Thread: PA: Diverse doesn't mean illegal

Diverse doesn't mean illegal
Residents' concerns not something local authorities can address.
Monday, August 06, 2007
By LYNN OLANOFF
The Express-Times
HACKETTSTOWN | Mayor Michael Lavery says 80 percent of the complaints he receives are about one thing: Suspected illegal immigrants.

As the town's Hispanic population has grown in recent years so has concern among some residents about Hispanics' legal status.

At a recent town council meeting, Councilwoman Nancy Brown mentioned Hispanics living on Main Street and having about a dozen stores catering to them.

She was surprised to learn she is not legally permitted to ask someone about his or her residency status. And she's not the only one inquiring about the topic.

Lavery receives regular calls, comments and e-mails about suspected illegal immigrants in town.

"Anytime anyone sees someone of a background other than their own, they assume they're here illegally," he said. "Some of the things that are said about the Hispanics downtown are the same things that were said about the Irish 100 years ago and the Italians any race."

Town police Chief Leonard Kunz has also taken calls on the issue. He said people regularly complain to the police about Hispanics loitering on Main Street.

"If it was 10 white-haired ladies standing there, would (they) be concerned? The answer is 'no,' " Kunz said. "There's so many people that have prejudices about the Hispanic community and they don't even know them."

Not much locals can do

Kunz and Lavery talk regularly about suspected illegal immigrants in town and agree there's little locals can do to combat illegal immigration. Even before a federal judge last week struck down Hazleton, Pa.'s, ban on hiring or renting to illegal immigrants, Lavery said he knew the ban was legally questionable, although he said he agrees with its aim.

Town officials have researched a proposal from Morristown, N.J., where the mayor wants to deputize local police officers as federal immigration agents.

"We're trying to see what works for other people and what doesn't work for other people," Lavery said. "I'm not going to go off half-cocked and get the town sued."

Kunz said there is not much his department can do because federal officials are not equipped to deal with the influx of illegal immigrants.

"The harsh reality of it is if you identify people here locally, they're not ready at the national level to handle it," he said.

Kunz said town council members have asked him to add more downtown patrols to address the issue but he said he does not have the manpower.

In 2005, the town council enacted an ordinance to combat residential overcrowding, or stacking, a practice some town residents said was especially prevalent among downtown residents. Landlords now have to pay a $120 annual fee for annual property inspections. Since notice is given for the inspections, it's been difficult to catch many who violate the rules, Lavery said.

Seeking legal status

Michael Alper, a Hackettstown-based immigration attorney, said most of his clients are eager to become legal residents. Some employers are also eager to seek legal status for their workers, he said.

"There are a number of farms in the area that have contacted me to do things for people who work there because they can't get Americans to serve those positions," Alper said. "Most of my clientele here in this area are hard-working people who come here and want to make a living. They want to achieve the American dream."

Alper said the threat of local enforcement often scares immigrants, who have moved out in force from Hazleton and Riverside, N.J., which had an ordinance similar to Hazleton's until town officials stopped its enforcement in June due to a legal challenge. The town's economies have suffered with the immigrants leaving, he said.

Hackettstown has been generally welcoming to its immigrants, said Alper, who added he believes Main Street is thriving more today than when he moved there five years ago.

Others doubt if immigrants are well accepted in town.

The Hackettstown Business Improvement District interviewed many of the town's Hispanic business owners recently and found many didn't feel accepted, Executive Director David Rucki said.

"They felt not really warmly welcomed and afraid to get involved in things," he said.

But many of the Hispanic storeowners were also upset by downtown loiterers, he said.

"They recognize the problem of loitering in the streets," Rucki said. The loiterers "don't really shop in their stores and they give them a bad name."

http://www.pennlive.com/news/expresstim ... xml&coll=2

"We're trying to see what works for other people and what doesn't work for other people," Lavery said. "I'm not going to go off half-cocked and get the town sued."

They can't be sued for participating in the 287g program. So what's his next excuse?

There are plenty of ordinances that could be enforced against these people and these politicians know it.

What are these 'officials' getting out of this? They have to be getting something. Are the local employers paying them off? Are the local employers giving them orders to stand aside or they will put them out of office?

They are not - are not - mouthing these La Raza talking points - "just like the IRish', etc. on their own.

Maybe someone should stop by the day worker gathering place and hand out the Mayor's address as someone who wants a dozen workers at 6 am the next morning?

"If it was 10 white-haired ladies standing there, would (they) be concerned? The answer is 'no,' " Kunz said. "There's so many people that have prejudices about the Hispanic community and they don't even know them."

No I wouldn't worry about 10 white haired ladies....I'm assuming he's refering to them being elderly. I wouldn't worry about 10 white haired hispanic ladies either.....meaning elderly.....legal or illegal.

We just don't have a big problem with old ladies hanging out in mass at street corners and changing their depends by the road side. They aren't saying "hey baby....let a woman show you how it's done" and the ends of their walking canes aren't hiding weapons....they don't rape kids, they aren't selling drugs.etc.

Most of our towns aren't being invaded by elderly people of any color, legal or illegal. Even when the "snow-birds" arrived in Florida....it didn't change the entire environment of the town. You weren't scared of getting mugged by the granny brigade. They didn't party till 4 AM keeping your neighborhood up at night. Might be slow you down a bit if they were having trouble moving fast but you never felt afraid to have them live next door to you. They didn't insist that everyone conform to the special needs of the elderly.

It's totally different. I have an elderly friend who lives in Florida who literally hides out in her home because the lovely neighbor kids steal her oranges and pelt her with them when she goes outside.....the parents just grin with pride at their kids. She's tried to talk to them....but of course they don't speak English. They blast their music till the wee hours of the morning and she has a bed-ridden husband inside with advanced cancer.

There were kids of all kinds and colors in the neighborhood who never bothered people. Most of them are gone and it's become a hispanic neighborhood now. There's only 2 non-hispanic homes left in the neighborhood because they successfully ran everyone else out. Not old hispanics running them out......all the new young ones who brag about being illegal. The quiet muli-racial and multi-aged community is no longer. Heck we had legal hispanics living down the street who left. Real nice people. Sorry.......but there's a definate difference.

Oh, that's awful about the elderly. You know, though, that a lot of elderly people are living that nightmare.

It may be my thinking, but I believe part of the reason for AZ trying to do something is because of the snowbirds. If crime begins to mount in AZ -- all over - the snowbirds won't return. The elderly are vulnerable and I think AZ has been pretty good at keeping the lid on the news stories, but it will get out. Much of that state's economy is built on the snowbirds.

Not only will the snowbirds not return and spend money, they will not maintain their homes there year round for fear of vandalism and burgulary. All those 'old fogey fortresses' will become illegal ghettos.

It may be my thinking, but I believe part of the reason for AZ trying to do something is because of the snowbirds. If crime begins to mount in AZ -- all over - the snowbirds won't return. The elderly are vulnerable and I think AZ has been pretty good at keeping the lid on the news stories, but it will get out. Much of that state's economy is built on the snowbirds.

I beleive it's part of it. Just like Florida. Just like young families...they go to areas where there are good and safe schools. If you are thinking or have to move as a young family.....you check out schools. Right now we have an invasion....and if you look at who's involved in this......it's parents with young kids and elderly......They hit both communities because they have kids and there's a call for services for the elderly. It's our schools effected and a growing problem with elderly being ripped off. Both of our most vunerable on both ends are being effected. Must speak Spainish and bi-lingual education....or elderly counting on honest help and being at the mercy of a lawn guy or a care giver who doesn't speak English.....
If I'm not safe with my kids or my grandparents....I'm not comming there.

Daytona Beach USED to be a great spot......forget it now. Trust me....you don't take your kids there and you don't take your grandma.....15 to maybe 30 yr.old singles. Drunks, drugs and smut driven. Child porn, prostitution....it's your heaven! Not mine.

Originally Posted by nntrixie

Oh, that's awful about the elderly. You know, though, that a lot of elderly people are living that nightmare.

It may be my thinking, but I believe part of the reason for AZ trying to do something is because of the snowbirds. If crime begins to mount in AZ -- all over - the snowbirds won't return. The elderly are vulnerable and I think AZ has been pretty good at keeping the lid on the news stories, but it will get out. Much of that state's economy is built on the snowbirds.

Not only will the snowbirds not return and spend money, they will not maintain their homes there year round for fear of vandalism and burgulary. All those 'old fogey fortresses' will become illegal ghettos.

We're already seeing many neighborhoods that used to have a high popoulation of snowbirds turn into illegal ghettos. The neighborhood across from my own and the one my brother in law lives in a mile away are just two examples.

Snowbirds are just going elsewhere, or when they pass away, their heirs just sell to whoever will buy the place because they've seen the downfall of the surrounding properties.

It's really disgusting to see these once quiet, neat and clean places, that the older folks spent so many years taking pride in, deteriorate. Weeds, broken boarded up windows, sheets hanging in windows, all kinds of furniture, matresses, etc. piling up in the yards.......the list just goes on.

My brother in law was just saying to my husband over the weekend that he's getting the heck out of here as soon as he can. Not that I can blame him......we'd pack up the kids and be out of here tomorrow ourselves if we could.