Thread: Rift opens between border watch groups

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2005/06 ... _31_05.txt

Rift opens between border watch groups

By: WILLIAM FINN BENNETT - Staff Writer

As the July start-up approaches of a Minuteman Project-style watch along the U.S.-Mexico border in East San Diego County, the two groups spearheading the effort have had a falling-out, officials with those organizations said Tuesday.

Chino resident Andy Ramirez heads up an organization called Friends of the Border Patrol, and Oceanside resident James Chase leads a group called the United States Border Patrol Auxiliary. Both anti-illegal-immigration groups are putting together volunteers to fan out along the border this summer, observe illegal immigrants crossing into the United States, and report them to the U.S. Border Patrol.

Chase's will be on the border starting July 18, while Ramirez's group will begin its watch Aug. 1, the men say.

This month, Ramirez posted a press release on his Web site, stating: "We ... informed Mr. Chase that we shall not have anything to do with his organization under any circumstance."

On Tuesday, Ramirez said he refused to be associated with Chase or his organization because he doesn't like Chase's approach or the use of the Border Patrol in his group's name.

Chase defended his use of the Border Patrol in his group's name and said Tuesday that he felt Ramirez was spreading lies about him.

Officials with both organizations said their border-watch efforts are modeled on the Minuteman Project, a similar endeavor that took place in Arizona in April. During that project, hundreds of volunteers spent four weeks in the Arizona desert observing illegal immigrants and reporting them to the U.S. Border Patrol. Minuteman Project officials said that based on their reports of illegal aliens, Border Patrol agents captured more than 300 undocumented immigrants.

Minuteman Project officials said they hoped to galvanize public opinion on the staggering dimensions of the problem of illegal immigration. From Sept. 30, 2003, to Oct. 1, 2004, U.S. Border Patrol agents captured 1.14 million undocumented immigrants along the country's southwestern border with Mexico.

Hundreds of reporters covered the Minuteman Project in Arizona. The group's efforts ignited a storm of controversy, with some politicians and residents praising their work and others labeling it as racist.

As the time for a similar border watch in San Diego County approaches, concerns have been raised over escalating tensions between groups that advocate tougher enforcement of immigration laws and civil rights groups speaking up for illegal immigrants. An official with the San Diego County Sheriff's Department said recently that he was worried that those tensions could boil over at the border this summer.

Ramirez said Tuesday that he has several issues with Chase. Ramirez said he began avoiding Chase's phone calls after an April conversation in which Chase, according to Ramirez, mentioned the use of snipers.

"That scared the daylights out of me," Ramirez said Tuesday. "We decided we weren't going to have anything to do with him."

Reached by phone Tuesday, Chase said he never said he wanted to use snipers and that Ramirez misunderstood what he was saying during the conversation. When he used the word sniper, Chase said, he was referring to the fact that he had a Minuteman volunteer who had been a sniper in the military, and that he wanted the man to go out in the desert and do reconnaissance work on his own.

"All I can tell you is it's lies; we didn't have guys with sniper scopes," Chase said. "I would never hurt anybody."

He said that he is "probably" going to file a lawsuit against Ramirez for defamation of character.

"I am wondering who he is working for. I am beginning to wonder if he is trying to ruin our movement."

Minuteman Project founder Jim Gilchrist said Thursday that he attributes the conflict between Ramirez and Chase to different styles and backgrounds, with Chase being a former Marine and Ramirez having a civilian background.

"Jim is looking at things with a military eye and Andy is looking at things from a civilian perspective," Gilchrist said. "They are getting into a pissing contest; it's a collision of enthusiasms and egos."

In his press release, Ramirez wrote: "We further reject the usage of the name United States Border Patrol Auxiliary, which would lead the public to infer that the organization is affiliated with the U.S. Border Patrol and government."

Apparently, Ramirez is not the only one with that concern.

On Tuesday, San Diego sector U.S. Border Patrol spokeswoman Hilary Smith said that Border Patrol attorneys are looking into the legality of Chase using the name of the agency as part of his organization's moniker.

"We are concerned that any affiliation may be misrepresented," Smith said. "(We) will take the appropriate steps to ensure that the public understands that this organization is not part of the U.S. Border Patrol and is not a government-sanctioned group."

Chase said his intent in using the name was not to fool anyone. On his Web site, www.unitedstatesborderpatrolaux.com, Chase states he is a civilian volunteer, and under a section titled "The Story Behind Our Name," states, "Congress mandated the Civilian U.S. Coast Guard Auxiliary to help the USCG. Why not a U.S. Border Patrol Auxiliary to fill out the ranks of the USBP."

Chase said Tuesday that he doesn't mind the Border Patrol investigating the legality of his use of the name.

"If they say I can't use the name, we will talk about it and my attorney can talk to their attorney," he said. "I don't want to break any laws, but they are going to have to come up with some good legal reasons why I cannot use it."

Contact staff writer William Finn Bennett at (760) 740-5426 or wbennett@nctimes.com.

THESE STUPID PEOPLE!! This is exactly the kind of thing the ACLU, LAWYERS GUILD & LA RAZA want to see happen in public!

STUPID!!! These fools don't know any better than to keep their problems "in-house?" That this kind of thing hurts all of us?

STUPID

It had to happen sooner or later.......................

Stupid is as stupid does..........................

This is the last thing we need. If people cannot put their egos last and the cause first, they do not need to be involved. This is not about "them" it is about all of the citizens of the USA and our country, plain and simple!

If they cannot rein in their egos and work out their differences, they need to step down and let cooler heads prevail. They are acting like 4 year olds! I am sure their intentions are good, but this is NOT the way to get something done!

You're are exactly right. It is the last thing we need. But this is what people do. Their own egos get involved and they forget the big picture. They get all caught up in what "they" can do. What it will do for "them". How it will make "them" look. What people will think of "them".

Don't you think they are somewhat in it for themselves at this point? Maybe just a little or they would not be fighting amongst themselves?

When the MMP started none of this was going on. Now, what the nay-sayers wanted to happen is happening.

What can we, as a group do to help them realize it and help them STOP?

What can we, as a group do to help them realize it and help them STOP?

IMHO, they've done ENOUGH DAMAGE and need to go away.......fade away................get gone!

I wouldn't trust them or their groups one little bit now. They've tainted themselves.

Where's a Good Witch when we need one?

I prefer to stay in the shadows. I feel I can be more effective this way. I am in this because I CANNOT stand what is happening to my country!
I do not care for the limelight..to much to distract you from what you are doing.

I want my kids to have a future in the Country that I grew up in!