Thread: Fascinating... OBL leaders disagree w/ what's going on....

Wow, this is a fascinating look at two analysis of what is going on from the open border side. As we know, as long as there is infighting like this nothing will be accomplished. They are deeply concerned.... Anyone here of Endgame?? They are talking about boycott's again...



MAYAN CALENDAR NEWS: "OPERATION ENDGAME"....SEVERAL OPINIONS....

OK MAYAN READERS,

Since 2006 we have seen a wave of massive raids, detentions, and deportations of our people all across the USA. It is reported that the ICE are deporting an average of 700 Mexicans a day back to Mexico. All of this sate sponsored terrorism/repression is part of a planned Homeland Gestapo operation known as "Endgame". What follows are several opinions about how to deal with "Operation Endgame"......

Carlos Perez
Founder/Editor
Mayan Calendar News

First, Jorge Mujica of the March 10th Committee:

"Look at it the other way, compas: Endgame started 5 years ago, and it's supposed to be "the way to get rid of all illegal aliens by 2013". So far, in 5 years, despite the last raids, they have arrested, processed and deported less than 200,000 people, some 1.6 percent of their goal. They would need 60 more years to accomplish their goal.

Endgame is more about terrorizing the community than to "wipe us out" and/or expell everybody. We should organize a counter campaign, at local, regional and/or national level, but not necesarilly "protesting in front of ICE offices" (anyone believes that ICE will stop the raids if we proteste in front of them?), but putting pressure directly on the White House.

Oh, yeah, I forgot... all Latino activists are busy supporting the Democrats, registering voters and having citizenship workshops becasue, after all, Obama will stop the raids on January 21st, 2009.

Let's create a better plan to respond than "emergency calls" and emergency protests. Yes, each case, each worker, each mother detained is a problem and we have to find ways to provide help to their sons and dauthers and so on, and we can do some things locally, but we need some coordinated national action to really put pressure on the office that signed Endgame. Remember this is done by Executive order, not because any law says so..."
--
Jorge Mujica
__________________________________________________ ___

Next, Tony Herrera, of Unidos en Arizona:

Dear Jorge,

I wish the situation were as simple as you paint it. The fact is that there is more to Endgame than meets the eye. While its immediate objectives are the detection, arrest, detention and deportation of all undocumented labor in the US, its secondary objectives are to pave the way for the massive "guest worker" (disposable worker) programs that will fill the void the undocumented will leave.

The problem with your analysis is that your premise starts with the assumption that "they can never pull it off". This brings to mind the fight against the anti-immigrant prop 200 here in Arizona back in 2004 when the local leaders casually announced that the measure would "never qualify for the ballot". When it did qualify, their next assertions were, "the voters will never pass it". Resistance mounted in earnest ONE MONTH before the elections due to the time lost believing the forecasters false assumptions. They caused our community to let down its guard. We cannot fall into that mistake, ever.

Their mistake? The assumption that it could never happen and therefore their total, total lack of preparation and counter offensive to MAKE SURE it didn't pass. It is history now and since then at least a a dozen more anti immigrant laws have either passed the legislature or by the voters in the form of propositions.

You fail to take in the global situation in which parties to the World Trade Organization' s GATTS agreement have already decided the fate of the world's migrant workers which will permanently alter the relationship of migrant labor entering developing countries and reduce them to " temporary workers" which will never be allowed to put down roots and integrate into the respective countries in question. Europe is now enforcing an 18 month jail sentence for all "illegal aliens" before their deportation.

You fail to take into account the effects of NAFTA, CAFTA, etc. which has already permanently damaged Mexico's and Central America's economies causing the displacement of their workforces and migrations north to fill the demand for labor. This will guarantee the steady supply of labor into the country which under the controls put in place by Endgame will lock the country down to "illegal" entry. For example here in Arizona alone NINE new detention facilities are being built in preparation for the next phases of Endgame.

The 10 year goal set by Endgame has systematically been carried forth on schedule and with precision. It has been going through incremental stages if you look closely. The second half of its implementation will see alliances built with every major police force both rural and urban to act as immigration agents (its in the plan).

The detention facilities of these police forces will be at the disposal of ICE and will greatly enhance their ability to put undocumented workers into the detention system and deportation. We will see laws passed at the local levels closing doors to undocumented migrants forcing them to stand out for easy identification. Such things as the freezing of bank accounts, requiring all doctors and medical facilities including pharmacies to report the legal status of its client and so on down the line.

We will see alliances with politicians who will bend in order to NOT be called "unpatriotic" and take part in either passing or allowing to pass all types of legislation or policies that will facilitate ICE's work. (its in the plan)

The criminalization in the eyes of the public is a strategic aspect of Endgame which is needed in order to have the public's support in rounding up the "criminal" element in the form of the immmigrant and to justify any and all actions taken against them. We will see the wholesale roundups of another time when immigration agents will assault an apartment building and take its residents away in buses to be sorted out "legal" from "illegal". The public will have grown use to it and in fact will have been won over to see the unfortunate need for such a dirty job. It has happened before in the not too distant past. All signs point in this direction.

ICE's military tactics and armament are more than just for show, they are preparing for a brutal uprooting of a well entrenched community with deep ties in the US and with nothing to go home to in their countries of origin and will intensify their activity until it will appear very similar in conduct with an all out fascist attack against an innocent population reminiscent of Nazi Germany of WWII.

The greatest danger at present is the firm belief by those who should know better that "this can never happen". It can and it will happen UNLESS we, who know better take the necessary steps to build the type of movement at the deep grassroots that can and will neutralize the direction that this country has taken in fulfilling its obligation to the other World Trade Organization members and ruling circles.

A change of administration is a good step forward, but it is no guarantee that Endgame (or the guest work programs) will be halted in its tracks. Remember it was the Democrats that put the first pieces of this complex puzzle into place when they ratified NAFTA and then conveniently became oblivious to its consequences. We must have a plan A and a plan B at all times.

So rather than simply coming up with a better plan to respond to emergencies, lets consider that we are NOW operating under emergency conditions and begin the preparation of our communities for times like those we have only read about in history books and seen in documentaries. Lets not promote the letting down of our guard as the time to reflect on that mistake is not after we realize we were wrong and with no time to change course.

The time to prepare is now, not when it is no longer possible.

Respectfully,

Tony

Now, "yours truly"

__________________________________________________ ________

I am more inclined to agree with Tony's analysis and conclusions. One of the biggest mistakes of the "mainstream" Latino and Immigrant Rights organizations, is that ever since the introduction of the Sensenbrenner HR 4437 in June/July of 2006, these mainstream organizations have been in denial about the dangers that these anti-mexican policies and proposals represent to our community and to everyone in the USA.

I have stated time and again, that the Immigration Enforcement proposals and policies of the Bush Crime Cabal are a smokescreen for imposing a NATIONAL GESTAPO POLICE STATE in the USA.

This has been spelled out in the details of every piece of legislation that has been introduced to the House and Senate since 2006: Sensenbrenner, The STRIVE ACT of Luis Gutierrez, Hale/Martinez Senate bill, the Border Wall, and the Grand Compromise of the Bush/Obama/McCain crime cabal.

I have stated time and again that we, as a people need t flex our muscle......economic and political.

Economic through massive boycotts of targeted industries....Big OIL.....SOLO CITGO!!!

Political via electing our own candidates to the House and Senate where these bills/proposals become law!

The Green Party candidacy of Omar Lopez for Congress is an example of what needs to happen all across then USA in Mexican/Latino and Immigrant communities.

We have to challenge the "powers that be"...peacefully....but head on.....and make them,,,"feel the pain".

The mainstream latino and immigrant organizations would rather live in denial of this "POLICE STATE" reality, and cross their fingers and "hope for the best".

Some may ask, "Why the Police State". It's simple. The Fed does not have enough troop strength to conduct a massive deportation operation. There have been massive deportations of Mexicans in the past, especially immediately after world war II. Many of those Mexicans rounded up on the streets were citizens of the USA. But the Gestapo snatched them from the streets and shipped them out anyway.

The Fed needs manpower to do this. There are not enough Federal troops to deploy for this type of massive operation. Besides, it is a violation of the Posee Comitatus Act. Ergo, FEDERALIZING THE AUTHORITY OF LOCAL POLICE AGENCIES....has become the solution for the Fed to execute their plan.

The result will be a massive NATIONAL GESTAPO POLICE STATE...... and Gente, Obama and all the other presidential "wannabes" are "in step" with this plan for fascism in the USA.

I don't know how much time before the full blown police state is put into "full swing" ....but Tony is right, we have to prepare....and right now....all I see are people living in a state of denial.

Carlos Perez
Founder/Editor
Mayan Calendar News

http://groups.google.com/group/ChicagoM ... 9b49136aa9

A counter post....



jmuji...@aol.com
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More options Aug 26, 8:35 pm
From: jmuji...@aol.com
Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 00:35:31 -0400
Local: Tues, Aug 26 2008 8:35 pm
Subject: Re: [10demarzo:9702] MAYAN CALENDAR NEWS: "OPERATION ENDGAME"....SEVERAL OPINIONS....
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Sorry Carlos, but you are contradicting yourself... you either agree with Tony and his "yes, they can deport us all", or you agree with me and "they can't". My argument is, precisely that Endgame is more a smokescreen than a real program to deport all undocumented immigrants. I believe the real game is to smash our community into fear and submission, NOT TO DEPORT 8 MILLION WORKERS, but to subdue them.

Tony believes we have to prepare against massive deportatios; I believe we have to fight back and prove they can't.

The daily deportation numbers are based on border figures. Yes, each day 700 are deported, from which 650 are deported again the next day and 600 are deported two days later.

What we know, altogether, is that ICE deported 224,000 immigrants last year, out of which 24,000 were workers caught in worplace raids. At this pace, ICE would need... what? 1 million every five years, 2 millions in 10 years, oh, about 60 years to deport all undocumented. Damned! I forgot! Between a quarter million and half a million are getting here every year!! hmmmm... Oberwise and FAIR are right! Immigrants will be the majority in the country in 10 years!

Police state? Yes. Using immigration as a pretext, whoever is in charge will try to impose a state in total and absolute control. Let's accuse all the left, progressives, liberals, unionist?and their friends of being immigrants and let's also deport them.

I respect Tony, but I still believe he is not right. We are not in denial, we just believe and give less credit to Endgame, Chertoff and company. Otherwise, to believe and prepare for the massive deportation of millions of people is... to be part of the terrorist goals of Endgame... and I refuse to do that!

http://groups.google.com/group/10demarz ... 7816514ac7

These "endgame" folks seem to think that LEGAL procedures such as ARREST, DETENTION, and DEPORTATION, are TERRORIST tactics!

We at ALIPAC WILL BE THE ENDGAME!!!!!

10-1 everyone of these pro-illegal invaders is either an illegal themselves or an anchor baby! Anyone who equates the enforcement of our immigration law to "gestapo tactics," a "police state," or "nazi Germany" is seriously delusional! Notice how they never criticize mexico for using brutal force on their sourthern borders to control illegal immigration.

These people are so ignorant and absolutely blinded by their ethno-centric allegiance, that's it's impossibe for them to understand their beloved illegal invaders are going bye bye!