Thread: Solution: Relax immigration requirements

Hello all.

I wanted to pass my thinking by you guys, and see if it makes sense. I could be missing something, and a public forum is a great way to see what it might be.

Problems:
1. Bad People want to do Bad Things to people in our country.
2. Anyone can illegaly enter our country, especially if they have a little money (and Bad People often have plenty of money, which makes it especially easy to get in).
3. Lots of people are already in our country illegaly, and all of these people are a burden to the tax-paying legal population. Some of these people may be Bad, but most are not. They are just looking to improve their lives (good for them, that's what this country was built for).

Why is there such a flow of illegal immigrants into our country? Because it's a better place to live, and getting in legally is so hard as to not be an option.

So, here's my hypothetical solution: Relax immigration rules, allowing good people to legally enter our country, and in a timely manner. Maybe they have to wait a week, but not 2 years! Fingerprint them as they come in. Give them legal IDs. Let them get jobs, improve their situation, contribute to society, pay taxes. They become Americans. Our country improves as a whole, our base pool of human resources increases.

By the way, the whole notion of "but they would take all of our jobs" just doesn't hold water. More people in the country means more jobs become available to service the increased population. Drop the artificial minimum wage, and watch how many less skilled people will work day and night to get ahead. Some will get skilled fast, and the rising generation? They'll be in our public schools, learning the skills needed to better our society. What about our own unskilled laborers? Maybe it's about time they learn a skill so they can compete. Success in life is merit-based.

But, wouldn't these recently immigrated, largely uneducated, unskilled poverty-stricken people be a burden? They'd leech off the welfare system, wouldn't they?

No, there's a "send back home" clause. These people are not eligible for welfare. If they can't hold down a job, try to show up for welfare, or are found begging on the streets, BAM! They get sent home. And they are not allowed to legally come back in for another 5 years. We got their fingerprints, remember?

Now, with legal immigration available, the only people trying to get in illegally are, by definition, Bad People. The open border areas can become firing ranges. Post signs warning people about it, in all major languages.

As for the existing population of illegals, let them become legal. They get to be fingerprinted, and their employers are allowed to give them jobs. Probably the ones they already have. Only now they pay taxes.

What about space, where would all these people live? If you ask this, you must live in New York city. Ever visited Arizona? How about Alaska? Oregon? Washington state? Utah? Nevada? Not everyone has to move into your neighborhood.

Everyone in the country gets to have an ID card. Keep it with you, if practical. Government keeps these on file, and your fingerprints. Yeah, it's an invasion of privacy, but privacy has a high cost: lack of security. I'd rather exist in a government database than be killed by terrorists, thank you so much.

Result: A larger country, government can keep tabs on citizens, illegals are very rare, and we are much safer from terrorists from within. I like it, how about you?

--- wad

One question regarding your "make 'em legal" instead arguement.
How many workers, visas, green cards, how many would you suggest is a proper amount. 1 million, 2 million......5 million?

The problem is the government can't even tell you how many legal workers there are here. They over stay visas, often for years, no one goes after them. There are so many programs, even the gov't can't count how many we have, they just keep making more programs. The senate just ok'd another 60 thousand yesterday. Many green card holders are among the gangs and human trafficking. The process for approving them is flawed. We don't know who these people are or where. The entire immigration system is beyond flawed.

How many foreign nationals would you suggest we allow legally into this country?

Originally Posted by AuntB

One question regarding your "make 'em legal" instead arguement.

We don't know who these people are or where. The entire immigration system is beyond flawed.

How many foreign nationals would you suggest we allow legally into this country?

Excellent point. I would say that you are right on target: The entire immigration system is beyond flawed. The core problem is that the government is disorganized, in the extreme. Too little sharing of information. Lack of standardization. I know, I work for the government! Government employees tend to be more motivated to "not draw attention to problems" than to attempt to fix them.

As for foreign nationals, are they here to work? Do they want to be citizens? Do they have a criminal record? If they are acceptable, absorb them right in. They become productive tax-paying U.S. citizens instead of scary foreigners. Fingerprint them, give 'em an ID card, and if they blow it, send them back home.

But how many, you ask? I say, all of them that pass the screening. The government can keep tabs on them, they know the consequences of screwing up. We've got the space. If they will contribute, and if their goal is to improve their situation and contribute to society, why send them away?

After all, unless you are an indigenous American, we're all immigrants if you go back far enough. Why did our ancestors move here in the first place?

--- wad

ALL who can pass the requirements? Get ready to live 20 or 30 to an apartment. 3/4 of the friggin world will be here, and American culture will be extinct.

"After all, unless you are an indigenous American, we're all immigrants if you go back far enough. Why did our ancestors move here in the first place?"

Yes, I am from indigenous people of this country. But how far back do you want to go? This is the country of our birth, lets leave dead people who have no interest in it out of the equation.

And no, we can't just let anyone who wants to come do so. I happen to like having some space around me. Tell ya, what, we'll send the next million to your neighborhood. You can adapt. My people have adapted all they intend to.


You still didn't answer, how many would you allow? No limit,eh?......

Sorry Wad. Back to the drawing board for you! Hey, at least you're trying. But you need to try harder. A lot harder.

Originally Posted by AuntB

"And no, we can't just let anyone who wants to come do so. I happen to like having some space around me. Tell ya, what, we'll send the next million to your neighborhood.

You still didn't answer, how many would you allow? No limit,eh?......

I know my position is unpopular, but I'm sticking with it for now. At least for the sake of argument.

Sure, let's put a million or ten in my neighborhood. I live in the middle of an Arizona desert. There's PLENTY of room here. The place could use some life, other than cactus and rattlesnakes.

As for having space, how are we more deserving than the people who are moving from overcrowded areas? They might be living 30 to an apartment, that's why they want to leave! Is it their fault? If there is space available, who are we to deny then the chance to make something of themselves in a society as great as ours?

So yes, that's my answer: NO LIMIT. As long as they want to play by the rules, want to contribute to society, not be a burden.

Think about land for a minute. Did you know that there are millions of habitable acres of land available in Alaska, for FREE? They have a negative state income tax, for heavens sakes! They want people to move in! Yes, it's cold in the winter, but it's not crowded.

--- wad

to a very complex problem.

The mess took 40 years to make, and you can count on it taking 10 or 20 years to fix.

Unfortunately, until we can actually control the border, everything else suggested is a moot point. The undoing of the damages of uncontrolled immigration cannot even begin until we can monitor who is allowed entry into our country.

The border control we have now is about as useful as a football bat.

So yes, that's my answer: NO LIMIT. As long as they want to play by the rules, want to contribute to society, not be a burden.
Think about land for a minute. Did you know that there are millions of habitable acres of land available in Alaska, for FREE?

We can spare a few million illegals. But do they like whale blubber?

There's PLENTY of room here. The place could use some life, other than cactus and rattlesnakes.

The question is:
Which one are you?

By the way, the whole notion of "but they would take all of our jobs" just doesn't hold water. More people in the country means more jobs become available to service the increased population. Drop the artificial minimum wage, and watch how many less skilled people will work day and night to get ahead. Some will get skilled fast, and the rising generation? They'll be in our public schools, learning the skills needed to better our society. What about our own unskilled laborers? Maybe it's about time they learn a skill so they can compete. Success in life is merit-based.

Are you talking about anywhere outside of Fantasy Island here?