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Thread: Federal judge says Trump must fully restore DACA

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  1. #31
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Text Driving Is Deadly View Post
    And why should it be in the courts?? DACA is not a law and trump can end it when he pleases and no court can say otherwise. No president is bound by mere executive orders of a prior prez.
    The last count I have is at least 4 different federal courts have said otherwise. I hope they're wrong, but we'll find out some day when the US Supreme Court rules on it.
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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    LOL!! The DACA Expansion and DAPA were additions to the DACA 2012 renewal. If you can't figure out when your 3 year deal ends, then you're in strangely incompetent crowd that better never sign one. A three year deal, any deal, ends 3 years from the start date unless it's renewed or extended.
    As I've shown you over and over again, there was not expiration date written into DACA. As Attorney General Jeff Sessions has said, there was no DACA end date. Please, just show us proof that the program was supposed to expire 3 years from its creation in 2012!

    If you can't provide the proof I've ask for on several occasions, perhaps you should just drop it.

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  3. #33
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MW View Post
    As I've shown you over and over again, there was not expiration date written into DACA. As Attorney General Jeff Sessions has said, there was no DACA end date. Please, just show us proof that the program was supposed to expire 3 years from its creation in 2012!

    If you can't provide the proof I've ask for on several occasions, perhaps you should just drop it.
    DACA 2012 was a 2 year program that expired 2 years from its creation date on June 15, 2014, and was RENEWED for 3 more years as well as expanded to include more DACAs and DAPAS in 2014 by Jeh Johnson expiring on June 15, 2017. You can't even keep up with the basic facts of this program.

    You're like these pathetic people who sign a 1 year lease but don't know that unless it's renewed they have to vacate the premises before the anniversary date or they're trespassing or the independent contractor who gets a 1 year contract with Boeing but didn't know he wouldn't get any more checks after the anniversary date unless his contract was renewed or extended and expects checks forever.

    The message Jeff Sessions sent was that if he, the Attorney General, believed the intent was to go on indefinitely, then DACAs, the other party to the agreement, could also think it went on indefinitely. If they thought that, which is also what Sessions thought, then they have the right to rely on that interpretation, so why would you or anyone else in our cause to end DACA want to give the opposition that amount of fodder to keep it going "indefinitely"? Business people looking at this say it ends at the end of 2 years unless it's renewed, and when it's renewed for 3 years, it ends at the end of the 3 years, unless it's renewed. If you don't want to extend it, you simply do not renew it and it expires by its terms at the end of the 3 year renewal period, June 15, 2017.

    It's in the courts now, and I hope they end it. We'll see!
    Last edited by Judy; 08-05-2018 at 11:10 AM.
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  4. #34
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    Still no proof, just a bunch of blathering.

    Forgive me, but I'm going to continue to assume Attorney General Jeff Sessions knows and knew more about what he was talking about when he repeatedly said the program was open-ended and had no expiration date. All you seem to be doing is playing connect the dots. One misaligned dot throws out your whole premise.
    Last edited by MW; 08-05-2018 at 12:28 PM.

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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by MW View Post
    Geez, I don't understand why this is so confusing for you.

    Repeat, DACA was an open-ended program with no actual expiration date. Of course the work permits and protections had an expiration date for each individual, however, they were subject to renewal, but the program itself was open-ended and had no expiration date .. not June 15, 2017 or any other date. In other words, a DACA member could continuously renew their status for as long as the program was active.
    It is confusing to you because you confuse yourself. When a DACA applicant begins their protection, what day does that end? Is it June 15, 2014? June 15, 2017? NO! It is the time from the beginning until its expiration date, which is different for each applicant. The dates, which you keep claiming are not expiration dates, are expiration dates for the effective period of the EO. Few laws have expiration dates. They expire when they are superseded by other laws.

    You continue to argue that Jeff Sessions has said the program was open-ended and had no expiration date. Then you ignore the rest of what Jeff Sessions said, that said the open-ended immigration law that was an overreach of the executive branch. So you are arguing that a law that Constitutionally cannot be, cannot be ended, because it has no expiration date!
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoptheinvaders View Post
    If it was set to expire like you claim, why are we discussing this? Why didn't it expire?
    President Trump legitimized it by allowing it to continue until Congress made a legitimate law addressing it.

    Quote Originally Posted by stoptheinvaders
    Again if it expired by its terms, why didn't it expire?
    Because President Trump gave it an extra 6 months! That opened the door for leftist judges to extend it while litigation took place.

  7. #37
    MW
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtdc View Post
    It is confusing to you because you confuse yourself. When a DACA applicant begins their protection, what day does that end? Is it June 15, 2014? June 15, 2017? NO! It is the time from the beginning until its expiration date, which is different for each applicant. The dates, which you keep claiming are not expiration dates, are expiration dates for the effective period of the EO. Few laws have expiration dates. They expire when they are superseded by other laws.

    You continue to argue that Jeff Sessions has said the program was open-ended and had no expiration date. Then you ignore the rest of what Jeff Sessions said, that said the open-ended immigration law that was an overreach of the executive branch. So you are arguing that a law that Constitutionally cannot be, cannot be ended, because it has no expiration date!
    Of course each DACA member's protections and work permits have an expiration date but the program itself has no sunset. It is open-ended with no expiration which allows each DACA member to continuously renew their protections. Judy's argument was that the DACA program was scheduled to expire in June 15 2017 and that is false. The DACA program itself, not talking about individual protections, was never given an actual expiration date.

    So, are you saying Judy is right and the DACA program had an actual expiration date of June 15, 2017?

    FYI: The program was not created with an Executive Order, it was a DHS memorandum.

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  8. #38
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    LET WORK PERMITS EXPIRE AND BOOT THEM OUT!

    NO NEW APPLICATIONS
    NO RENEWAL OF WORK PERMITS
    NO AMNESTY
    NO PATH TO STAY

    THESE PEOPLE HAVE NO RESPECT FOR OUR COUNTRY OR OUR LAWS!

    START RE-EXAMING THESE APPLICATIONS THAT OBAMA RAMMED THROUGH AND BOOT OUT THE LIARS NOW!
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  9. #39
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MW View Post
    Of course each DACA member's protections and work permits have an expiration date but the program itself has no sunset. It is open-ended with no expiration which allows each DACA member to continuously renew their protections. Judy's argument was that the DACA program was scheduled to expire in June 15 2017 and that is false. The DACA program itself, not talking about individual protections, was never given an actual expiration date.

    So, are you saying Judy is right and the DACA program had an actual expiration date of June 15, 2017?

    FYI: The program was not created with an Executive Order, it was a DHS memorandum.
    You can not renew individual DACA permits without a program to do so. The program itself was a 2 year program ending on June 15, 2014, unless renewed. It was renewed and expanded by Jeh Johnson for 3 years, expiring by its terms on June 15, 2017. Underneath the program are the individual work permits that each have their own expiration date compliant with the program that issued them.
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by MW View Post
    Judy's argument was that the DACA program was scheduled to expire in June 15 2017 and that is false.
    Then what is the significance of those dates? Obviously Jeh Johnson renewed it BECAUSE IT WAS TO EXPIRE ON JUNE 15, 2014. AND HE RENEWED IT FOR THREE MORE YEARS. Obviously, if it had no expiration, he would not have had to renew it. And if it was renewed for three more years, that is an expiration date!

    Quote Originally Posted by MW
    FYI: The program was not created with an Executive Order, it was a DHS memorandum.
    It was done under the authority of the Obama Administration, NOT CONGRESS! So it was a "law" that should never have been!
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