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Thread: The American public overwhelmingly supports a citizenship question on 2020 Census

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Airbornesapper07's Avatar
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    The American public overwhelmingly supports a citizenship question on 2020 Census

    there is no longer a need for the census; it just became a worthless document, waste of money and the American people should just trash it and blow off the corrupt laws that handcuff the American people

    The American public overwhelmingly supports a citizenship question on 2020 Census

    Clever lawyers, supported by the four dogmatic leftists on the Supreme Court plus Chief Justice Roberts, have denied Americans the right to know important information.

    July 3, 2019
    By Thomas Lifson

    A new poll from the Harvard CAPS/Harris Poll released Tuesday reveals that a supermajority of Americans supports the 2020 Census asking respondents if they are American citizens. Julia Manchester writes in The Hill:
    Sixty-seven percent of voters said the census should be able to ask whether people living in the U.S. are citizens, going against the recent Supreme Court decision on the matter, according to a new Harvard CAPS/Harris Poll.

    The poll also found that the inclusion of the question was supported among members of both parties, with 88 percent of Republicans and 52 percent of Democrats supporting its inclusion.
    Sixty-three percent of independents said they supported including the question on the census.

    Clever lawyers, supported by the four dogmatic leftists on the Supreme Court plus Chief Justice Roberts, have denied Americans the right to know how many non-citizens are living in our territory because they fear the political implications of an accurate count. It appears that the Census forms will be printed without the question, even though it appears that once Secretary Ross of the Department of Commerce restates his rationale for the question — a bureaucratic version of the children's game "Captain, may I?" — the question will be permitted by the all-knowing SCOTUS...for the 2030 Census, assuming that a Democrat president doesn't deep-six it.
    The Left is clever at lawfare — using the intricacies, costs, and delays of the legal process as a political weapon. In this disgraceful episode, leftists have frustrated the gathering of useful, reasonable data that a two-to-one majority of Americans wants. As in so many other respects, the Left truly believes that "ignorance is bliss."
    My guess is that President Trump will not let this matter drop. At a minimum, he will campaign on the need to know how many non-citizens live here and will criticize the Supreme Court and state that he needs to make more appointments to the federal bench at all levels to reverse the trend of judges inserting their policy preferences into decisions that frustrate the political will of the American people.
    I also wonder how much it would cost to reprint the census forms and whether it could be done in time for the Census once a legal disposition is attained. I would happily donate to a fund to reprint the Census forms.

    Hat tip: Roger Luchs.

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  2. #2
    Senior Member Beezer's Avatar
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    The Democrats cannot WIN unless they lie, cheat, steal, and throw the American people and our country under the bus and bankrupt us all with their lawlessness!!!
    TO BECOME AN AMERICAN YOU MUST CHANGE YOUR VALUES ...NOT YOUR LOCATION

    STAY HOME AND BUILD AMERICA ON YOUR SOIL

  3. #3
    Senior Member Airbornesapper07's Avatar
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    Roll Tide: Alabama versus the Census

    Democrats dismiss Alabama's challenge to the Supreme Court's recent illegal immigration Census ruling at their peril.


    July 3, 2019

    By James V. DeLong

    In Department of Commerce v. New York, Chief Justice Roberts joined with the Court's four social justice warriors (Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Breyer, Kagan) in refusing to uphold the Commerce Department's decision to add a citizenship question to the 2020 Census.
    The decision was important but should not be overblown. Roberts's rationale was based on a narrow point and is remediable. On the substance, he was with the four conservative justices.
    The flaw in the administration's approach is that the Department of Commerce chose to peg its decision to a need to obtain better information to enforce the Voting Rights Act. No one believes this, and Roberts said, quoting a distinguished judge of his student days, "Our review is deferential, but we are 'not required to exhibit a naiveté from which ordinary citizens are free'" ( Slip. Op. at 28 ). He wants Commerce to level with the Court.
    And so it should. The real issue, as every fool knows, is that the Census includes illegal aliens for purposes of apportioning legislative seats and electoral votes, a practice with profound effects on our political system. Understanding the dimensions of the issue is crucial to the functioning of our polity.
    Monica Showalter and Daniel John Sobieski have discussed these effects with their usual perspicuity here in AT. One would be well advised to read these articles, because you certainly will not learn about the problems in the 92 pages of Supreme Court opinion. The closest you will come is reading the four SJWs' concern that asking a citizenship question will cause an undercounting of illegal aliens, and this will deprive these non-citizens of the representation to which they, and the states that harbor them, are entitled.
    The issue of the Census question on citizenship is important, but more significant is a case in a U.S. District Court in Alabama, in which the state and U.S. representative Mo Brooks claim that the Constitution actually prohibits inclusion of illegal aliens in the population base for purposes of apportionment.
    The MSM pay no attention to this lawsuit because they want to keep the Overton Window firmly fixed. But the plaintiffs have serious arguments, and even if they lose, they should open our collective eyes to possibilities of congressional or presidential action.
    Analysis starts with Section 2, Clause 3 of the Constitution, which allocates congressional seats among the states "according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons," three fifths of the number of all other persons. It then provides for an accounting of these numbers in a manner to be directed by Congress.
    After the Civil War, the 14th Amendment, adopted in 1868, changed the formula slightly. Slavery was dead, and so was the three fifths clause, so the 14th Amendment specified apportionment "by counting the whole number of persons in each state."
    Two ambiguities becloud this seemingly simple language.
    The first is the meaning of "persons." In 1789, the category "illegal alien" would have been incomprehensible, because almost everyone was an immigrant or close to it, the borders were open, and citizenship was easily obtained. The term "inhabitant" was used interchangeably with "person," as shown by the 1790 Census Act. Clearly, the Framers did not want limit enumeration to citizens, but "illegal aliens" was an empty set.
    The second ambiguity is who counts as "in a state." The "you must count every nose" argument quickly falls to the reductio ad absurdum: if a million-person Canadian army invaded Maine, would the state be entitled to additional congressional seats?
    In fact, the Census Bureau makes choices. It counts expat Americans who are not in a state because they work overseas for the federal government, but it does not count other expats. Domestic travelers are counted in their home states, not in their physical locations on April 1.
    The bureau does not count foreign tourists, even though they are, obviously, in a state. But many illegal residents came in legitimately and then overstayed their visas, so when do they change from "foreign visitors," thus uncounted, into countable inhabitants? What if the visitor announces an intention to stay even before his visa runs out? What about illegal aliens who are under deportation orders, subject to immediate removal? If one's plane departs on March 31, is he uncountable, but if weather delays it a day to the official April 1 Census day, then he adds to the state's congressional representation? What about the Texas census-taker who sees someone climbing the wall — how much of the body must be over the line?
    It is oddly difficult to discern the reasons for the bureau's choices. In preparation for the 2020 Census, it had three rounds of notices in the Federal Register on its Residence Rule, but it stayed relentlessly trivial.
    It noted: "One commenter expressed concern about the impact of including undocumented people [sic] in the population counts for redistricting[.]" The bureau response was to dismiss this as "out of scope for this document." So for what document would it have been "in scope"?
    Much as the bureau might like to pretend there is nothing to see here, there is in fact a lot to consider. Daniel Horowitz, editor of the Conservative Review, documents a number of useful sources in his article "It's time to stop counting illegal aliens in the census" and his book Stolen Sovereignty: judicial opinions to the effect that someone in the nation illegally is not really "here," an 1860s treatise explicating the 14th Amendment, and other writings. The papers in Alabama's lawsuit containing arresting arguments on the original public meaning of the constitutional language. A Congressional Research Service report, "Constitutionality of Excluding Aliens from the Census for Apportionment and Redistricting Purposes" (2012) by two attorneys who, probably wisely, chose to remain anonymous, provides a rich volume of material, even though their conclusions are dubious.
    Boiling all this down, the Alabama litigation raises five major issues about including illegal aliens in the official enumeration for apportionment purposes:

    1. That doing so violates the Constitution because the provision limiting enumeration to persons within a state is meant to include only legal inhabitants, not those here illegally.
    2. That the clause is ambiguous, so Congress could pass a law specifying whether to include illegals.
    3. While Congress could pass a law, it has not done so; instead, it punted to the secretary of commerce when it directed him to conduct the Census "in such form and content as he may determine" (13 USC sec. 141). He has, in the past, included illegals, but he has authority to reverse that decision.
    4. That if the clause is read as allowing, but not compelling, inclusion of illegal aliens, the bureau's decision to include them transgresses the constitutional rights of U.S. citizens by diluting their votes in a manner prohibited by the Supreme Court's series of one-person, one-vote decisions.
    5. That the bureau's decision to include illegal aliens is not explained in the Residence Rule, in contradiction of elementary administrative law requirements. (Note that a lack of explanation was Roberts's ground for remanding the Census question case, in which the four SJWs joined him. It will be interesting to see if they can explain why a total lack of any explanation for the Residence Rule is acceptable.

    To add to the complexity, the government moved to dismiss the Alabama complaint on the grounds that plaintiffs lack standing, a move slapped down by the judge on June 6. If you wonder whom the bureaucracy works for, look no farther. It is hard to imagine a witting secretary of commerce taking that position, which is at odds with the policy views of the administration, but the Deep State probably did not bother to ask him.
    It is going to be an interesting ride.

    Image: CSPAN via YouTube.

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  4. #4
    Senior Member Beezer's Avatar
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    We should NOT be representing illegal aliens residing in our country.

    No more seats in the White House representing these foreigners.

    No Federal Tax dollars paying for illegal aliens!!
    TO BECOME AN AMERICAN YOU MUST CHANGE YOUR VALUES ...NOT YOUR LOCATION

    STAY HOME AND BUILD AMERICA ON YOUR SOIL

  5. #5
    Senior Member Airbornesapper07's Avatar
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    DEVELOPING: A Single Tweet From Trump About Citizenship Question on Census Prompts Federal Judges to Convene Emergency Conferences

    July 3, 2019, 3:07 pm by Cristina Laila 435 Comments



    A single tweet from President Trump on Wednesday about the citizenship question on the 2020 census prompted two federal judges to convene emergency conferences.


    “The News Reports about the Department of Commerce dropping its quest to put the Citizenship Question on the Census is incorrect or, to state it differently, FAKE! We are absolutely moving forward, as we must, because of the importance of the answer to this question,” Trump tweeted Wednesday morning, contradicting previous statements made by the DOJ and Commerce Dept.

    The News Reports about the Department of Commerce dropping its quest to put the Citizenship Question on the Census is incorrect or, to state it differently, FAKE! We are absolutely moving forward, as we must, because of the importance of the answer to this question.

    46.1K people are talking about this

    Adam Klasfeld, a reporter for Courthouse News said on Wednesday of Trump’s tweet, “This single tweet prompted two U.S. federal judges presiding over census litigation in to convene emergency conferences, one of which is starting now.”

    1,140 people are talking about this

    “To clarify, the first federal judge convened the emergency conference. The second announced he would convene an emergency conference depending on what happens during the first.” he added in a follow up tweet.
    The Justice Department sent out an email opposing counsel Tuesday announcing the decision to print the census questionnaire without the citizenship question following a defeat by the Supreme Court last week.
    Both a DOJ spox and Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross confirmed on the record that the Census forms were being printed without the citizenship question so reporters were confused by Trump’s Wednesday morning tweet.
    And now two federal judges, one in New York and one in Maryland, are convening in emergency conferences trying to get answers.


    Two plaintiffs demanded information this morning on Trump’s tweet contradicting the DOJ and Commerce Department’s statements about dropping the citizenship question.

    WRINKLE: Plaintiffs in the #2020Census case demanded info this morning on Trump’s tweet last night contradicting @TheJusticeDept and @CommerceGov statements about dropping the citizenship question

    Judges in NY and Maryland want answers, stat. @CourthouseNews

    Daily Mail editor David Martosko has a possible explanation for the confusion:

    20 people are talking about this

    This story is still developing…The Gateway Pundit will update as more information becomes available.

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/07/developing-a-single-tweet-from-trump-about-citizenship-question-on-census-prompts-federal-judges-to-convene-emergency-conferences/
    Beezer likes this.
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