Thread: Social Security to Start Cashing Uncle Sam's IOUs

The shortfall is because of the high unemployment, when we fix the economy, and hopefully pass the FairTax, social security and medicare will be fine

I disagree with you. First, the economy is not going to be fixed anytime soon. Nor will the Fair Tax be passed. The number of people drawing Social Security and Medicare are beginning to outnumber the ones paying in. This is especially true for Social Security. Retirements leaped with the increase in unemployment because it was an option to trying to find another job. Even if some of those go back into the work force, they will continue to draw SS.. Both programs are Ponzi schemes. They work until the money pouring in is dwarfed by the money pouring out. Even if the government raises SS and Medicare taxes it will not offset the costs. Future obligations for these two programs alone are pegged at over 100 trillion dollars.

This is one reason for Obama's Health Care reform. He can cut half a trillion dollars from Medicare, and claim he has solved Medicare insolvency, but will also drastically reduce health care benefits to the elderly. Unfortunately, they are the ones that need it the most.

Rep Ryan (Wisconsin, I believe) has a straight forward plan that protects current SS and Medicare beneficiaries, provides for future ones, and resolves the insolvency issues. It is a long term plan. No quick fixes. But in 40 years our national debt will begin to decline (according to the OMB). Right now we are on a course to bankruptcy, and even if the economy came back tomorrow in full vigor our long term debt obligations will suck it up in a manner that would make Hoover and Dirt Devil jealous.

Originally Posted by 4thHorseman

The shortfall is because of the high unemployment, when we fix the economy, and hopefully pass the FairTax, social security and medicare will be fine

I disagree with you. First, the economy is not going to be fixed anytime soon. Nor will the Fair Tax be passed. The number of people drawing Social Security and Medicare are beginning to outnumber the ones paying in. This is especially true for Social Security. Retirements leaped with the increase in unemployment because it was an option to trying to find another job. Even if some of those go back into the work force, they will continue to draw SS.. Both programs are Ponzi schemes. They work until the money pouring in is dwarfed by the money pouring out. Even if the government raises SS and Medicare taxes it will not offset the costs. Future obligations for these two programs alone are pegged at over 100 trillion dollars.

This is one reason for Obama's Health Care reform. He can cut half a trillion dollars from Medicare, and claim he has solved Medicare insolvency, but will also drastically reduce health care benefits to the elderly. Unfortunately, they are the ones that need it the most.

Rep Ryan (Wisconsin, I believe) has a straight forward plan that protects current SS and Medicare beneficiaries, provides for future ones, and resolves the insolvency issues. It is a long term plan. No quick fixes. But in 40 years our national debt will begin to decline (according to the OMB). Right now we are on a course to bankruptcy, and even if the economy came back tomorrow in full vigor our long term debt obligations will suck it up in a manner that would make Hoover and Dirt Devil jealous.

Are you sure about SS benefits and working full-time? I didn't know people who wanted to continue working to a later age could sign up for SS and still work full time. Is that something new or has it always been that way? I thought they could only earn up to a certain small amount.

If that's the case, then isn't fixing the economy and passing the FairTax even more crucial?

We're already bankrupt. We already have more government and personal debt as a nation than our economy on its present course can ever repay because we already have more people than jobs. Changing SS won't fix the economy. The only way to fix the economy is to reverse the policies that caused this disaster.

Seems to me, we have to stop illegal immigration, pass the FairTax, protect our trade, legalize/regulate/tax under the FairTax the illegal drug trade and drill baby drill. We have to bring home our producers and re-create the 31 million jobs free trade treason has cost the American People; stop illegal immigration and curtail legal immigration so wages and benefits reflate o sustainable levels; repeal the mandated income tax code that has driven our producers and investment capital out of the country while robbing those who earned it and redistributing to those who didn't; take control of the illegal drug trade that keeps our borders open and illegal aliens pouring in as $300 billion a year of our money supply flows out; and lift the ban on domestic oil and gas production so we produce more of our energy supply to fuel our manufacturers and workers with low-cost energy so we can reduce the $400 billion a year we let flow out of the country in foreign oil and gas purchases to the hands and pockets of an oil cartel that couldn't even operate in the US because they violate the Sherman Anti-Trust Act.

In a somewhat normal economy, which we still had an inkling of in 2008, we shipped $840 billion a year out of the country through the purchase of foreign-manufactured goods, and the majority of another $300 billion in illegal drug purchases. The two losses together are over $1.1 trillion a year in lost jobs and money supply for the US.

In addition, under the present US Income Tax Code, we let $1.3 Trillion of tax-exempt revenue our economy generated to be sucked into 501 C 3 "charities" like National Council of La Raza, ACORN and Family Research Council. The FairTax addresses this drain on our economy because contributions to these organizations would no longer be tax deductible because there is no longer an income tax from which to deduct it.

Add the 3 together and the total loss to our production-based income-driven economy is $2.4 Trillion a year.

Now add the cost of the War on Drugs $70 billion and entitlement costs for people on welfare, MediCaid, unemployment and food assistance programs who are under the age of 65 and we lose another $770 billion a year of our economy, because there aren't enough jobs at sustainable wages because of illegal immigration, free trade treason, mandated income tax code and an illegal black market drug trade and the unsustainability they create.

That's $3.2 trillion a year leaving the country, being siphoned off into anti-American and fraudulent business enterprises, or redistributed to people under 65 because they're trapped in the poverty this all generated.

That's before we even think about SS and MediCare.

Today our government is $14 Trillion in debt and not 1 dime of it has anything to do with SS and MediCare which was solvent until this year. We have 30 million unemployed workers who aren't contributing to SS and MediCare because they're unemployed which means their former employers aren't contributing either. That's why SS and MediCare are seeing a shortfall this year.

For now, my suggestion is to leave SS and MediCare out of the equation until we first fix the situation for people under 65. Then, we can take a look at SS and MediCare and if something needs to be fixed there, then I have no objection to fixing it. But at this time with a collapsed economy, a bankrupt government, and 1/3 of our population on some form of government entitlement program, BEFORE we count the people on social security retirement who paid for theirs over 40 or 45 years, (if we add SS, then 1/2 of our population is on some type of government assistance program) ... we must fix the economy and pass the FairTax and do so post haste. The longer we wait to fix our country, the more difficult it will be. Or least so it seems to me.

These are Judy's Five Steps To Fix Our Economy:

1. stop illegal immigration
2. pass the FairTax
3. protect our trade
4. legalize/regulate/tax under 2 the illegal drug trade
5. drill baby drill

Lets try these 5 actions which don't cost US 1 cent of new government spending or raise our national debt by 1 dime and see what happens. What I believe will happen is illegal aliens will go home, our jobs will come home, our people will have more money they get to keep, people on welfare and entitlements will go off the dole because they were hired for one of the jobs that came home or one of the jobs available to them because illegal aliens went home, and things will be as they should have been all along.

Then we can perfect other things like SS and MediCare, if for some reason they haven't already self-corrected in due course by having fixed the economy.

Look at this:

http://dailycaller.com/2010/02/15/recor ... -finances/

[quote]Record numbers receive food stamps as USDA turns blind eye to recipients’ finances

By Aleksandra Kulczuga - The Daily Caller 02/15/10 at 3:07 PM

Food stamp distribution has skyrocketed since the U.S. Department of Agriculture renamed the program Supplemental Nutrition and Assistance Program (SNAP) in 2008 and began pushing states to give federal food aid to people without verifying their finances.

President Obama’s latest proposed budget includes $72.5 billion for the SNAP program, a 30 percent increase over $55.6 spent in 2009. The program is on track to double in size by 2011 — as recently as 2008 it accounted for only $37.6 billion. Since the start of the recession in late 2007, food-stamp rolls jumped from 27 million individuals to 38 million, or 13 percent of the total U.S. population. The federal government hasn’t distributed food aid to this many people since the Great Depression.

“Applicants will not need to provide documentation verifying their resources,â€

Reporting wages to Social Security when you are at full retirement age (FRA).

Question
I am full retirement age (FRA) and still working. Do I have to report my earnings to Social Security?

Answer
No. When you reach FRA you no longer need to report your earnings to Social Security.

You do, however, need to report earnings for those months in the calendar year before the month you reach FRA. For example, if you reach it in May, you would need to report your earnings for the four earlier months.

The law also changed the annual earnings limit for workers who reach FRA during the year. During those months before you reach FRA, your benefits would be reduced $1 for each $3 you earned over the limit which is $37,680 in 2010 and in 2009.

www.socialsecurity.gov

Originally Posted by 4thHorseman

The shortfall is because of the high unemployment, when we fix the economy, and hopefully pass the FairTax, social security and medicare will be fine

I disagree with you. First, the economy is not going to be fixed anytime soon. Nor will the Fair Tax be passed. The number of people drawing Social Security and Medicare are beginning to outnumber the ones paying in. This is especially true for Social Security. Retirements leaped with the increase in unemployment because it was an option to trying to find another job. Even if some of those go back into the work force, they will continue to draw SS.. Both programs are Ponzi schemes. They work until the money pouring in is dwarfed by the money pouring out. Even if the government raises SS and Medicare taxes it will not offset the costs. Future obligations for these two programs alone are pegged at over 100 trillion dollars.

This is one reason for Obama's Health Care reform. He can cut half a trillion dollars from Medicare, and claim he has solved Medicare insolvency, but will also drastically reduce health care benefits to the elderly. Unfortunately, they are the ones that need it the most.

Rep Ryan (Wisconsin, I believe) has a straight forward plan that protects current SS and Medicare beneficiaries, provides for future ones, and resolves the insolvency issues. It is a long term plan. No quick fixes. But in 40 years our national debt will begin to decline (according to the OMB). Right now we are on a course to bankruptcy, and even if the economy came back tomorrow in full vigor our long term debt obligations will suck it up in a manner that would make Hoover and Dirt Devil jealous.

The eventuality of older people outnumbering may be why the PAID AHEAD. So now...where is their money? It has shrunk. What if they had to pay back what it was worth at the time they paid in...with interest? I wonder how this cash in is working today?

Originally Posted by JohnDoe2

Reporting wages to Social Security when you are at full retirement age (FRA).

Question
I am full retirement age (FRA) and still working. Do I have to report my earnings to Social Security?

Answer
No. When you reach FRA you no longer need to report your earnings to Social Security.

You do, however, need to report earnings for those months in the calendar year before the month you reach FRA. For example, if you reach it in May, you would need to report your earnings for the four earlier months.

The law also changed the annual earnings limit for workers who reach FRA during the year. During those months before you reach FRA, your benefits would be reduced $1 for each $3 you earned over the limit which is $37,680 in 2010 and in 2009.

www.socialsecurity.gov

Thanks for the info JohnDoe2. So people can work full time with they're FRA without financial restriction and still collect their SS retirement like they would with a corporate retirement. Cool. That's good. But why would their earnings be free from the SS and MediCare Tax?

The FairTax would correct that incongruity as well. Yet another reason to support the FairTax.

www.fairtax.org

Thanks for the info JohnDoe2. So people can work full time with they're FRA without financial restriction and still collect their SS retirement like they would with a corporate retirement. Cool. That's good. But why would their earnings be free from the SS and MediCare Tax?

There are two types of reporting. If you retire before your full retirement age (FRA) (it used to be 65, but now it is later depending on when you were born. My FRA is at about 67.5) you must report earnings to SS because they dock your social security check. Since you already retired early, and were docked for that to start, this is an additional reduction in your SS payment. Between the time you retire, say at 62 and when you reach your official SS retirement age you are allowed to earn around 38K without losing any of your established SS. Above that it amounts to around 1 dollar per every 3 dollars earned above that (see quote below). However, after you reach your official SS retirement age, you can earn any amount you desire without penalty.. If you do not start collecting SS until your official retirement age, you receive the full benefits that you are entitled, and you can earn any amount of salary without penalty.

The second type of reporting is from your employer. The employer will continue to deduct SS and Medicare taxes from your salary. You will also earn additonal SS credit for any payments you pay into the system.

The following comes from the SS Web Site:

"The law also changed the annual earnings limit for workers who reach FRA during the year. During those months before you reach FRA, your benefits would be reduced $1 for each $3 you earned over the limit which is $37,680 in 2010 and in 2009."

BTTT

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Social Security to Start Cashing Uncle Sam's IOUs

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