Thread: A New York Reader Says Teddy Kennedy Knew All Along That He

Originally Posted by Captainron

With younger Americans...liberals and conservatives---eschewing manual work or even skilled trades. . .

I think you may be mistaken about this. What is your evidence for this?

Needless to say, outsourcing and illegal labor short circuit all this, and actually discourage innovation. The U.S. developed the flat panel TV, but China made the profit on our research. That could have put millions of Americans to work.

Yes and it appears to be part of an intricate plan where Americans are on the losing end.

Another thing about these jobs people fail to see is, many a white collar worker put himself through college doing this type of work.

Isn't it wonderful how everyone wants a free market system but if every segment of that system is not run within the boundries of the fundamentals behind the free market system, the entire system will collapse.

In any economy you never want wages going down, once that happens it starts a free fall of falling demand and other things businesses count on.
If these international businesses that call themselves American Business were not able to do business in other countries right now, they would be in very bad shape financially, much worse than they are now. They are trying to escape the lower wages which translate into lower consumption and less sales, and ultimately less profits, which means don't target America for profits, with lower wages, there is less demand.

You can build as many houses and $40K cars as you want to but if the workers producing these products can't afford to buy the product, you aren't going to sell many products. A year before the crash people were making more money, and in some cases 10 to 50% more than they are now, I know of many jobs that were paying $25/hr and they are now paying $15/hr. I've heard people say that the lower wages make things cheaper, but I haven't seen a $40K car for $20K have you? Yes, on many items the prices have come down a small bit, maybe 10 to 15% on certian things but 40 to 50%? I haven't really seen it myself, so where is the savings going, who pockets that? The companies that aren't selling the amount of products that they were because demand has fallen, they are making more per sale. As we see the packages have gotten smaller, and the price has went up on many things, not down.

Many of the wages that were lowered were from legal HB-1 visa's. I had a friend that worked at IBM for 30 years and was told to train his asian counterpart to do his job or he wouldn't get his severence package. So, now he's making 60% less than he was in a simular job at another company. Is he going to buy a new home, a new car or renovate his old one, I doubt it, in fact he's so mad he's thinking of moving out of the country altogether.

Originally Posted by Captainron

There is some truth in what he said. With younger Americans...liberals and conservatives---eschewing manual work or even skilled trades, who is going to do it? Yes, I believe we need to have automation and technology taking over more and more of the mundane tasks, but not everyone can sit at a desk and get a big salary either.

First, all desks jobs do not pay a big salary. Second, not everyone wants to work at a desk. Many blue collar jobs use to pay well and Americans went in droves to apply for those jobs. Many worked at the same company their entire life. Furthermore, we do not need more people in this country to fill all the jobs. That is a lie put out by big business. What they want is more people to keep wages down. This country did quite well in the past with far fewer people. So why would we all of the sudden need so many people? Because....the more workers there are the cheaper wages will be. Supply and demand.

Originally Posted by Chexfive

Another thing about these jobs people fail to see is, many a white collar worker put himself through college doing this type of work.

Isn't it wonderful how everyone wants a free market system but if every segment of that system is not run within the boundries of the fundamentals behind the free market system, the entire system will collapse.

In any economy you never want wages going down, once that happens it starts a free fall of falling demand and other things businesses count on.
If these international businesses that call themselves American Business were not able to do business in other countries right now, they would be in very bad shape financially, much worse than they are now. They are trying to escape the lower wages which translate into lower consumption and less sales, and ultimately less profits, which means don't target America for profits, with lower wages, there is less demand.

You can build as many houses and $40K cars as you want to but if the workers producing these products can't afford to buy the product, you aren't going to sell many products. A year before the crash people were making more money, and in some cases 10 to 50% more than they are now, I know of many jobs that were paying $25/hr and they are now paying $15/hr. I've heard people say that the lower wages make things cheaper, but I haven't seen a $40K car for $20K have you? Yes, on many items the prices have come down a small bit, maybe 10 to 15% on certian things but 40 to 50%? I haven't really seen it myself, so where is the savings going, who pockets that? The companies that aren't selling the amount of products that they were because demand has fallen, they are making more per sale. As we see the packages have gotten smaller, and the price has went up on many things, not down.

Many of the wages that were lowered were from legal HB-1 visa's. I had a friend that worked at IBM for 30 years and was told to train his asian counterpart to do his job or he wouldn't get his severence package. So, now he's making 60% less than he was in a simular job at another company. Is he going to buy a new home, a new car or renovate his old one, I doubt it, in fact he's so mad he's thinking of moving out of the country altogether.

Ditto everything you said. You see.....corporations would like us to believe that they create jobs...but they dont. Consumers create jobs by consuming. And where is seems to make sense that consumers need jobs to consume...this is not really true.

Consumers NEED to consume regardless of whether they are working. They still need to eat and find shelter. If they have to break out a fishing pole to find food...they will. But they will still need to consume. It is that need that creates an economy.

Business just makes consumption more convenient and they make money doing it. So when wages go down, the economy goes into a downward spiral. Consumers have to consume less. Consumers are at the root of the economy, not business.