Thread: Did Anyone Else Pick Up On This?

Originally Posted by MW

swatchick wrote:

In this proposed legislation they claim people have to pay a fine and go back home. Now in one of the newpaper articles they gave a top 5 or 10 list of which countries the illegals came from. China made the list. Now how can they go back to communist China and apply?

I believe I heard them say on the Senate floor that the illegals don't have to go home, they just have to apply from outside the United States. For example, someone from China could step into Mexico to apply. Now that makes a lot of sense, doesn't it?

If what I heard was correct and they did apply from a country that wasn't their original homeland, wouldn't they then be an illegal immigrant in the country they were applying from?

Can someone clear this up? Can they apply from any country or does it have to be their original homeland? Either way doesn't make much sense to me, especially in view of what Swatchick said regarding someone from China.

Well MK thats what I heard they can go to any other foreign country, Maybe when they get there they will be arrested for being there illegally

If they get arrested while there, who will be arrested? I mean, don't they usually have multiple false ID's? And which new identity will they register for re-entry with? How on earth will they be verified? Who are they REALLY? Can you imagine the mess if they are certified and legalized by the US government when using a SHARED identity? What a nightmare!

I just want to hear how they expect to enforce any plan. They've never enforced one before, so how do we know any new plan will be enforced? They can come up with ideas, create new laws......but nothing matters if they don't have a detailed description of how it will work....nothing will change. I'm falling into despair over this.....

Originally Posted by tiredofapathy

If they get arrested while there, who will be arrested? I mean, don't they usually have multiple false ID's? And which new identity will they register for re-entry with? How on earth will they be verified? Who are they REALLY? Can you imagine the mess if they are certified and legalized by the US government when using a SHARED identity? What a nightmare!

It would definitly be a nightmare, but I just don't picture it passing it is a stupid idea!! and in know way can work

Well MK thats what I heard they can go to any other foreign country, Maybe when they get there they will be arrested for being there illegally

Sosad, I know you meant the above as a joke...but this is exactly one of the reasons I worry about Section 113 (if it remains the same).
Read 3 (E). Under 'Real ID'.

http://www.alipac.us/modules.php?nam...ht=section+113


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TITLE I--BORDER ENFORCEMENT
Subtitle B--Border Security Plans, Strategies, and Reports

SEC. 113. REPORTS ON IMPROVING THE EXCHANGE OF INFORMATION ON NORTH AMERICAN SECURITY.

Quote:
(a) Requirement for Reports- Not later than 1 year after the date of the enactment of this Act, and annually thereafter, the Secretary of State, in coordination with the Secretary and the heads of other appropriate Federal agencies, shall submit to Congress a report on improving the exchange of information related to the security of North America.

NAU

(b) Contents- Each report submitted under subsection (a) shall contain a description of the following:

(1) SECURITY CLEARANCES AND DOCUMENT INTEGRITY- The progress made toward the development of common enrollment, security, technical, and biometric standards for the issuance, authentication, validation, and repudiation of secure documents, including--

(A) technical and biometric standards based on best practices and consistent with international standards for the issuance, authentication, validation, and repudiation of travel documents, including--
(i) passports;
(ii) visas; and
(iii) permanent resident cards;

(B) working with Canada and Mexico to encourage foreign governments to enact laws to combat alien smuggling and trafficking, and laws to forbid the use and manufacture of fraudulent travel documents and to promote information sharing;

NAU

(C) applying the necessary pressures and support to ensure that other countries meet proper travel document standards and are committed to travel document verification before the citizens of such countries travel internationally, including travel by such citizens to the United States; and

Ever heard of fraudulent documents, corruption, bribery?

(D) providing technical assistance for the development and maintenance of a national database built upon identified best practices for biometrics associated with visa and travel documents.

REAL ID Fraud possible, ID theft easy.

(2) IMMIGRATION AND VISA MANAGEMENT- The progress of efforts to share information regarding high-risk individuals who may attempt to enter Canada, Mexico, or the United States, including the progress made--

Criminals? Gang members, drug and human traffickers? Terrorists?

(A) in implementing the Statement of Mutual Understanding on Information Sharing, signed by Canada and the United States in February 2003; and

(B) in identifying trends related to immigration fraud, including asylum and document fraud, and to analyze such trends.

(3) VISA POLICY COORDINATION AND IMMIGRATION SECURITY- The progress made by Canada, Mexico, and the United States to enhance the security of North America by cooperating on visa policy and identifying best practices regarding immigration security, including the progress made-

NAU, NAU, NAU

(A) in enhancing consultation among officials who issue visas at the consulates or embassies of Canada, Mexico, or the United States throughout the world to share information, trends, and best practices on visa flows;

(B) in comparing the procedures and policies of Canada and the United States related to visitor visa processing, including--
(i) application process;
(ii) interview policy;

(iii) general screening procedures;

(iv) visa validity;

(v) quality control measures; and

(vi) access to appeal or review;

(C) in exploring methods for Canada, Mexico, and the United States to waive visa requirements for nationals and citizens of the same foreign countries;

OBL, and UN plan for 'free immigration'. NAU.

(D) in providing technical assistance for the development and maintenance of a national database built upon identified best practices for biometrics associated with immigration violators;

REAL ID

(E) in developing and implementing an immigration security strategy for North America that works toward the development of a common security perimeter by enhancing technical assistance for programs and systems to support advance automated reporting and risk targeting of international passengers;

NAU, which means loss of sovereignty for the USA, as well as for Mexico and Canada. For "common security perimeter" read: one border around Canada, the USA and Mexico.

(F) in sharing information on lost and stolen passports on a real-time basis among immigration or law enforcement officials of Canada, Mexico, and the United States; and

(G) in collecting 10 fingerprints from each individual who applies for a visa.

What, no DNA? Sarcasm intended.

(4) NORTH AMERICAN VISITOR OVERSTAY PROGRAM- The progress made by Canada and the United States in implementing parallel entry-exit tracking systems that, while respecting the privacy laws of both countries, share information regarding third country nationals who have overstayed their period of authorized admission in either Canada or the United States.

Why isn't MEXICO in here? Is any other law-abiding US citizen or LEGAL immigrant a tad concerned re all the data collecting?

(5) TERRORIST WATCH LISTS- The progress made in enhancing the capacity of the United States to combat terrorism through the coordination of counterterrorism efforts, including the progress made--

(A) in developing and implementing bilateral agreements between Canada and the United States and between Mexico and the United States to govern the sharing of terrorist watch list data and to comprehensively enumerate the uses of such data by the governments of each country;

(B) in establishing appropriate linkages among Canada, Mexico, and the United States Terrorist Screening Center; and

(C) in exploring with foreign governments the establishment of a multilateral watch list mechanism that would facilitate direct coordination between the country that identifies an individual as an individual included on a watch list, and the country that owns such list, including procedures that satisfy the security concerns and are consistent with the privacy and other laws of each participating country.

You hear 'bringing our laws in line with each other' meaning the lowest common denominator.

(7) LAW ENFORCEMENT COOPERATION- The progress made in enhancing law enforcement cooperation among Canada, Mexico, and the United States through enhanced technical assistance for the development and maintenance of a national database built upon identified best practices for biometrics associated with known and suspected criminals or terrorists, including exploring the formation of law enforcement teams that include personnel from the United States and Mexico, and appropriate procedures for such teams.

Do you want cops from Mexico in the USA, making arrests, etc. when they are acknowledged to be, some of the most corrupt in the world? Said by a high Mexican official?

Originally Posted by curiouspat

Well MK thats what I heard they can go to any other foreign country, Maybe when they get there they will be arrested for being there illegally

Sosad, I know you meant the above as a joke...but this is exactly one of the reasons I worry about Section 113 (if it remains the same).
Read 3 (E). Under 'Real ID'.



[quote:78lzapve]http://www.alipac.us/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=63420&hig hlight=section+113


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TITLE I--BORDER ENFORCEMENT
Subtitle B--Border Security Plans, Strategies, and Reports

SEC. 113. REPORTS ON IMPROVING THE EXCHANGE OF INFORMATION ON NORTH AMERICAN SECURITY.

Quote:
(a) Requirement for Reports- Not later than 1 year after the date of the enactment of this Act, and annually thereafter, the Secretary of State, in coordination with the Secretary and the heads of other appropriate Federal agencies, shall submit to Congress a report on improving the exchange of information related to the security of North America.

NAU

(b) Contents- Each report submitted under subsection (a) shall contain a description of the following:

(1) SECURITY CLEARANCES AND DOCUMENT INTEGRITY- The progress made toward the development of common enrollment, security, technical, and biometric standards for the issuance, authentication, validation, and repudiation of secure documents, including--

(A) technical and biometric standards based on best practices and consistent with international standards for the issuance, authentication, validation, and repudiation of travel documents, including--
(i) passports;
(ii) visas; and
(iii) permanent resident cards;

(B) working with Canada and Mexico to encourage foreign governments to enact laws to combat alien smuggling and trafficking, and laws to forbid the use and manufacture of fraudulent travel documents and to promote information sharing;

NAU

(C) applying the necessary pressures and support to ensure that other countries meet proper travel document standards and are committed to travel document verification before the citizens of such countries travel internationally, including travel by such citizens to the United States; and

Ever heard of fraudulent documents, corruption, bribery?

(D) providing technical assistance for the development and maintenance of a national database built upon identified best practices for biometrics associated with visa and travel documents.

REAL ID Fraud possible, ID theft easy.

(2) IMMIGRATION AND VISA MANAGEMENT- The progress of efforts to share information regarding high-risk individuals who may attempt to enter Canada, Mexico, or the United States, including the progress made--

Criminals? Gang members, drug and human traffickers? Terrorists?

(A) in implementing the Statement of Mutual Understanding on Information Sharing, signed by Canada and the United States in February 2003; and

(B) in identifying trends related to immigration fraud, including asylum and document fraud, and to analyze such trends.

(3) VISA POLICY COORDINATION AND IMMIGRATION SECURITY- The progress made by Canada, Mexico, and the United States to enhance the security of North America by cooperating on visa policy and identifying best practices regarding immigration security, including the progress made-

NAU, NAU, NAU

(A) in enhancing consultation among officials who issue visas at the consulates or embassies of Canada, Mexico, or the United States throughout the world to share information, trends, and best practices on visa flows;

(B) in comparing the procedures and policies of Canada and the United States related to visitor visa processing, including--
(i) application process;
(ii) interview policy;

(iii) general screening procedures;

(iv) visa validity;

(v) quality control measures; and

(vi) access to appeal or review;

(C) in exploring methods for Canada, Mexico, and the United States to waive visa requirements for nationals and citizens of the same foreign countries;

OBL, and UN plan for 'free immigration'. NAU.

(D) in providing technical assistance for the development and maintenance of a national database built upon identified best practices for biometrics associated with immigration violators;

REAL ID

(E) in developing and implementing an immigration security strategy for North America that works toward the development of a common security perimeter by enhancing technical assistance for programs and systems to support advance automated reporting and risk targeting of international passengers;

NAU, which means loss of sovereignty for the USA, as well as for Mexico and Canada. For "common security perimeter" read: one border around Canada, the USA and Mexico.

(F) in sharing information on lost and stolen passports on a real-time basis among immigration or law enforcement officials of Canada, Mexico, and the United States; and

(G) in collecting 10 fingerprints from each individual who applies for a visa.

What, no DNA? Sarcasm intended.

(4) NORTH AMERICAN VISITOR OVERSTAY PROGRAM- The progress made by Canada and the United States in implementing parallel entry-exit tracking systems that, while respecting the privacy laws of both countries, share information regarding third country nationals who have overstayed their period of authorized admission in either Canada or the United States.

Why isn't MEXICO in here? Is any other law-abiding US citizen or LEGAL immigrant a tad concerned re all the data collecting?

(5) TERRORIST WATCH LISTS- The progress made in enhancing the capacity of the United States to combat terrorism through the coordination of counterterrorism efforts, including the progress made--

(A) in developing and implementing bilateral agreements between Canada and the United States and between Mexico and the United States to govern the sharing of terrorist watch list data and to comprehensively enumerate the uses of such data by the governments of each country;

(B) in establishing appropriate linkages among Canada, Mexico, and the United States Terrorist Screening Center; and

(C) in exploring with foreign governments the establishment of a multilateral watch list mechanism that would facilitate direct coordination between the country that identifies an individual as an individual included on a watch list, and the country that owns such list, including procedures that satisfy the security concerns and are consistent with the privacy and other laws of each participating country.

You hear 'bringing our laws in line with each other' meaning the lowest common denominator.

(7) LAW ENFORCEMENT COOPERATION- The progress made in enhancing law enforcement cooperation among Canada, Mexico, and the United States through enhanced technical assistance for the development and maintenance of a national database built upon identified best practices for biometrics associated with known and suspected criminals or terrorists, including exploring the formation of law enforcement teams that include personnel from the United States and Mexico, and appropriate procedures for such teams.

Do you want cops from Mexico in the USA, making arrests, etc. when they are acknowledged to be, some of the most corrupt in the world? Said by a high Mexican official?

[/quote:78lzapve]


I know curious, sorry I was being sarcastic Its a serious bad habit of mine

But listen to the illegals they think its bad and that they are being set up to leave and then won't be let back in

Sosad,

Don't worry about the sarcasm...there are days, (like this entire week) that my sarcasm blood levels are extremely high!

And I know, I keep reading the articles where illegal aliens cry, "it's just not fair"....that they're made to obey the law? I forgot, only AMERICANS and LEGAL immigrants have to obey the law. Oh pul-eeeze.

Do you want cops from Mexico in the USA, making arrests, etc. when they are acknowledged to be, some of the most corrupt in the world? Said by a high Mexican official?

Has not that been the plan all along..it is much easier to arrest people and take them to FEMA camps when it is not one of your own

That's my belief, red.

Originally Posted by curiouspat

Sosad,

Don't worry about the sarcasm...there are days, (like this entire week) that my sarcasm blood levels are extremely high!

And I know, I keep reading the articles where illegal aliens cry, "it's just not fair"....that they're made to obey the law? I forgot, only AMERICANS and LEGAL immigrants have to obey the law. Oh pul-eeeze.

Poor little things they are so miss treated!!