

"Drug dealers get protection in Oregon," Ted Campbell, head of the Oregon Minutemen said.

But Kevin Courtney, 10, worried what tighter rules might do to families.

"I am in fifth grade and I heard all my classmates saying their parents are very worried about what is happening with their driving licenses and probably they won't have a way to go to work and they won't have enough money to buy food," he told a hearing of the joint House and Senate transportation committees.

They were among more than 150 people who signed up to testify on draft legislation. Another hearing is expected before the Legislature meets in a short session in February.

Nearly 2,000 others showed up to listen or rally on the Capitol steps. Most opposed the stricter rules.

The hearing came as state transportation officials prepare to adopt rules that would tighten requirements for getting, renewing or replacing an Oregon driver's license after Feb. 4.

The new regulations came in an executive order by Gov. Ted Kulongoski.

There is disagreement between the Legislative Counsel and Kulongoski's legal advisers over whether the order requires people to prove they're in the country legally.

The new rules would require proof of identity and Oregon residency, and a Social Security number that can be verified.

But even that would not satisfy requirements of the 2005 Real ID Act, federal officials said Friday. Among other things, the Oregon system would not be plugged into a federal database.

Homeland Security officials in Washington, D.C., said Friday that states not in compliance with the federal act would have to submit a waiver by May asking for additional time to comply, or risk vigorous screenings of their residents at airports and federal buildings.

Also Friday the U.S. Department of Homeland Security unveiled final Real ID rules that establish minimum security standards for state-issued drivers' licenses and identification cards.

With the federal rules released, Oregon will seek a waiver to gain time, Kulongoski's spokeswoman, Patty Wentz, told the Statesman Journal.

The issue in Oregon is as contentious as immigration itself.

Groups opposing illegal immigration say anything less than a proof-of-legal-presence standard invites terrorists and drug traffickers.

"In addition, Oregon continues to issue eight-year driver's licenses to people with six-month visas, and that's unconscionable," said Jim Ludwick, the president of Oregonians for Immigration Reform, which opposes illegal immigration. "Oregon is a mecca and a magnet for ID fraud and illegal immigration."

But Hispanic activists migrant worker supporters say such claims are a new low in anti-immigrant lobbying.

"The fact is, undocumented Latino workers pay $134 million to $187 million in income taxes annually," said Victoria Lewis, a member of the Oregon Coalition for Public Safety. "In Oregon, they put between $1.8 billion to $2.5 billion into the economy as consumers of products and services."
http://www.kgw.com/sharedcontent/APStor ... 3TH02.html

Groups opposing illegal immigration say anything less than a proof-of-legal-presence standard invites terrorists and drug traffickers.

Uh, yeah - and.... people that otherwise have to right to be here - for <whatever> reason.

I just love the complete 'throw reason out the window' attitude some of these people exhibit...

Example:

"The fact is, undocumented Latino workers pay $134 million to $187 million in income taxes annually

Uh, yeah - but legally, you can't work to earn that paycheck by which those payroll taxes are subtracted... you shouldn't be paying any income taxes at all - because you shouldn't be here, and you certainly shouldn't be working.

Where is the outcry about unemployed or underemployed Oregonians?
How will they get to that job - if they have one? They pay taxes too...
GRRRR!

Here's another glaring lie by simple omission:


Approx # of children of IAs in OR in schools here: (rough est) 50,000
(Total # of IAs in OR as of 2006 was approx 200,000 - very fuzzy, and likely to low-ball true number)

Approx. cost / per pupil in public primary/secondary education in OR:
Approx. $8000 (Also, I should note this is for an 'average' student; now, what happens in the case where English is a second language...? Yeah, we know - price goes up.... again)

Est. Total Cost of IA children in OR school per year:
$8000 * 50,000 = $400,000,000 (for a state of approx. 3.7 million people)

And, on top of this, is the simple fact that OR has no sales tax. Local schools are funded nearly exclusively by local property taxes. How many IAs do you think own property and pay into the local education district's tax base? .... You see where this picture is heading....

Enlighten me! How do you pay taxes without a valid Social Security card?

Probably via an ITIN or a bogus SSN - just my guess, no first-hand knowledge of this of course.

Originally Posted by PhredE

Probably via an ITIN or a bogus SSN - just my guess, no first-hand knowledge of this of course.

IAs use a bogus SSN to gain employment and an ITIN to file their federal tax form.

Our federal govt. processes these forms. The tax form uses an ITIN, yet the attached W2 has a different number ( the bogus SSN). These people aren't hiding. They work any job or location, except perhaps AZ & OK with their new state laws. We certainly don't have 12 - 20 million people picking lettuce.