Thread: American lack of work ethic adds to problem

San Diego -- When you grab hold of the thorny topic of immigration, sometimes you can't tell what part of the discussion will prick your finger.
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I recently addressed the subject as part of a panel. Given the questions -- one person suggested opening the U.S.-Mexico border -- I'd say the audience was fairly liberal.

When I called for punishing employers, insisted that racism was part of the debate and asserted that much of the ruckus was based on the fear of a changing America, I didn't get much reaction. But then there was the comment that hit close to home.

"You know," I said. "It's worth mentioning that not only do illegal immigrants do jobs that Americans won't do, but many of the jobs they're doing were once done by young people in their teens and 20s -- your sons and daughters -- who, as a generation, have shown themselves to have a terrible work ethic."

My point was that besides better immigration laws and better enforcement, we also need better parenting -- the sort that produces young people who know how to work and aren't afraid to break a sweat. Then, the employers I've heard from -- apple growers in Washington, restaurant owners in North Carolina, etc. -- who claim they can't find young Americans who want to work wouldn't feel as if they had to hire illegal immigrants to pick up the slack.

Afterward, I was surrounded by a group of angry folks who said they were offended. They insisted they had good kids -- the kind who worked hard in school and volunteered for worthwhile causes in the summer. But when I asked whether their children had after-school or summer jobs, they changed the subject. Some told me what they have told their kids -- that their "jobs" are to study hard in school and get good grades.

Fine. But young people also need to learn how to find a job, take orders, show up on time, and be a dependable employee. Those, too, are valuable skills. And if many young people aren't learning them, we shouldn't be surprised that we've arrived at a point where many jobs would go undone if not for illegal immigrants.
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What evidence did I have that young people had a weak work ethic? one man demanded to know.

I responded that several books have been written about the so-called Millennial Generation, born between 1982 and 2002. Most of the authors make the point that this cohort is self-absorbed to the point of narcissism, consumed by fame and fortune, plagued by a sense of entitlement, and averse to concepts such as "paying your dues" or "working your way to the top." Many of these kids were raised to believe that they were "special" and now they consume a steady diet of "American Idol"-type reality shows where the right break, and the right amount of talent, can make you rich and famous overnight.

When they do show up in the workplace, many young people are -- according to those who supervise them -- notoriously tough to manage. They dress like slobs, question authority, shrug off criticism and impatiently wonder why, if they start in the mailroom on Monday, they're not on their way to being vice president by Friday.

Besides, I said, the MySpace generation has such high self-esteem that many of them would never debase themselves to take the hard and dirty jobs that go to illegal immigrants.

The guy shrugged and walked away. He didn't want to be persuaded. He just wanted to defend his kids. That's natural. In fact, it's commendable.

It's just not helpful. We've blamed Mexico, big business, the media, special interest groups, the U.S. government, and, of course, the illegal immigrants themselves for our current plight. In fact, we've just about run out of blame. Is it any wonder that there's none left for those of us who are raising children?

Almost eight years ago, President Bush started what became a national conversation about immigration reform. We've talked about nearly every facet of the issue. We've covered the waterfront. And yet somehow -- and I don't think it was by accident -- we never got around to an honest and candid discussion about one of the things that contributes to illegal immigration: the fact that too many of our own citizens, especially young citizens, were raised to turn up their noses at jobs that wind up going to you-know-who.

If we want to find a solution, we should accept our share of responsibility for the problem.

Ruben Navarrette Jr., is a columnist and editorial board member of The San Diego Union Tribune. He can be reached at ruben.navarrette@uniontrib.com.

http://www.news-leader.com/apps/pbcs.dl ... /807010320

Ruben Navarrette you can go straight to hell.

Americans work longer and harder than about anyone on the planet. Just because we refuse to work all day in the hot sun for $20 does not mean we have a work ethic problem. Our ancestors worked for those low wages once and built America up into a better system. Your illegal alien buddies are still struggling under old world conditions.

Don't accuse Americans of being lazy because we do not want to lose what we have built and retrogress back 100 years through history.

W

This sophomoric ramble should be correctly entitled "The Corrupt Mexican Government's Lack of Opportunities for Its Unskilled Citizens Adds to Problem."

Has anyone watched those TV series; Black Gold and Ice Road Truckers? Not to mention the others about the most dangerous jobs like fishing, military, etc? I've been struck watching brave hardworking Americans doing filthy, dangerous jobs involving long hours; often in life threatening conditions. And taking pride in them!!! The difference is THEY GET PAID A LIVING WAGE! I agree with William..........NAVARETTE: GO TO HELL!!!

I think Mr. Navarrette makes a point, although it indicates more than he was willing to admit.

For example, what percentage of the kids born between 1982 and 2000 were to Hispanic legal and illegal immigrants? Wouldn't those kids, therefore, suffer from the same poor work ethic? Do the Hispanic parenting skill-sets make their kids any different?

Actually, they did turn out differently. They had higher rates for:
-Dropping out of school
-Teenage pregnancy
-Substance abuse
-Crime
-Obesity
-Unemployment

I agree with Mr. Navarrette, that it does take good parenting to raise children well. So I'm curious how he would explain away these factors.

Americans have a good explanation for why they can't spend more quality time with their children. The fact is, they work more hours than any other industrialized nation in the World (including Mexico). Perhaps if wages weren't so thoroughly depressed by foreign labor, we could work less and spend more time with our children.

But, for the sake of argument, let's say he's right and we encourage millions of hardworking immigrants to come here. Won't their offspring likely end up even worse than this generation did? Is it wise to use a million solid laborers if the price is to inherit three million of their soon-to-be unmanageable offspring?

Coincidentally, France tried doing exactly that. And much to their dismay, one generation later the offspring of imported Muslim immigrants took over the streets, burned hundreds of cars, buildings, and a police station.

Why doesn't Mr. Navarette ask Mr. Chirac how well that idea worked out for France.

It's worth mentioning that not only do illegal immigrants do jobs that Americans won't do




Americans expect a decent wage for anything they do in the way of work. They will do anything for a decent wage. Nothing is too hard or dirty for American workers. We've done those jobs for years. Thats how we feed and take care of our families. But we won't work for nothing. The reason illegal aliens do those jobs for no money or benefits is because they're in a position to take anything at any risk or cost. Let me tell you .....they don't want to take risky or low paying jobs but only do it out of desperation. They don't work harder nor are they smarter than American workers. They only do it out of desperation. And some are quite picky about what they do. I've know them to turn down $20 an hour for a small job. Now you can see by the janitor and house-keeping workers that they do not intend to do those jobs for long at low wages. Because they don't want or come here for low wages. They don't want those jobs any more than Americans do. So cut the BS about illegal aliens doing jobs that Americans won't do. Business will pay only the very lowest wages for people they can exploit and thats the illegals. In the meantime, the American loses out on all the jobs they used to do because the work market is flooded with desperate illegals who will do anything to make a buck. And at any risk. It has destroyed job opportunities for hard working Americans. All illegals should be deported.

I get so sick of that argument; if american work ethics are so lacking, please explain this:

All work and no play?

Americans get fewer vacation days than Europeans do – and many of us don't even take the days we do have.

By Laura Raines

For ajcjobs

Published on: 05/18/07

There's a good reason why all those people in line with you at Disney World are speaking Italian, French, German or Japanese. Everyone, it seems, gets more time to play than American workers.

According to a 2007 study by the World Tourism Organization (published by Pearson Education, as Infoplease), workers in Italy average a whopping 42 days of vacation a year; the French get 37; Germans, 35; and the British, 28.


By comparison, U.S. workers average about 13 days of paid vacation time, and many don't even take their full allotment because of job pressures.
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LEITA COWART/Special

Stefanie Jehlitschka and Jan Christoph Wiedemann moved from Germany to work at the German American Chamber of Commerce in Atlanta. While the huge drop in vacation days was an adjustment (Germans average 35 vacation days a year), neither regrets the decision to work in the United States.

The main reason for the discrepancy is that most industrialized nations have vacation time mandated by law, while the United States leaves it to employers' discretion.

In the 1930s, when the idea of paid vacations originated, European unions pushed for more time off and American unions pushed for better pay, according to Orvar Lofgren, author of "On Holiday." In a global economy, the result is a vacation imbalance that leaves many American workers envious and many European expatriates employed by American companies in culture shock.

"Last summer was a nightmare," said Liliana De Kerorguen, executive director of global strategic supply-chain management for Merial, a veterinary pharmaceuticals company. Merial is jointly owned by the U.S. company Merck and the French company sanofi-aventis.

When she moved to the United States five years ago, De Kerorguen was an expatriate employed by the French side of the company, and she retained her six weeks of vacation time. When her work visa expired and she accepted a contract with the American side of the company, her vacation dropped to 15 holidays, plus six floating days.

"I liked my position. I wasn't sure what I'd do in France, since the company headquarters is here, and we like America," she said. "My husband also has a good job, and my daughters liked school here, so we decided to stay, but the loss of vacation time was difficult."

Previously, De Kerorguen took five of her vacation weeks to stay home with her daughters during their 10-week summer breaks.

"Last summer, it was a real puzzle, but we managed to schedule camps and travel to visit family for them. When we could be together, it was much easier and much less costly," she said.

Having fewer vacation days and traveling internationally about 45 percent of the time, De Kerorguen has had to forgo volunteering at her daughters' school and to curtail her children's activities because she isn't available to drive them.

"With more vacation, you have some time to volunteer, to help society, and I think you are a better worker. When you're relaxed, you take things differently," she said. "When I'm in my garden, I can think about how I might handle something differently at work. Vacation is good for everyone."

Worth the tradeoff?

Jan Christoph Wiedemann, manager of marketing and consulting at the German American Chamber of Commerce office in Atlanta, believes that everyone needs vacation time.

"You need at least two weeks to focus on something else other than your job, to think about your own life and what you want to do. Everything on top of that is a luxury," he said.

It was a luxury that Wiedemann was willing to trade — he received 30 vacation days instantly in his first job after graduating from Georg-August University of Göttingen — for a good career opportunity. He gets to introduce German companies to the U.S. market, use his English and gain international marketing skills.

Since his experience as an exchange student in Syracuse, N.Y., in 1994, his dream had been to work for a while in the United States.

"I only planned to stay one or two years, but then you get to know people and start building a social network," he said. "It's a lot of fun to work in Atlanta, and my job is very stimulating. If you really like your job, vacation is not as important."

Co-worker Stefanie Jehlitschka, who moved from Stuttgart to become the public relations manager at the German American Chamber of Commerce, said that accepting less time off was worth it. "I'm combining the best of both worlds. I still get to talk to people in German [there are about 1,200 German subsidiary companies in the Southeast] and live here," she said.

"I enjoy outdoor activities, so I find my peace on the weekends," she said. "I target natural places. Name any state park, and I'm there. Taking this job was the best decision ever."

Pressure to stay in the office

In Britain, workers start out with 20 paid vacation days; American workers often have to work a year to get any leave.

"It's not unusual for people to go on holiday for two weeks at a time in Europe. Even taking a week here is somewhat frowned on," said Steve Mearman, account executive with Nielsen Business Media. He moved from outside London to the United States four years ago, and, while the different attitude toward holidays took some getting used to, it was not a big factor in his decision.

"Salary and change of scenery were important to me. The weather in Atlanta lets people utilize their free time more effectively, and people do more big weekends," he said.

After four years with the company, he gets 18 vacation days, but he finds it hard to take a week off, except during the slow times of his trade show business. Still, he has been to the beach and back home and will take a honeymoon in the Dominican Republic this fall.



LEITA COWART/Special

"From my perspective, the quality of life here is higher in many ways. In England, the taxes, real estate and gasoline are higher. This is an easier place to live, with great climate and people, so vacation is not that big of an issue."

NICK MACNAB

Financial adviser,Scott & Stringfellow Inc.

"Taking less vacation keeps you more focused, especially in sales," he added. "I like the weather and the quality of life here. The rents are cheaper, and cost of living is less."

The concept of vacation is very different between the United Kingdom and the United States, said Nick MacNab, financial adviser with Scott & Stringfellow Inc. and volunteer membership director for the British American Business Group in Atlanta. He and his family have spent time in both countries in the last 12 years.

"In the U.K., if you join a company, it's fairly typical to start with four weeks [of vacation], and that increases with time served, so that someone with 10 years often has six weeks' vacation, plus eight bank holidays," MacNab said. "That can be an adjustment for people who move here, but it doesn't really bother me."

He takes a couple of weeks off a year to travel with his family, and his British family members visit here.

"From my perspective, the quality of life here is higher in many ways. In England, the taxes, real estate and gasoline are higher. This is an easier place to live, with great climate and people, so vacation is not that big of an issue," he said.

Unused vacation days

MacNab noted that not all workers in the United Kingdom take their full allotments of time off, and that trend has been growing in the United States as well. According to a survey by Harris Interactive, 30 percent of employed adults gave up vacation time they had earned, resulting in a total of 415 million unused vacation days in 2004. Employees worry about job security or the stress of having to make up work when they come back. Even when they take time off, workers often stay plugged into the office through voice mail or e-mail.

With a new focus on healthier lifestyles and work/life balance, however, smart companies are realizing that exhausted workers are not productive workers.

"We're all working harder than ever, and we need to encourage people to take their vacation time," said Sandy Jess, director of human resources at Matrix Resources. "If they are going to perform at their best, they need to take a breather to stay energized and be as sharp as they can be."

They also need time to connect with family and friends and to have a little fun.

In the late 1990s, many companies, like Matrix, switched from designated numbers of sick days, company paid holidays and vacation days to a "bucket" of paid days off. New workers get 16 days in their first year, and the company adds a day with each year of service. Employees can use the days at their own discretion — for sickness, school performances or vacation trips — and managers have the flexibility of granting extra days in extenuating circumstances.

"Sixteen days is pretty generous for a new hire, but it helps us attract the best talent," Jess said.

As to whether the United States ever would mandate vacation time, most experts agree that isn't likely to happen. The idea of a free market is an entrenched part of our culture, and companies already are facing increasing costs in health care, technology and training.

"America is facing tremendous competition on the world market right now. I don't see anything being mandated anytime soon," Jess said.

Maybe the young people today are not insufficiently motivated to work but are unable to work because all the summer jobs are filled with adults - illegals from Mexico. The local McDonald's won't hire American kids because they're not bi-lingual, however the place is filled with Mexicans that aren't bi-lingual.

Originally Posted by ReggieMay

Maybe the young people today are not insufficiently motivated to work but are unable to work because all the summer jobs are filled with adults - illegals from Mexico. The local McDonald's won't hire American kids because they're not bi-lingual, however the place is filled with Mexicans that aren't bi-lingual.

Yea, it's like they pretend to know English

Fine. But young people also need to learn how to find a job, take orders, show up on time, and be a dependable employee. Those, too, are valuable skills. And if many young people aren't learning them, we shouldn't be surprised that we've arrived at a point where many jobs would go undone if not for illegal immigrants.

Ruben, your ignorant attitude is sickening. Americans have the best work ethnics of anyone else in the world!
Who do you think built and made America one the most sought after and leading nations in the entire world? Hint: It wasnt illegal aliens.