Thread: Why Not Give "Rule of Law" a Chance?

Why Not Give "Rule of Law" a Chance?

Open Letter To Senators Feinstein and Boxer

Dear Senators:

Now that S 1639 and amnesty have apparently failed, perhaps another approach should be pursued.

Nearly everyone agrees that the status quo is unacceptable.

But America does NOT need to legalize 12-30 illegal aliens and position them on a path to citizenship in order to solve the illegal alien nightmare.

Existing laws, while not perfect, provide a more than adequate remedy. Those laws prohibit U.S. employers from hiring illegal aliens and mandate deportation of those here illegally.

All that is lacking is a commitment on the part of the president and the U.S. Congress to enforce the law.

Why not try this simple formula?

* Secure the borders with military force;

* Prosecute employers who hire illegal aliens, and

* Enforce all immigration laws, including deportations.

Or, to steal a slogan from past anti-war campaigns, "Give Rule of Law a Chance!"

Sincerely,

John W. Lillpop
San Jose California

That's a great letter. You've reduced the issue to it's simplest term. It wouldn't hurt for all senators to get a copy.

This is exactly how I feel!!!

I generally agree with your statement. However, I would like to ask why conservatives have suddenly seized upon immigration as the point where the rule of law has broken down? I definitely want to see our immigration laws enforced. But I am also aware that there has been the growth of a huge blackmarket in this country that evades taxes and pilfers public assistance programs.

For example, our Social Security system is in dire jeopardy, and it will be exacerbated by the huge crush of baby-boomers soon to be seeking retirement benefits. And, FYI, there are a lot of gamers already fleecing the system. BUT, all of ths could be alleviated if the US government would collect the roughly $200 Billion dollars that is unpaid each year, that is legally owing to the IRS. And it has been proven that there are cost-effective ways to do this. This is an area of the law that I think should simply be enforced, rather than Congress engaging in a lengthy debate.

A second point I have been raising. Do you advocate imprisonment or payment of fines or a combination? In most cases, with the exception of mentally deranged or inherently violent people, our prison system is costing huge amounts of tax money, yet victims of crime receive little in compensation. I've seen a large number of comments on this board calling for very stiff prison sentences for violators of immigration law. I do not doubt that this would be a powerful deterrent but it does add to the tax burden of already burdened Americans. Fines, if they are large enough, could go into a fund that offsets the damages done to individuals.

I think the tricky part is finding Americans who deserves to be compensated, but haven't themselves benefited from illegal immigration. I have pointed out in other posts (and received a lot of criticism) that inhabitants of certain states have reaped tremendous economic benefits from the illegal population, and then they cash out and move to another state where their net worth buys a whole lot more. I think you know who I mean. But it seems like everyone's dipping in the trough somewhere, nowadays.

The biggest drain on our economy has beeen the invasion of Iraq. It really doesn't matter how right you think your cause is, if you run out of money to fight it, you're through. This is something that I observed many so called red-blooded Americans ignore; they just "knew" knocking off Saddam Hussein would be a cakewalk. Now we've got a huge expensive mess.

People who want to stop illegal immigration--I am definitely one--need to figure out the practical implications of doing it. Just like foreign oil this has been a nationwide addiction. If conservatism wants to reemerge as the dominant political trend it better figure out where it has gone wrong. We can't have more corporate disasters like Enron, Tyco and WorldCom. These did as much to weaken the US economy--by frightening investors and sabotaging the US dollar-- as anything else. It's fine to get rid of Boxer and Feinstein. How, g-dd--t is the technology going to happen that replaces the illegal alien labor?

The groundswell of resentment against illegal immigration only proves that Americans can get very noisy about their quality of life. What they need to do is provide concrete solutions as to HOW we will preserve a strong economy. I've already been researching the technology which will advance our businesses into a new era, w/o the huge illegal population.

BUT, all of ths could be alleviated if the US government would collect the roughly $200 Billion dollars that is unpaid each year, that is legally owing to the IRS.

That sounds good but, if illegals cost more in taxpayer benefits then they pay out in taxes then who do they benefit? So if a man with two children who makes 12,000 OR LESS a year, how much does he pay in taxes? His kid's cost 15,000 a year to school. Where's the net gain?
Why should I pick up that tax burden when Joe framer doesn't pay taxes ether?
1.)Wages need to go up to the level where the "workers" aren't a tax burden on the rest of the people. If wages are raised they would pay more taxes. 2.)If people where brought here just to work without family's then there wouldn't be a tax burden.

I generally agree with your statement. However, I would like to ask why conservatives have suddenly seized upon immigration as the point where the rule of law has broken down? I definitely want to see our immigration laws enforced. But I am also aware that there has been the growth of a huge blackmarket in this country that evades taxes and pilfers public assistance programs. ...
...The groundswell of resentment against illegal immigration only proves that Americans can get very noisy about their quality of life. What they need to do is provide concrete solutions as to HOW we will preserve a strong economy. I've already been researching the technology which will advance our businesses into a new era, w/o the huge illegal population.

You make a lot of good points. Unfortunately, I think we have to assume our representatives in Congress are ignorant. Therefore, we have to convince them a little at a time of the things that are wrong. Hopefully, many have seen that illegal immigration is a huge problem. Now we have to work on them about how that needs to be solved. We have to reach them in "sound bite" sized bits of information because if we go beyond that, we can't hold their attention! Remember, many of these people didn't have a clue about the NAU!! Let's just start with enforcing the laws we have. ONce that is done, I think it will become obvious what needs to happen beyond that.

As for Americans getting "noisy about their quality of life," I think you've really underestimated many of us! The immigration issue is only the tip of the iceberg that is the SPP/NAU problem. THAT is the real issue--will we remain a sovereign nation, or will we join in the New World Order? I think most of us would vote for the Sovereign United States!!

Originally Posted by Captainron

I generally agree with your statement. However, I would like to ask why conservatives have suddenly seized upon immigration as the point where the rule of law has broken down? I definitely want to see our immigration laws enforced. But I am also aware that there has been the growth of a huge blackmarket in this country that evades taxes and pilfers public assistance programs.

Well, for one thing, the serious problems you raise in the quote above are exacerbated by approximately 15 to 20 million illegal aliens who are now in this country. When you say: blackmarket in this country that evades taxes and pilfers public assistance programs -- what do you think we who care about the illegal immigrant problem have been fighting?

I must take issue with your quote: "have suddenly seized upon immigration." I don't know where you live but here in Southern California we have been fighting this issue with every tool at hand for decades. It has been a hard, frustrating, and bitter battle. Not with the illegals, but with our politicians and liberal newsmedia.

Please be advised that only thing we have "suddenly seized on" is a rare victory in the U.S. Senate yesterday. And seize on it we will. We earned it.

As for Americans who cheat on their taxes ... the IRS is the one part of our government that works. With all due respect, I think your concerns there are misdirected. At least on this board.

..blackmarket in this country that evades taxes...

Don't forget about all of those employers who have their employees sign 1099s rather than W-4s just to avoid having to pay their fair share of the SS benefits for that employee. The employee is left having to pay ALL of his SS benefits and the Workmans Compensation insurance payments. That's a can of worms no employer wants to talk about, especially in the construction trades. Some claim its legal, but it only is for those who are in business LEGITIMATELY! If an employee is told where to work, what time to be there, works by the hour, etc, then a W-4 is appropriate, not the 1099!

I would like to ask why conservatives have suddenly seized upon immigration as the point where the rule of law has broken down? I definitely want to see our immigration laws enforced.

I hope that, when all is said and done, the immigration fiasco was the point where conservatives in this country said 'Enough'! Your other points are all valid, but we need to take things one step at a time. One of the worst unspoken problems our government has is the assumption that everything has to be fixed right now and fixed perfectly.

The only realistic way to fix immigration - and I would wager much of the other problems we face as a nation - is to get back to basics and then improve as needed. Tearing some down in pure desperation for a solutioni only makes things worse. That's the kind of thinking that gets us S.1638.

I'm not saying that conservatives are just now waking up to this situation of illegal immigration. What I was trying to say was: There are some other deep-festering problems that are theatening our way of life--and--it has been a set of cultural shifts that has been leading to the problem we now have with immigration.

My first serious exposure to the immigration issue was by way of an INS bust in 1999 in Seattle. They also rounded up some Canadians, who also are notorious for drug problems (or else they would still be in Canada). Since that time I have tried to notify ICE when I observe a situation, but they have been preoccupied with international terrorism. I wish I had some trophy notifications on my belt.

As far as Social Security reform, I have, twice, spoken at the IRS Citizens Advisory Panel about how much tax evasion I have witnessed. It has taken awhile to get to the figure of $200 Billion/yr. Probably 75% of this is collectable now thanks to improved auditing methods.

True, illegal immigration exacerbates these problems and many more. I agree. I'll be keeping at it.