Thread: E-Verify doesn't prevent many companies from hiring undocumented workers

Originally Posted by stoptheinvaders

]Really!? You believe a company that hires 400 illegals and 0 citizens are scapegoats for everyone else's wrong-doing?

Americans including our American-owned businesses are the victims of this problem, not criminals. If one dairy farmer hires illegal aliens, then they all have to hire illegal aliens to compete with each other, just like our manufacturers dealing with free trade treason, once one leaves and goes to Mexico or China, they all had to leave and go to Mexico or China to compete with each other.

It took a lot of wrong doing by a lot of people for those businesses to hire illegal aliens or those manufacturers to relocate to foreign countries. Did you know that under our laws, there is no law that forbids an illegal alien from stealing a job from an American worker or taking one that's unfilled? They can go to the US Department of Labor and file claims for erroneous pay and other things and the US Department of Labor will protect them and go after the business for the shortages or whatever the issue is. Isn't that crazy? It's illegal for the employer to hire you but it's not illegal for you as an illegal alien to ask for the job or take the job. Isn't that nuts? To me that's just nutzo.

Our laws set up our businesses to be the scapegoats of illegal immigration, not the Border Patrol who lets them in, the sanctuary cities who protect them, the drug cartels who own the smugglers who bring them here, the networks who make the arrangements, not the IRS who launders billions of our cash out to them in household sums of thousands of dollars a year in earned income and child care tax credits, not the hospitals who treat them, not the schools who educate them, not the 95,000 employees of the US Department of Justice responsible for deporting them but doesn't, not the 225,000 employees of the US Department of Homeland Security who are paid to keep them out, but doesn't, not the landlord who profit from renting to them, not the utility companies who profit serving them, nope, no laws against any of that.

Nope, just our businesses who hire them. If that's not a scapegoat by definition, then I don't know what would be one. Again, I'm not opposed to fines and temporary closures like for a week or so, to sort everything out and get straight, but to send them to jail when an illegal alien can kill a girl in a park and walk out free as a bird? No, I'm not for jail time of employers unless they're involved in illegal drugs or smuggling or something more than just hiring people who showed up and wanted a job when no one else was breaking their door down and their competitors were doing it and on and on and on.

I just don't see the employers as the real villains here to the extent of jail time. I see the illegal aliens as the only real villains. I don't believe in transferring a crime of a foreign national in our country in violation of US immigration to an American employer looking for workers to operate a business who hires them because they are here, in their faces, begging for jobs.

I also don't think it's a wise strategy for our efforts to solve this problem. We need businesses on our side to ever win this. Anyone who thinks we can win this issue without them doesn't understand how our system works, if we make businesses our enemies, we'll end up with the biggest amnesty in the history of the world.

Take this number, there are just over 40,000 licensed dairy operations in the United States and that's 17,000 less than a decade ago. How many of those do you think hire illegal aliens? I don't know the answer to that, but I think a lot of them or most of them hire at least some illegal aliens. They were very vocal about their situation during 2016 campaign. And 1 or 2 were shut down because of those revelations and prosecuted. So to be fair to that industry, you would have to do a raid on all of them. But that isn't how it works, they'll go after 1 or 2, shut them down, and all their fellow dairy operatives who didn't get caught just benefit from their demise and pick up their slack even though they may be hiring more illegal aliens than the one that was raided and shut down. So the result is a weird type of discrimination, because there's no fairness in it.

Illegal aliens need to be the primary if not sole target, because they are the ones causing all the problems for everyone else.

Originally Posted by Judy

Americans including our American-owned businesses are the victims of this problem, not criminals. If one dairy farmer hires illegal aliens, then they all have to hire illegal aliens to compete with each other, just like our manufacturers dealing with free trade treason, once one leaves and goes to Mexico or China, they all had to leave and go to Mexico or China to compete with each other.

It took a lot of wrong doing by a lot of people for those businesses to hire illegal aliens or those manufacturers to relocate to foreign countries. Did you know that under our laws, there is no law that forbids an illegal alien from stealing a job from an American worker or taking one that's unfilled? They can go to the US Department of Labor and file claims for erroneous pay and other things and the US Department of Labor will protect them and go after the business for the shortages or whatever the issue is. Isn't that crazy? It's illegal for the employer to hire you but it's not illegal for you as an illegal alien to ask for the job or take the job. Isn't that nuts? To me that's just nutzo.

Our laws set up our businesses to be the scapegoats of illegal immigration, not the Border Patrol who lets them in, the sanctuary cities who protect them, the drug cartels who own the smugglers who bring them here, the networks who make the arrangements, not the IRS who launders billions of our cash out to them in household sums of thousands of dollars a year in earned income and child care tax credits, not the hospitals who treat them, not the schools who educate them, not the 95,000 employees of the US Department of Justice responsible for deporting them but doesn't, not the 225,000 employees of the US Department of Homeland Security who are paid to keep them out, but doesn't, not the landlord who profit from renting to them, not the utility companies who profit serving them, nope, no laws against any of that.

Nope, just our businesses who hire them. If that's not a scapegoat by definition, then I don't know what would be one. Again, I'm not opposed to fines and temporary closures like for a week or so, to sort everything out and get straight, but to send them to jail when an illegal alien can kill a girl in a park and walk out free as a bird? No, I'm not for jail time of employers unless they're involved in illegal drugs or smuggling or something more than just hiring people who showed up and wanted a job when no one else was breaking their door down and their competitors were doing it and on and on and on.

I just don't see the employers as the real villains here to the extent of jail time. I see the illegal aliens as the only real villains. I don't believe in transferring a crime of a foreign national in our country in violation of US immigration to an American employer looking for workers to operate a business who hires them because they are here, in their faces, begging for jobs.

I also don't think it's a wise strategy for our efforts to solve this problem. We need businesses on our side to ever win this. Anyone who thinks we can win this issue without them doesn't understand how our system works, if we make businesses our enemies, we'll end up with the biggest amnesty in the history of the world.

Take this number, there are just over 40,000 licensed dairy operations in the United States and that's 17,000 less than a decade ago. How many of those do you think hire illegal aliens? I don't know the answer to that, but I think a lot of them or most of them hire at least some illegal aliens. They were very vocal about their situation during 2016 campaign. And 1 or 2 were shut down because of those revelations and prosecuted. So to be fair to that industry, you would have to do a raid on all of them. But that isn't how it works, they'll go after 1 or 2, shut them down, and all their fellow dairy operatives who didn't get caught just benefit from their demise and pick up their slack even though they may be hiring more illegal aliens than the one that was raided and shut down. So the result is a weird type of discrimination, because there's no fairness in it.

Illegal aliens need to be the primary if not sole target, because they are the ones causing all the problems for everyone else.

Wow, I don't even know where to start responding to this nonsense, so I won't. However, I will say this ... you certainly pegged out my B.S. meter.

Judy, I consider you a friend on here, although we're disagreeing like hell on this particular thread. Let's take a breather. Here's a video of me back in the 1970s fighting Bigfoot. Now that we're older though, me and bigfoot are good buds, like my avatar shows. We go and have a beer once in a while. He actually saved my ass a couple times in bar fights. He's a good person/bigfoot to have on your side in a bar fight.

Originally Posted by 6 Million Dollar Man

Judy, I consider you a friend on here, although we're disagreeing like hell on this particular thread. Let's take a breather. Here's a video of me back in the 1970s fighting Bigfoot. Now that we're older though, me and bigfoot are good buds, like my avatar shows. We go and have a beer once in a while. He actually saved my ass a couple times in bar fights. He's a good person/bigfoot to have on your side in a bar fight.

LOL!! Oh you will always be my friend, no matter when we disagree on one plan or another to solve this awful problem. I've always been the 1 girl out on mass deportations, so don't feel bad about our disagreeing on this. No one here has ever really wanted mass deportations, they want to freeze 'em out, starve 'em out, dry up all the "magnets" and "lures", rely on the "rule of law" and hope they just go away. No, they won't, they'll just run drugs, breed like rabbits, and wait until DemoQuacks are back in office and get amnesty. We have a very short window of time to solve this problem, we'll never have another Trump, we'll never have another President even willing to talk about this subject in any terms other than amnesty, so he's our last chance to get them out of here. That's why all of our focus needs to be on rapid mass deportation through state and local law enforcement.

In my opinion, of course, and all we need to get that rolling is an Executive Order authorizing state and local law enforcement to enforce US immigration law without fear of reprisal or litigation from the federal government for doing so.

Originally Posted by Judy

No one here has ever really wanted mass deportations, they want to freeze 'em out, starve 'em out, dry up all the "magnets" and "lures"

And you are against this?

Originally Posted by Judy

In my opinion, of course, and all we need to get that rolling is an Executive Order authorizing state and local law enforcement to enforce US immigration law without fear of reprisal or litigation from the federal government for doing so.

Have you looked at the news in the last couple of years? States are suing the federal government so they can disobey federal immigration laws. It is not about allowing them to cooperate with federal law enforcement, it is getting them to cooperate with federal law enforcement.

Originally Posted by Judy

I've always been the 1 girl out on mass deportations, so don't feel bad about our disagreeing on this. No one here has ever really wanted mass deportations, they want to freeze 'em out, starve 'em out, dry up all the "magnets" and "lures", rely on the "rule of law" and hope they just go away.

How about mass self-deportations by getting rid of the magnet, jobs, by clamping down hard on employers who hire them? That sounds pretty good to me, and quick. Quick and fast.

You'll have such a big mass exodus, I'll bet you can see it from space. The mass exodus of illegals on our southern border.

Originally Posted by 6 Million Dollar Man

How about mass self-deportations by getting rid of the magnet, jobs, by clamping down hard on employers who hire them? That sounds pretty good to me, and quick. Quick and fast.

You'll have such a big mass exodus, I'll bet you can see it from space. The mass exodus of illegals on our southern border.

Sure! I'm all for "clamping" down on employers who hire illegally, I just don't want to see them go to prison, I prefer to see them fined. Either way, if you clamp down on them all, that would free up a lot of jobs for Americans which I totally support.

Originally Posted by Judy

Sure! I'm all for "clamping" down on employers who hire illegally, I just don't want to see them go to prison, I prefer to see them fined. Either way, if you clamp down on them all, that would free up a lot of jobs for Americans which I totally support.

Seems there's a lot of folks you don't want to see go to jail ..... illegals reentries, drug abusers and those involved in the drug trade, and the employers of illegals. How many more am I missing? Oh wait, you not only want those involved in the drug trade not to go to jail, you also want those already in jail to be set free if they weren't convicted of a violent crime. Additionally, you don't support the death penalty under any condition. Many of your positions make you the epitome of what some would call weak on crime. Just saying ......

Originally Posted by MW

Seems there's a lot of folks you don't want to see go to jail ..... illegals reentries, drug abusers and those involved in the drug trade, and the employers of illegals. How many more am I missing? Oh wait, you not only want those involved in the drug trade not to go to jail, you also want those already in jail to be set free if they weren't convicted of a violent crime. Additionally, you don't support the death penalty under any condition. Many of your positions make you the epitome of what some would call weak on crime. Just saying ......

Right O!! There are 3 areas of crime that I believe deserve jail time.

1. Property Damage
2. Theft
3. Physical Harm

Originally Posted by Judy

Sure! I'm all for "clamping" down on employers who hire illegally, I just don't want to see them go to prison, I prefer to see them fined.

How much? To a small employer or company, a $10,000 fine could put them out of business. But to a large employer/company, it would just be the cost of doing business. If each had to serve a week in jail, there would be an equity of the punishment. The little guy would lose a little money, but the big guy would lose a lot of money. The great equalizer!