Thread: S.C.: Confusion grows on immigration bills with time running

May 15, 2008


Confusion grows on immigration bills with time running out in legislative session

Legislators say informal talks this weekend are critical

By Tim Smith
STAFF WRITER

COLUMBIA -- After years of hearings and months of debate, the fate of immigration legislation in the state General Assembly may boil down to informal talks among legislators this weekend, some lawmakers said Thursday.

With nine legislative days left in the session, lawmakers are faced with the choice of new negotiations over a House plan rejected Wednesday by the Senate or debating a wholly new proposal by a Senate leader.

Some senators said they are willing to delay acting on a state budget if no immigration plan passes, while others said they may be willing to go home without passing an immigration bill if the only plan being offered has what they call constitutional problems

Sen. David Thomas, a Greenville County Republican, said Thursday he doesn’t plan to remove his objection to a new plan by Senate President Pro Tempore Glenn McConnell because he believes it has problems and would only make the public more confused about what is happening. Thomas placed his objection on the bill Wednesday, temporarily halting any consideration of the plan.

Meanwhile, many legislators, including some from the Upstate, said residents are tired of excuses and want something done.

"It’s a fluid state we find ourselves in," said Sen. Larry Martin of Pickens. "It might be gasoline."

Martin said legislators from both chambers are expected to talk this weekend in informal discussions about immigration in an effort to find some consensus.

"My view is this weekend is critical," he said. "If we could get 90 percent of a good bill, why would we walk away from that? I personally don’t think it’s acceptable to go home without an immigration bill. What happens this weekend, quite frankly, will set the stage for whether that is possible."

Martin said he doesn’t want extreme positions to harden with three calendar weeks still left in the session. As long as both chambers are talking, he said, there is still a chance for a bill to pass.

Both chambers moved Thursday to appoint three negotiators to work out differences on the bill the Senate rejected 26-20 on Wednesday.

However, both sides have accused the other’s latest bill of being fatally flawed.

It is the second conference committee to be appointed this year on the second attempt at immigration legislation between the two bodies. The first ended weeks ago in a stalemate of angry accusations and press releases.

McConnell has offered a third package, which he has touted as both a compromise and a tougher bill than anything now in use by any other state.

His plan would require private employers to verify the legal status of workers using a South Carolina driver’s license, a driver’s license from another state which uses documents approved by South Carolina, or the federal electronic database, known as E-verify.

Employers who fail to use one of the three methods but hold onto records submitted by the worker could be shielded from fines, a point that appeals to Democrats worried about farmers being unfairly sanctioned.

Those who intentionally and knowingly hire illegals would have their ability to operate in the state suspended, according to McConnell, ranging from 10 days for first offense to a permanent revocation on third offense.

However, Thomas said he believes the "good faith" provision is a loophole that renders the bill similar to the first Senate’s plan on verification, which would allow businesses to use the much-criticized federal I-9 form.

He said the licensure penalty would be hard to enforce and he disagrees with McConnell’s statements that such penalties would effectively shut a business down, since many businesses don’t carry professional licenses.

"Either we’ve got an E-verify system or we don’t," he said. "So if you create a third bill roaming around out there, isn’t this just an exercise in futility? To me it’s creating confusion. I don’t think it’s intentional on anyone’s part, but that’s the effect of it."

Thomas said a majority of the Senate can overcome his objection and put McConnell’s bill up for debate. But he said he would rather see the leadership of the House and Senate and Gov. Mark Sanford work out an agreement on something before debating yet another plan.

"Until some agreement can be worked out, why subject the public to false hope?" he asked.

He said without such a consensus, he is willing to end the session without any bill, let the public talk about it and start again in January.

Others disagreed.

"I’m hearing there are some folks who are willing to deny a state budget being passed until we have meaningful immigration reform," said Sen. Larry Grooms, a Berkeley County Republican. Grooms said if at least 16 senators hold that view, as well as the governor, "There won’t be a budget."

www.greenvilleonline.com

Hutto: Senate seeks enforceable immigration bill
By JAMES DENTON, Special to The T&DFriday, May 16, 2008


Senators are once again trying to hammer out the legislative kinks in an immigration reform bill in an effort to compromise with the House of Representatives.

President Pro Tem Glenn McConnell discussed those potential compromises, and sticking points, with Sens. Larry Grooms, R-Berkeley; Brad Hutto, D-Orangeburg and Jim Ritchie, R-Spartanburg, Thursday on ETV’s “This Week in the Senateâ€

I do not know if any of the State Senators from South Carolina read the news at ALIPAC but I just filled out the paperwork today and sent it in to initiate legal action against the 26 state senators that refuse to vote for the citizens of South Carolina on Bill # 3032. It is the legislation that deals with illegal immigration in this state.

The legal action says that because they refuse to vote on the measure, they are discriminating against me and every other citizen from South Carolina because of national origin. It is being filed with the South Carolina Human Affairs Commission. A copy of this should be on the desk of every one of those 26 Senators by this coming Tuesday morning at the latest.

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May 17, 2008


Some angered by slow progress on immigration reform

By Tim Smith
STAFF WRITER

COLUMBIA ó While the lack of progress thus far on immigration reform is frustrating many legislators, some outside the Statehouse say they are even more unhappy.

"It's very discouraging to know you have people down there who can't make a decision," said Clemson City Councilwoman Margaret Thompson, an advocate for immigration reform. "I think they all need to go."

Representatives from business, farming as well as organizations seeking to cut the flow of illegal immigration in the state all say they are not satisfied with what is being offered now in legislation. Some say they would rather have nothing than what might be produced in the last nine days of the legislative session.

"Our position continues to be that we believe it's a federal issue and there are a lot more pressing things for the Legislature to work on," said Reggie Hall, a spokesman for the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation. "We would hope they would have spent their time and energy lobbying Congress to get a federal bill out."

The bill now being negotiated by House and Senate members is a House plan rejected by the Senate that would require employers to verify the legal status of their workers using either a South Carolina driver's license, the driver's license of a state whose document requirements are just as stringent or the federal electronic database system, known as E-verify.

Those who repeatedly and knowingly hire illegal workers under the plan could have their right to operate in the state suspended. Some senators have attacked the bill because of a provision that would allow the state's attorney general to grant probation to firms for their first offense. The senators believe that clause is unconstitutional.

The previous Senate bill contains stiff fines that Gov. Mark Sanford and House members say violate federal law.

Senate President Pro Tempore Glenn McConnell has proposed a third plan, one that he says could result in the suspension of revocation of a business' ability to operate if it is found to have knowingly hired illegal workers. But the plan also has a "good faith" provision that would shield employers from penalties if they retain documents submitted by workers but don't verify them.

Marcia Purday, a spokeswoman for the South Carolina Chamber of Commerce, said the business community wants lawmakers to give employers the option of the federal I-9 form or the Senate's version, S.C. verify. The form has been criticized by some as open to abuse through fraudulent documents.

"In terms of the business community and the South Carolina Chamber of Commerce, what we really want is a strong immigration bill that passes constitutional muster and doesn't conflict with federal law," she said. "We think there should be an I-9 option."

She said the chamber's lawyers are studying McConnell's latest proposal.

Purday said while the business community hopes something passes, it does not want a bill "that is that out of line with the federal law."

"We strongly believe that businesses should not be the enforcers of the law," she said. "They need to have verification tools in order to verify the legality of their workers."

Mark Thies is a Clemson professor who co-chairs the group South Carolinians for Immigration Moderation.

He said he thinks the House-passed plan is a good one, but worries what will happen to it in negotiations, especially since McConnell will lead the Senate team meeting with House members.

"I would rather have no legislation passed than some sort of regurgitation of I-9," he said.

Hall said if something passes it will contribute to a patchwork quilt of laws regarding immigration around the country that will create chaos for farmers and businesses. He said, however, the state's nearly 25,000 farmers aren't arguing to allow illegal immigration.

"What we've wanted all along and still want is a federal, fair, guest worker program so farmers can hire legal immigrants to pick our fresh fruits and vegetables," he said. About 373,000 people are employed in the state's farming industry, he said, with annual sales of almost $1.5 billion.

Thompson said legislators are worrying too much about what the Chamber and Farm Bureau want and not about what is best for the state.

"Anybody ought to get checked," she said. "I don't know what's so hard about that."

She favors a verification system using only E-verify.

Thomspon said right now she doesn't think legislators will produce a meaningful bill, which she said she suspects was the aim of some from the beginning.

Come primary time, she promised, those who want immigration reform will not vote for those who sat on their hands in the Legislature.

"We're going to send a message," she said.

www.greenvilleonline.com

Posted on Sat, May. 24, 2008
Immigration debate to pick up next week

The S.C. Senate plans to renew the immigration debate on Tuesday.

The House and Senate have been at an impasse because of a disagreement over how the state should go about mandating employee screening for private businesses.

Sen. Pro Tem Glenn McConnell, R-Charleston, and House Speaker Rep. Bobby Harrell, R-Charleston, have been working on a compromise.

Contributors: Jim DuPlessis, Noelle Phillips and Andrew Shain

http://www.thestate.com/business/story/414372.html