Thread: It's Their War, Not Ours

It's Their War, Not Ours
by Patrick J. Buchanan

03/08/2011

Before the United States plunges into a third war in the Middle East, let us think this one through, as we did not the last two.

What would be the purpose of establishing a no-fly zone over Libya? According to advocates, to keep Moammar Gadhafi from using his air force to attack civilians.

But if Gadhafi uses tanks to crush the rebellion, as Nikita Khrushchev did in Hungary and the Chinese did in Tiananmen Square, would that be OK?

What is the moral distinction between using planes to kill rebels and running over them with tanks? Do we Americans just want to see a fair fight?

To establish a secure no-fly zone, we would have to bomb radar installations, anti-aircraft batteries, missile sites and airfields, and destroy the Libyan air force on the ground, to keep the skies secure for U.S. pilots.

These would be acts of war against a nation that has not attacked us.

Where do we get the legal and moral right to do this? Has Congress, which alone has the power to declare war, authorized Barack Obama to attack Libya?

The president may respond to an attack on American territory or U.S. citizens, but Libya has not done that since Lockerbie, more than two decades ago.

Since that atrocity, George W. Bush and Condi Rice welcomed Gadhafi in from the cold, after he paid $10 million in blood money to the families of each of the Lockerbie victims.

What, then, is our present justification for attacking Libya?

The U.N. Security Council has not authorized military action against Libya. No NATO ally has been attacked. Why is Libya not a problem for the Arab League and the African Union, rather than the United States, 5,000 miles away?

Last week, the Senate whistled through a nonbinding resolution urging the creation of a no-fly zone. Call it the Sidra Gulf resolution.

But what are U.S. senators doing issuing blank checks for war eight years after George W. Bush cashed the last one to commit the historic blunder of invading Iraq? Do these people learn at all from history?

That war cost the Republican Party the Congress in 2006 and presidency in 2008. Far worse, it cost the country 40,000 dead and wounded, a trillion dollars, and the respect of hundreds of millions of Arabs and Muslims who saw the war as an imperial attempt to crush a nation that had done nothing to the United States.

Assume we attack Gadhafi's air defenses, and in the collateral damage are a dozen children -- like those kids collecting sticks on that hillside in Afghanistan -- and Al-Jazeera spreads footage of their dismembered bodies across the Middle East, as commentators rail, "The Americans are killing Muslims again, this time for Libya's oil." The pro-democracy demonstrations across the Middle East would instantly become anti-American riots.

If we destroy Gadhafi's air defenses, could we simply let the rebels and regime fight it out? If Libyans, seeing us intervene, rose up against Gadhafi, could we let them be massacred as Bush I let the tens of thousands of Shiites be massacred who rose up in 1991 against Saddam after Bush urged them to do so?

If we attack Libya, we could not let Gadhafi prevail and plot revenge attacks on U.S. airliners. Having wounded the snake, we would have to go in and kill it. And the interventionists know this, and this is what they are all about.

Never strike a king unless you kill him. In for a dime, in for a dollar. If we declare a no-fly zone, we have to attack Libya. And if we attack Libya, an act of war, we have to see that the war is won.

And after that victory, we could not wash our hands and walk away. We would have to ensure the new government was democratic and a model to the Muslim world, as we are trying to do in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Do we really want to adopt another Muslim country?

Don't start down a road the end of which you cannot see or do not know. There is no vital U.S. interest in whether Gadhafi wins or is deposed. We ought to stay out. This is their war, not ours.

Churchill once said: Take away this pudding, it has no theme.

What is the theme, where is the consistency in U.S. policy?

We backed the dictators Zine El Abidine Ben Ali in Tunisia and Hosni Mubarak in Egypt, who were as autocratic as Gadhafi, whom we demand be deposed.

We support the dictator in Yemen, the absolute monarch in Saudi Arabia, the king in Bahrain, the sultan in Oman and the emir in Kuwait, but back pro-democracy demonstrators in Iran, though there have been more elections in Iran than in all those other nations put together.

America has taken a terrible beating for what she has done and tried and failed to do in that region for a decade.

Let the "world community" take the lead on this one.

Tell them, this time, the Yanks are not coming.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=42181

"ONE MAN WITH COURAGE IS A MAJORITY" Thomas Jefferson

The Federal Government has us wrapped up in so much shit THEY dont know if we are coming or going

Its no wonder the world is Pissed OFF at the US

but its not the US the World needs to be Pissed off at

it's a couple dozen Megalomaniacs that need to be put on trial

Bring our young soldiers home and send these Traiterous MEGA~La~F'n~Goof Balls that cant do shit right but start Wars that we can't afford

Put them in Full Battle Rattle out on the front lines

"ONE MAN WITH COURAGE IS A MAJORITY" Thomas Jefferson

If we continue to act as the world's police force then we need to collect monthly fees for protecting said countries, in truth in time it may be the only jobs available to the American worker for as we go around the world helping out they are building up.

Nation building is a stupid idea if attacked we must and should hit with everything available but after that remove ourselves from the area the idea we spend billions building schools and roads for people who may in fact attack us at some point is truly mindless.

Soldier Suicides at Record Level

Increase Linked to Long Wars, Lack of Army Resources
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 03106.html

Heres some of the spectacular head lines

Fort Hood Suicides Hit Record Numbers

Army suicides hit record number in June

Why Are Record Numbers of US Soldiers Committing Suicide?

then you have spectacular FAIL Moments like John McCain's ~ Bomb Bomb Bomb; Bomb Bomb Iran on National TV

This is the best that the Republican party has got? If so... maybe its time for a 3rd party... it's either that or get rid of the Criminal Cabal

These War Criminals / War Proffiteers have bankrupted our Nation while front running stocks in the War Industry... you didnt think they got rich just from politics did you

Then you have Lieberman ~ What in the hell is the matter with this man; thats all he's got is pushing War and more war

lets not forget Wacko NEOCON Lindsey Grahmn ... check out his record on voting for War Attrocities

by the way... get rid of the term defense spending ... call it Attack Spending to be politically correct

We dont do defense ~ we have been an Agressor Nation and are in 120 nations with 170 bases at last count

I just heard from reliable sources (persons stationed in Rome) that there are potentially .3 to 1.5 million refuges right now in the area of Libya who can't leave (for Europe) while Qaddafi is in power. Some of them are from Tunisia, some from Egypt and who know where else, and they go to that area because it is the shortest distance to Italian islands and a toehold in the EU.

They also said that Berlusconi had struck a deal with Qadaffi years ago to assist with infrastructure improvent if Qaddafi would restrain the refugees from heading to Lampedusa and Sicily. Italy is overwhelmed with a refugee problem, not only from the North African countries but also the middle East, places like Afganistan, Turkey, etc. Very controversial.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... ugees.html
Libya: Italy fears 300,000 refugees
Italy fears that up to 300,000 Libyans could try to reach Italian soil as a result of the chaos in the North African country.

Franco Frattini, the foreign minister, said Italy was bracing for an exodus 10 times bigger than the number of Albanians who fled to Italy in the 1990s when the Balkan nation descended into anarchy.

"We know what to expect when the Libyan national system falls – a wave of 200,000 to 300,000 immigrants," Mr Frattini said.

"These are estimates, and on the low side ... It is a Biblical exodus. It's a problem that no Italian should underestimate."

He said about a third of Libya's population, or 2.5 million people, are immigrants from sub-Saharan Africa who could flee if the popular revolt topples the government of Muammar Gaddafi.

Those living in the eastern part of Libya might try to reach Greece, rather than Italy, because it is closer, he said.

Italy's Frattini: If Ghadafi Falls, Refugees Will Overwhelm Europe | Print
Written by R. Cort Kirkwood
Monday, 07 March 2011 09:19
http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php ... elm-europe

If the Libyan government collapses, Italian Foreign Minister Franco Frattini (photo, left) has warned, Europe may suffer an influx of many as 800,000 refugees.
Frattini told London’s Telegraph that an exodus of biblical proportions was on the horizon should the dictatorial regime of Moammar Ghadafi fall to the revolutionaries fighting his forces:

We know what to expect when the Libyan national system falls — a wave of 200,000 to 300,000 immigrants. These are estimates, and on the low side ... It is a Biblical exodus. It’s a problem that no Italian should underestimate.

Frattini said a third of Libya’s 2.5 million people are immigrants from sub-Saharan Africa who will flee the country if Ghadafi falls. Already, thousands of those immigrants are heading for Tunisia. Last week, the New York Times reported that 90,000 refugees were trying to cross into Tunisia.

Ghadafi The Border Guard

Ghadafi, Speigel Online reported in late February, “has enjoyed a cynical role as Europe's border guard against African immigrants.â€

by the way.. we killed over a million Iraqi's; 2 million are displaced; 4 million have permanant Injuries and we are all of the sudden worried about 1,000 Libians

I dont think so

It's all about F'n OIL again

Check out Darfur ... did we ever go there .. HELL NO .. we watched while hundreds of thousands were slaughtered

Why ...

NO F'n OIL

It's not our job, or our duty, to solve the world's problems. The rest of the world needs to take responsibilty for themselves and stop looking to us to fix their problems. I'm sick and tired of countries complaining about us and then when something like Libya happens, the first thing they do is come crying to us to fix it. We need to get out of these foreign entanglements.