Thread: SHOULD UNIVERSITIES REINSTATE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION? : CLOSED

Should universities reinstitute affirmative action to ensure equal access for minorities?


Yes
(6 Votes, 19%)

No
(25 Votes, 81%)

Not Sure (0 Votes, 0%)

http://www.nctimes.com/

Equal access for minorities discussed at Cal State San Marcos


By: BRENDA DURAN - Staff Writer
North County Times
February 22, 2007

SAN MARCOS -- The end of affirmative action more than a decade ago was the beginning of unequal access to educational and economic opportunities for all communities of color, organizers of Equality Alliance of San Diego said Wednesday at Cal State San Marcos.

More than 20 community members, staffers and students attended a forum hosted by Equality Alliance and the university chapter of the League of United Latin American Citizens to hear information presented by the alliance on key trends among racial and ethnic groups, including disparities in education and political participation in the past decade.

During the forum titled "Equal Opportunity: The Elusive Promise" a brief documentary was shown about the history and outcome of Proposition 209 -- a voter initiative passed in 1996 -- which prohibited public institutions from discriminating on the basis of race, sex or ethnicity.


"When we took out affirmative action we took away a balancing mechanism," said Andrea Guerrero, an attorney with Equality Alliance who was the keynote speaker of the forum.

Also known as the California Civil Rights Initiative, Prop. 209 is known for eliminating all forms of affirmative action in public education, contracting and hiring. The controversial proposition ended targeted outreach, recruitment, financial aid, support and special considerations for students, applicants and businesses of color after many called affirmative action that followed the civil rights movement a form of "reverse discrimination."

Guerrero called the proposition a "major setback" that has resulted in a dramatic decrease of minorities in colleges such as San Diego State and UC San Diego. She said it has also contributed to a downward spiral of Latino, black and Native American communities.

To prove her point, Guerrero presented numerous statistics from the 2000 Census data and the California Department of Education that show major disparities in education university admission, poverty as well as wealth and wage gaps after the proposition.

Guerrero called the statistics in education the "most alarming."

According to the data compiled by the group, only 23 percent of blacks and 9 percent of Latinos age 25 or older have a bachelor's degree or higher, compared with 40 percent of whites. Less than one-fifth of freshman admitted last fall into six of the nine University of California campuses were students of color, said Guerrero.

During her presentation, Guerrero urged immediate action is needed to address those statistics since two-thirds of California's K-12 students in public schools are children of color. By 2050, eight of 10 students are projected to be of color.

"A system of privilege and inequality continues to exist," said Guerrero. "We are all going to suffer because of it."

Guerrero also said minority-owned businesses have suffered since the initiative was passed because they have lost half of their public contracts in the past decade.

John Herrera, president of the local League of United Latin American Citizens, a Latino civil rights organization, said the forum was the first step to begin an important dialogue not only on current statistics but also to review the outcome of affirmative action.

"It's imperative upon us as a society to address inequalities to build and maintain a healthy society," said Herrera.

Arduizur Richie-Zavaleta, a sociology professor at MiraCosta College who attended the forum, said she appreciated the presentation because it was the first step to addressing what she believes is a major social problem.

"Proposition 209 has negatively impacted our communities," said Richie-Zavaleta. "It will continue to do so until we do something to change the course of our history. I believe it can be done."

The forum is the first in a series of four being held this week. The others will be at City Heights, San Diego City College and the Educational Cultural Complex in San Diego.

For more information on the forums, or to view all current statistics on immigration, voting and education in San Diego County and the state of California, go to www.equalitysandiego.org

-- Contact staff writer Brenda Duran at (760) 761-4408 or bduran@nctimes.com. :30 PM,02/21/2007 09:57:13 PM,02/21/2007 10:00:14 PM,02/21/2007 10:00:44 PM

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2007/02 ... _21_07.txt

Comments On This Story

Note: Comments reflect the views of readers and not necessarily those of the North County Times or its staff.

Privileged College Grad wrote on February 21, 2007 11:21 PM:"As a college educated white male who came from nothing and thought that everything I achieved thus far in my life was the result of hard work, I was a little taken-aback to learn that my success was a direct result of a "system of privilege". I honestly didn’t know that. The only explanation I can think of is that my family didn't get the memo or something. I was never taught the secret hand-shake or anything. Heck, I kind of feel left out now. I’ve always wanted to be a member of an exclusive club. Aside from this article containing complete nonsense, it begs the question: Why is it that Asian students seem to excel and are represented at higher rates than even whites in college? Is it because the system is biased to help Asian students? Well, yes…in that standardized tests and scholastic achievement are biased towards people who actually know the answers and do the work. Could it be that Asian cultures promote education more than other cultures? Could it be that they have fewer single-parent families? Perhaps the people who are complaining about the lack of affirmative action need to look deep within the African-American and Latino cultures and community to find the solution to their limited representation in college. A little honest analysis might have interesting results. By the way, there is no such thing as “reverse discrimination”. The term “reverse discrimination”, when used in reference to discrimination against white people, implies that the “discrimination” itself is inherently white vs non-white. That’s nonsense. Discrimination is discrimination, no matter what color you are. "

pathetic wrote on February 21, 2007 11:37 PM:"As usual, the fight for equal rights isn't about equal rights, but about Hispanics wanting something for free that everyone else has worked for with their own money, sweat and tears. "

White guy wrote on February 21, 2007 11:40 PM:"I'm a little sick of hearing about "people of color." Isn't white a color? "

Greg in Oceanside wrote on February 22, 2007 5:02 AM:"I have to agree with “privileged college grad” on this. I too am white and college educated. In high school I worked hard and was a good student, but my “privileged” parents didn’t have the money to send me to college. And since we didn’t know the “secret handshake” either, I joined the service for the GI Bill. This didn’t nearly cover the costs for my education, so I had to work my way through school. Doing this wasn’t easy and at times I felt overburdened, but stuck it out and eventually finished. Most importantly, nothing was handed to me. Who is to blame for these “statistics” regarding minorities being underrepresented in the universities? Are we to now give the free pass to those less deserving? I’m about fairness, not quotas. Why should we give a free ride, or access to college because of someone’s skin color? It’s about academic achievement, not race. So, if Latino or black students want to go to college, they need to earn the hard way just like everyone else."

Randy wrote on February 22, 2007 6:50 AM:"These "privileged" Cal State San Marcos students need to climb down from their ivory towers and get jobs in the real world. Quit whining about the inequities of life and get to work! Whoever said that life is fair? It is not fair. Go flip burgers at McDonalds. That is all your multicultural degrees will get you!"

Randy wrote on February 22, 2007 6:51 AM:"It is this multicultural whining and complaining that caused the North County backlash that focused on illegal immigrants. Look at what all your whining and complaining got you!"

Randy wrote on February 22, 2007 6:53 AM:"If this article is indicative of the students in the Cal-State system, the current crop of professors do not deserve any pay raises!"

DW wrote on February 22, 2007 7:23 AM:"I'm confused, do you want equal treatment or special treatment? DO BETTER! Look at the Asians they are kicking butt, they don't make excuses. Also it is hard to afford college if you have 6 kids. Don't worry Cal. San Marcos will let you in, as long as you are a minority it doesn't matter if you have merit. Also you don't think its tough for white kids? They don't get in to certain schools if they are not into the 4.1 and up range. Grow UP!"

I was. wrote on February 22, 2007 7:36 AM:"I know the secret handshake. Ill teach it to you at the next "super secret oppresive white man meeting". I was a single father, worked two jobs and manageed to put myself through college.. I couldnt have done it without all those back door deals that only white males are eligible for. Our sister club .. the "privleged asian super secret alliance" is in league in our plan to take over the world and oppress minorities by taking all the high paying jobs. /sarcasm off. So basically this article says.. without discrimination to HELP blacks, Latinos and American Indians.. they just cant get into college?? I never knew keeping the white man down was the secret to their success?!"

Scott wrote on February 22, 2007 7:37 AM:"I believe in equal treatment for all, but not special treatment for anyone. I believe, like priveleged said that you get what you earn, work hard get ahead. Freebies are keeping people down as much as discrimination. People need to take care of themselves not have the government take care of them."

Always wondered if... wrote on February 22, 2007 7:58 AM:"now that Affirmative Action is gone, who do marginally qualified white dudes blame now for not being hired? My hunch is that at some point, there will be a federally mandated program to give these losers the head of the line, but when the shoe is on the other foot, they will call it fair, and not reverse discrimination."

Color/race blind wrote on February 22, 2007 8:12 AM:"College admissions should be based on performance. Bottom line. Showing preference by race and or color only hurts everyone."

Ask wrote on February 22, 2007 8:56 AM:"So according to these "speakers", black men when playing basketball should have 10lb weights tied to their ankles because they can jump higher than everyone else and that mexican field workers should have 1 hand tied behind their back while in the fields so that others can pick just as fast as them. What they are petioning for is racism at its finest! "

Concerned wrote on February 22, 2007 8:57 AM:"Am I missing something? Prop 209 prohibits public institutions from discriminating on the basis of race, sex or ethnicity. That's pretty straight forward. This movement is against that? Hmmmm...what might you call that? Surely not racisim. No. Not from Communist State San Marcos! "

American woman wrote on February 22, 2007 9:22 AM:"Gimmee, gimmee, gimmee. "

ENTITLEMENT wrote on February 22, 2007 10:01 AM:" "I'd like us to shift (our programs) from entitlement to empowerment. In the end, we want people not to need us anymore." William Jefferson Clinton - State of the Union Address 2/17/93. These may be the most important words that came out of his mouth - other than "Good cigar!""

Isn't white the minority now? wrote on February 22, 2007 10:57 AM:"Can someone teach me the white persons secret handshake also? I worked full time and took 18-24 units a semester...WHICH i had to pay FULL price for every unit i took of my three degrees! Why can't they? BTW my fiance is BLACK! and oh my.......sorry to ruin the poor underprivledged statistics, he too graduated from college, which he paid for and worked hard for. What are these people talking about???? Basically they are putting there own races down. Implying they can't work hard to pay for college, and are not intelligent enough. Privileged College Grad hit it RIGHT on the button. I did not have money to go to college after high school, and I still went! It was hard but I did it. Everyone has the same opportunity to go to college. I'm so sick and tired of people making excuses for not bettering themselves...its not RACE. It has nothing to do with discrimination! "

Blair wrote on February 22, 2007 12:09 PM:"I thought Asian-Americans outnumbered non-Hispanic whites at California's flagship schools. Don't they count as "people of color?" Do they develop blond hair and blue eyes as their SAT scores increase?"

Concerned wrote on February 22, 2007 12:17 PM:"To ENTITLEMENT 10:01 am: I'm still laughing. Best post of the month!"

Skip wrote on February 22, 2007 12:50 PM:"These days when you are talking about minorities, you mean Caucasains? Right?"

What? wrote on February 22, 2007 1:15 PM:"I want to know what is going on at CSSM? They have the most racist people working and attending school there. I have never heard so much crap from a University since affirmative action was going on at Michigan State. If all you whiners would work as hard as you whine you could do amazing things with your life!"

Mark wrote on February 22, 2007 1:23 PM:"Man, I will never send my children to this school. I want them to get a great education. If this school keeps this up they will lose a lot of great people, black, white, asian, etc.. What a sad world we live in. These people complaining want everything from the U.S. but don't want to give anything in return. It is just take, take, take!"

San Marcos Taxpayer wrote on February 22, 2007 1:51 PM:"If you work hard, and qualify, then you can be admitted and you have earned the right to pay for your education like I did. No one gave me anything but a chance and I took advantage of that opportunity. EARN SOMETHING - ENOUGH OF THE FREE PASSES!! "

How about no more legacy admissions wrote on February 22, 2007 2:54 PM:"How about no more legacy admissions for those that had parents that graduated at that respective University. Or giving special admission to children of parents that were big donors to the university. Thats the system of privilege folks. "

legacy admissions and rich donors wrote on February 22, 2007 3:29 PM:" There should not be a box to check on applications for those that had relatives that graduated at the college. Admissions department should not have any relationship with the administration to favor those families that give large donations to the university. This is dollar based affirmitive action."

GFN wrote on February 22, 2007 3:43 PM:"Excellent job, posters of today! Your comments exposed the defective reasoning of those who refuse to attack the real problem: The need to change the attitude of the less educated from that of casual deference to an urgent desire to obtain as much education as possible. Until the change, this should be the last forum that this "Equality Alliance" holds."

JR wrote on February 22, 2007 4:54 PM:"Their attitude reminds me of that SNL skit with Eddie Murphy where he dresses up as a white man and rides the bus. As soon as the last black guy leaves the bus, the whole bus turns into a white people party with caviar, champagne, etc. If we could dig up the men who passed the 14th Amendment after the civil war and show them that it was being used by illegal aliens to bring discrimination claims against governmental institutions, they would repeal it. "

Add Your Comments or Letter to the Editor

JR wrote on February 22, 2007 4:54 PM:"Their attitude reminds me of that SNL skit with Eddie Murphy where he dresses up as a white man and rides the bus. As soon as the last black guy leaves the bus, the whole bus turns into a white people party with caviar, champagne, etc. If we could dig up the men who passed the 14th Amendment after the civil war and show them that it was being used by illegal aliens to bring discrimination claims against governmental institutions, they would repeal it. "

Add Your Comments or Letter to the Editor

Brilliant analogy.

But you need to watch the sketch yourself in order to see just how spot-on that comment is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpO7g9mLzlw

My votes in!

Halfway through the article I had to ask myself, why don't they ever give the stats for Asians when discussing "minority rights"? The one commentor hit the nail squarely on the head

Look at the Asians they are kicking butt, they don't make excuses.

They don't fit the "victimized minority" mould. Pat Buchanan gives some interesting statistics on Asians in his Death of the West and his more recent book(the name escapes me) as well. People may complain that they like to keep to themselves and preserve their culture etc., which is fine by me if they do - whether they assimilate culturally or not they certainly aren't a drain on our infrastructure, quite the opposite.

Another point, "Andrea Guerrero, an attorney with Equality Alliance who was the keynote speaker of the forum" stated the following

"A system of privilege and inequality continues to exist," said Guerrero. "We are all going to suffer because of it."

Or is it more a system of dependence and inability to clean up their own communities for whatever reasons? Ethnically based Affirmative Action for "balancing" differences between us only perpetuates this, and masks the actual problems and needs. If policies are going to be "race-based" then do it by supporting Historically Black colleges and such, as a "local solution" it would seem far more constructive - and wouldn't exclude more qualified students from getting a higher education as well.

Should universities reinstitute affirmative action to ensure equal access for minorities?

Yes
(36 Votes, 19%)

No
(155 Votes, 80%)

Not Sure
(2 Votes, 1%)

FINAL RESULTS

Should universities reinstitute affirmative action to ensure equal access for minorities?

Date: 02-22-2007 - 02-23-2007

Yes 44 Votes(19%)
No 182 Votes(80%)
Not Sure 2 Votes(1%)