Thread: Are they assimilating in spite of LaRaza?

Thanksgiving, what could be more American? All of it's fixings, it's traditions.

Seems that here in Oregon, I do not see the heavy allegiance to Mexico that many of you here at ALIPAC have reported in your area's. I do not see the bumper sticker Mexican flags, the shirts and all else.

Instead, the day before Thanksgiving, I see the illegal aliens here, in the stores, buying all the American style trimmings for Thanksgiving.

My not so nice next door neighbors, making the all traditionally American meal. I could smell it through our shared kitchen wall.

I saw them bringing in their groceries.

I saw too many to count in the store buying their Thanksgiving birds and cranberry sauce, olives, and the likes. They all seemed pretty excited about the event.

Then I wondered, is La Raza and all the racist Latino groups losing their battle to keep these people "Latino", to keep them from integrating?

Seems to me they are lsing that battle.

Oh, I know, if they are illegal, their integration is all in vain. However, what does it say about the agendas of these groups? Do the majority of the people they want to control, really want to be part of their plans?

I have to feel that with all that I have been seeing, those racist agenda's to keep their people exclusively "Latino", is not going well. It would seem that the illegals (who knows, maybe they are legal here?) wish to integrate.

I still feel firm, no matter how much they wish to blend in, if they are here illegally, they need to be taken into custody and deported, but I am somewhat hopeful for the future of our culture.

I am hopeful, as it seems that within one generation, many seem to have Americanized, as so many do from all sorts of countries. They speak English, they wear the clothes, they know the pop-culture, they eat the foods.

What I see makes me feel hopeful that more than not will integrate, leaving behind those racist diehards to wallow in their cultural self-pity, hating them for "selling out".

Still I support NO AMNESTY, and no earned citizenship, sorry I am not that soft. I support doing things the American way, "get back in the end of the line and wait your turn!". Break the laws? Go home. Want to come LEGALLY? Integrate, take on our language and culture.

Could be those groups are losing their grip on their uneducated masses to support their political agenda?

Hello AmericanE. I have been passively reading through the forum from time to time and I thought I'd give my personal experience regarding LaRaza and what not. I am Hispanic, second generation. From my observations, I would say that many Hispanics are not even aware of La Raza's organization. I mean, they hardly listen to the Pope, except the religious zealots. The first time I heard about La Raza was through this web site. Nevertheless, they don't seem to be actively "indoctrinizing" Hispanics in the US to remain whatever it is they wish them to be.

Believe it or not, immigrants celebrate the Fourth of July. When my family and I go to the park, I see many with their kids at the beach having a cook out. (And of course later the fireworks). No Mexican flags, no doctrines about Mexico, but sure they do play their tunes.

Maybe it's different in the border states of course. This is just an observation from the Nothernly realm.

I hope that everyone had a great Thanksgiving!

Welcome Roxas, I live in Oregon, and although here many people who are illegal tend to keep to themselves, I have heard it is otherwise in the border states. I know the people within my complex and and community who are definitely illegal, therefore for me to observe them celebrating Thanksgiving, in spite of the massive anti-American protests in the recent past, as well, I have listened to the top two leaders of La Raza speak.

I do believe that there is a fairly decent percentage of people who are not American citizens, who have the anti-American sentiment, that have been listening to these people, as well as some other radical factions. Does everyone who is Latino listen? No person in their right mind would assume so.

My point exactly is, so many during the protests and in national news forums have spoken so radically about their cultural ties, that for the people who most passionately hang onto their language culture and their citizenship to Mexico, leave the rest of us with the impression that it is in general, the illegal aliens from Mexico, who oppose anything which is American.

Here where we live, we are the only American family. Over these three years, these people have bold faced told us that they do not like us, called our kids dirty names (racial), and have said extremely disparaging words about America and our culture. Yes, it has been one sided, we have gone about our lives, tending to our own business, but in spite of that have had these things happening. This is also my impression of those here illegally from Mexico.

Now, on the other hand Roxas, I have no problem with anyone who is Hispanic/Latino (whichever you prefer it to be). I have no problem with anyone who is loyal to this country, follows the laws we have in place to come here legally, and as well has respect for us and our way of life here, but I have not seen that fully.

Yes, I have seen a lot of disprespect come from the illegals here, but as I understand it, not nearly as much as in the border states.

Read this, and tell me us if you yourself believe in this, this is the kind of thing we see in the news frequently: http://www.aztlan.net/castroaztlan.htm

Just a note, the Southwestern United States is just that, the United States, it belongs to Americans, the ones who have made it what it is today, and for ANYONE in Mexico, America, or anywhere else for that matter, to say it is not ours and that we should hand it back with all of it's improvements, after it has been paid for, needs their nutty head examined.

Castro, like those Aztlan people, is crazy.

Another thing which I never heard of was the Aztlan thingy. At least, people do not speak or care about it in the North. When I began looking into it, this seems to be the work of young and liberal Latino college students (most of them I would assume to be citizens since illegal immigrants can't really pay for their education in a place like Berkely). Now, to say that such ideas could move 11 million people to belief it as if it were their own faith... it is hard to believe. Anyways, if this whole problem is solved soon, there is no way they can "take" over the southwest. Nevertheless, if they mean that they can change the racial composition, that's something else.

While the Aztlan people are crazy, I doubt that they will ever come into control. In the meantime, I believe it's time for Hispanics in general to become aware that they are not just "natives" i.e. 100% Aztecs, Mayans, etc. The way I see myself, for instance, I probably have Aztec, Spaniard, Muslim, Jewish, and Italian ancestors. But I do not take that idea to the extreme, like these Aztlan people do.

Have faith in people. They are smarter than you think... I hope!

I would say that many Hispanics are not even aware of La Raza's organization.

Roxas, I have to disagree with that. I have a few friends from Mexico, who won't confirm or deny LaRaza or Aztlan. With celebrities like Eva Longoria promoting LaRaza, how can they not know about it? If it isn't happening, wouldn't they just deny it? Everything is so hush hush. Yet they are not shy about their loyalty to Mexico. I've seen cars in my neighborhood with gigantic Mexican flags on the hood. That is a difficult thing to see without getting angry. I am Irish, but I don't promote Ireland. First and foremost, I am an American, and I am glad that my parents raised me with loyalty. I truly believe that the older generation came here for the right reasons, but I am suspicious of the younger people coming here because there is so much arrogance and a lack of gratitude. Of course, I cannot say that about everyone, because I have met plenty of people who were very kind. But even with my friends, we know not to bring up politics because we don't see eye to eye.

this seems to be the work of young and liberal Latino college students (most of them I would assume to be citizens

I don't think it's just college students but it do beleive it's the younger crowd. I just know these groups have done a huge amount of damage for the Latino community concerning attitudes about Latinos in general. You can't go screaming "racist" and then be only concerned about "your people". I know here they've sponsored pizza parties for good attendance in school.......but only for Latino students. They've started a program for Latino students who are having trouble in main stream school and are on the verge of becomming drop-outs. Great programs but it's only for Latinos. I just don't get it. They are doing more to seperate people than they are to bridging any gaps.

Roxas, the man who heads up this internet site, Los Vos de Aztlan, is not a college student, he is a full grown man. As well there are many college professors who are Latino as well promoting this.

If you think about it, this is capturing the up and coming adult population, both citizen and illegal, who would like to think of themselves akin to the black people in the 50/60's civil rights movement. Oppressed, no opportunities, everyone hates them, but there is NO comparison. They are playing up the part of the victim, unlike the blacks who were really victims, and in that course, it is also pulling in those adults who are here illegally, who would like to blame their own countries poverty, and that of their own here, on the white Americans.

It is doing damage. We all have seen it, and heard it.

As an American, and of Hispanic descent, you have an advantage. You can speak to people and tell them, these groups and fanatics are poison, and only seek to promote their own political power, they do not care about the majority of the illegals as they promote themselves to.

What they are not being honest about is that the very first mistake the illegals have made is to come here against our laws, which has made them criminals, then they have done things such as using Social Security Numbers that are false, ID theft, some lie to the states to get benefits, then these fanatics implore them to do more in the guise that it was theirs in the first place, and they have a right to come in and take it.

Yes Roxas, these people are listening to these lunatics. If Americans do not unite regardless of race or religion, we will have allowed this madness to happen, and are going to be subject to living within their will of things, not that of our own.

We here are not fanatics, and most of us do see this issue for what it is, an attempted hostile invasion, not only of a people who have not asked to be here, but of ideals and ways we do not want.

So long as Mexico and the Central American corrupted governments keep pushing their uneducated and impoverished on us, they will have averted sweeping reforms and potential revolutions in their own countries, they want to keep it as it is. These people are nothing to their governments, and they do not care about them, as well they too promote the idea of the "oppressed brown person", and that they have to recapture this continent for themselves. Their governments and those fanatics are sending them on a wild goose chase, one to keep them at bay, the other to gain political power.

Roxas, I have to disagree with you on no one up north knows of La Raza.
On most of our street corners there are La Raza news boxes, after the
marches you heard more Spanish being spoken, everything is now geared
toward the Hispanic's, like they are the only ones who live here; more
store have put up signs in Hispanic and play Hispanic music.
More and more I hear how people lost their job or can not find a job
because they can not speak Spanish or Polish. Our neighborhood has
had more and more illegal house conversions and more and more cars
that you leave your space - you lost your space. I too have seen the
Mexican on the hood of cars; with people in them yelling Viva Mexico.
Our allys are filled with garbage and rats are king at night.
I work with these people and they want everything translated for them
but will not translate for you, and they rattle on and on. They know how
to complain but will not not for themselves and think its always some
one elses job to pick up after them. The organizations here love to
work with the young people so they can brainwash them with false
statements about America (I've heard it). They teach these kids how
to protest for everything they want. Many of the adults have only
third grade education and believe what they are told. And because they
can not speak English they can not communcate with their children
so many of them join gangs and before 16 drop out of school, then
hang out in front of the schools to get more members.
La Raza is alive and well here and have a hold on most of policitians;
they get most of what they want with eaze.
Their are two sets of rules here; one for the Hispanics and one for
everyone else.
As long as our government lets them get away with it; one illegal act
turns to another and another.

Interesting. Well, I hope that the government begins enforcement. Soon. I can't stand when immigrants come to this country, still respecting the country they left which supposedly was harming them to begin with.

I think I have managed to control my feelings of anger throughout this entire fiasco. Whether there is amnesty or not, those borders have to be shut down. Period. I think that is the most important thing, since a broken border is a security threat to this country.

The Aztlan buffoons can be taken care of easily. If I could, I would go up to them in a public debate and easily throw down their crazy ideologies.

Roxas, I am glad that you are in this discussion group because I think that you can shed some light on a few questions:

If the Mexican people have such loyalty to Mexico, why do they leave? Mexico is rich in natural resources and is capable of taking care of it's citizens, so they really don't need to leave. If Mexican people were loyal to their country, they would stay in Mexico. That is like a cheating husband saying how much he loves his wife. If he did, he wouldn't be cheating. Think about it!!!

I'm not sure how much you've traveled throughout the world, but any place that I have been, there are obvious cultural differences, which are important to respect. People come here, and it is a free for all. I think the world has been watching too much tv because the average American doesn't live in Hollywood, we aren't crazy, and we have a proud heritage and culture too. Why isn't that being respected? We are a hard working, generous, peace loving, family oriented group pf people who have respect for our laws. We also welcome all who have respect for our country and it's people, which is a lot more than I can say for other countries around the world.

Do you not see, hear, and read about the drugs, the illegal people, the violence, and the rape that Mexican people are bringing to the US? I don't think all Mexican people are like that, but we have thousands of them that do, and they are setting the example. If this hurts your feelings, then too bad. All of the good people of Mexico should be angry at the disrespectful one, not those of us who are telling the truth. The problem may be that the standards in Mexico are lower than ours, and you find this behavior appropriate. We do not. If you were really concerned, you would let the Mexican community know that they should represent your culture with dignity. Any problems or stereotypes that you are experiencing are brought on by the people who do not act appropriately. If you don't believe me, check how many of your gang members and criminals are roaming our streets. There are plenty of statistics to back me up.

The last time that I was in Mexico, I was disgusted at the way they try to rip off Americans. How would you like it if we raised the prices of merchandise just because of the color of your skin, how would you like to be badgered continuously while you were shopping? Would you enjoy people following you around begging for your money. Mexico thinks that we are rich. We aren't rich, we bust our ... for forty, fity, sixty hours a week and then we fork over almost half of our paycheck so that ungrateful and undeserving people can benefit from the use of our hard work. In addition to that we are generous with our time and donations. I can't tell you how many times I'v missed my kid's game to do a job that I wasn't crazy about. My family is the most important thing in the world to me. And, contrary to popular belief, family means more to Americans than money. We work hard for a living instead of running to another country to suck the money out of other people's wallets.

There is NO gratitude!! Shame on you for judging us. Obviously the cultural difference are just too great. Perhaps we should stay in our respective countries.