Thread: III part series on REAL ID from Assistant Sec. for Policy

Originally Posted by roundabout

RealId, could it be a synonym for RealId-iot?

I am a male. I am a female. I am confused. I am an adult. I am a child. I am white. I am black. I am brown. I am pink with purple polk-a-dots. I am hetrosexual. I am homosexual. I am bi-sexual. I am confused. I am religous. I am not. I am a Catholic. I am a Jew. I am a Hindi. I am a Moslem. I am a Christian. I am agnostic. I am a gnostic. I am a Republican. I am a Democrat. I am a Liberatarian. I am a Socialist. I am a Communist. I am wealthy. I am middle class. I am poor. I am blue collared. I am white collared. I am an Independent. I am a business owner. I am a employee. I am retired. I live in the country. I live in town. I live in a city. I live on a house boat. I live in a condo. I live in the ghettos. I live in a mansion. I like to gamble. I do not. I give to charity. I do not. I am a taxpayer. I recieve tax dollars. I am single. I am married. I have children. I do not. I have 15 children. I have 2. I am disabled. I am not. I am a high school graduate. I am not. I am a college graduate. I went to public schools. I went to private schools. I went to a religous school. I did not. I like cheese sandwiches. I like PJ's. I like mustard. I like ketchup..........................

Ever get the feeling that if the wrong people ever where to get enough of the right information they could run the world?

Ever wonder why we have a two party system that seems to work oh so well?

Ever wonder if a team of statisticians, sociologists, and political anylysts where to have a bunch of information that they could correlate all of that information right down to a red state, blue state map? Or a red district, blue district? Or a red block, blue block?

Nothing quite like two political parties with all of the right information, huh?

Perhaps our politicians need more of our personal information so that others will feel more secure? Perhaps a digitalized and autographed family portrait? Complete with fingerprints?

Perhaps the next time you take part in the census or a survey, try this. If you are white, tell them you are black. If you are black tell them you are white. If you are a male tell them you are a female. If you are a female tell them you are a male. If you have 10 children, tell them you have one. If you have 2 tell them you have 20. If you are blonde, tell them you are a brunette. If you smoke, tell them you have quit. If you drink, tell them you drink like a fish.


Make them work for your vote. Help to eliminate the preconcieved notions that the politicians use to tell their targeted audience what they will do for them.

Who should we run and how in this district in order to achieve success? Let us check the information in our little book. Oh, he will fit right in! Just say this or that.

The Germans and the Russians were both good at gathering and interpreting information, look where that got them.

So if they get all the about information "Ever get the feeling that if the wrong people ever where to get enough of the right information they could run the world?"

How so -- LOL - They already can get this information - I can get it if I want it. Information sealed by the courts can be gotten.

Your bank has passed all your information to India. Try calling your bank and asking about you account. You'll be lucky to be able to understand the person.

I think the feds need to go after people who do not use their names properly for example, some people only use their middle names with their surnames on their id's and such, instead of their first name. I find people like that very suspicious. I had an employer who did that. He used one name on his business license, another on his phone number, another version of his name on hie lease and so on. I'm not sure why but it seems like he might of been up to no good.

Help fight the Real ID in NC

visit www.ncard.info

JP wrote:

I think the feds need to go after people who do not use their names properly for example, some people only use their middle names with their surnames on their id's and such, instead of their first name.

Real ID driver’s license must include full legal name.

For those of you fighting the Real ID, MySpace and Facebook are among a couple of good places to send out the word. With just one bulletin post you can reach thousands in nanseconds.

JP wrote:

For those of you fighting the Real ID, MySpace and Facebook are among a couple of good places to send out the word. With just one bulletin post you can reach thousands in nanseconds.

I give it some thought.

I want to thank all of you who have been signing on to help. I have the complete media list and a few other contacts we can use to defeat the Real ID in NC. Thanks Again. I really do appreciate it. Those of you from other states who want to help fight the Real ID in NC, please feel free to contact me. The More states to reject the Real ID, the easier it will be to get it repealed at the Federal Level.

"March 22, 2005, 7:57 a.m.
A REAL Solution
The safe side of the ID debate.

By Mark Krikorian

When Mexican President Vicente Fox visits President Bush's ranch Wednesday, he is sure to complain about his host's support for the REAL ID Act, which effectively bans driver's licenses for illegal aliens. The House appended the measure last week to the supplemental appropriations bill for Iraq operations, guaranteeing a Senate debate on the issue. It's likely that there will be another showdown between the two houses of Congress like the one that took place last fall over the intelligence reform bill.


Originally approved by the House in February by a 100-vote margin (with only eight Republicans opposed), the REAL ID Act (H.R. 41 would, among other things, establish certain minimum standards for states if they want their driver's licenses or non-driver IDs to be accepted for federally mandated purposes, such as boarding a plane or entering a federal facility. The standards include verifying the legal status of the applicant, setting the license of a foreign visitor to expire when his visa expires, verifying documents presented by applicants, and modernizing the technology used in licenses.

Some libertarians have denounced the license requirements as the precursor to a national ID card. The Wall Street Journal helpfully invoked the Gestapo by decrying the bill's "show-us-your-papers" approach. Rep. Ron Paul (R., Tex.), God bless him, called the bill "a Soviet-style internal passport system." And the ACLU said it's "laying the foundation" for a national ID card.

Eternal vigilance is indeed the price of liberty, so extra sensitivity to proposals like the REAL ID Act is all to the good. But after a close look, it should be clear there is no national ID card lurking in this bill; after all, Phyllis Schlafly sure wouldn't support it if there were.

But there's more. It's not just that the bill wouldn't establish a national ID; by making our existing, decentralized identification arrangements more secure, the REAL ID Act is the only thing that can stop a national ID card.

The need for more security in our existing document system was highlighted by the 9/11 Commission: "The federal government should set standards for the issuance of birth certificates and sources of identification, such as driver's licenses. Fraud in identification documents is no longer just a problem of theft. At many entry points to vulnerable facilities, including gates for boarding aircraft, sources of identification are the last opportunity to ensure that people are who they say they are and to check whether they are terrorists." (see Chapter 12, p. 390.)

At least two of the 9/11 hijackers had overstayed their visas, and thus their state-issued IDs should have expired. As legal means of entry become increasingly difficult for terrorists, they will seek to enter illegally (as suggested by persistent intelligence reports), making access to government-issued IDs all the more important. In fact, just last week, the 9/11 Commission's counsel told the Senate Judiciary Committee of al Qaeda operative Nabil Al-Marabh, who sneaked illegally over the Canadian border in mid-2001 and was found to have received five Michigan licenses in 13 months, plus licenses from Massachusetts, Illinois, and Florida.

Nor is this laxity purely a Sept. 10 phenomenon; our state-based identification system remains in serious trouble. The Coalition for a Secure Driver's License cleverly has ranked the states according to the Homeland Security Department's color-coding system, with too many states still in the red, "severe risk" category. Some continuing problems: Over the past six years, Utah has issued 56,498 driver licenses and 37,481 non-driver IDs to people without Social Security numbers — i.e. illegal aliens. In New York State, one Social Security number was used to get 57 driver's licenses. And it came to light just last week that an illegal alien in Florida presented a driver's license so he could go to work — at a nuclear power plant.

After 9/11, calls for a national ID card were widespread; from 9/11 until the end of 2001, there were almost three times as many Nexis hits for "national ID" as there were for all of 2000. As the Washington Post wrote in December 2001, "Almost from the day the planes hit the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, members of Congress, security experts and high-tech executives have endorsed the idea of some new form of identification system as a critical weapon in the fight against terrorism."

In the wake of another attack the momentum could be politically irresistible, unless the public was satisfied that improvements to our existing system were already under way. And there might well be less resistance among lawmakers anyway, since most Democratic congressmen (and too many Republicans) don't really want the borders to be controlled in the first place; so the development of a federally issued universal ID would be an attractive alternative for politicians wanting to appear responsive to the Islamist threat.

Some of the bill's opponents seem especially out of touch. The Wall Street Journal, for instance, wrote, "It's not hard to imagine these de facto national ID cards turning into a kind of domestic passport that U.S. citizens would be asked to produce for everyday commercial and financial tasks." The Journal's editorial writers must not get out much, because regular people have been producing government-issued photo IDs "for everyday commercial and financial tasks" for a very long time. The choice is not between the minimum standards in the REAL ID Act, on the one hand, and on the other, some libertarian utopia where no one knows your name. The choice we are faced with is a tightening of our current, decentralized system of identification, or the eventual demand by a frightened public for a genuine, centralized national ID system.

This isn't the first time the libertarians have fought improvements in ID security. Congress in 1996 actually passed some minimal standards for licenses, but as the implementation deadline approached two years later, then-Rep. Bob Barr (R., Ga.) led the effort to kill the measure. And the president's initial 2002 border security proposal also had such standards in it, but they were pronounced dead on arrival by then Majority Leader Dick Armey (R., Tex.).

So once again, libertarian ideologues are objective allies of big government, trying to block the limited reforms that are the only way to stave off the more sweeping measures favored by the Left.

As genuine conservatives stand athwart history and yell "stop," we need to offer an alternative. The REAL ID Act is the only alternative to a national ID card.
Center for Immigration Studies."

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/k ... 220757.asp

So, should would support Real ID or does a federally issued universal ID sound more appealing? There is no getting around the fact that something has to be done to tighten identity security. The alternatives to Real ID could be much worse.

The Real ID Act is a National ID Card. it links all State Databases along with Mexico and Canada. That is a National id or yet even better and international ID.

If anyone wants to Know, I spoke with Dr Carl Mumpower who is running for 11th District in NC. He is opposed to the Real ID. Learn more about Dr. Mumpower here http://www.mumpower08.com/

JP wrote:

The Real ID Act is a National ID Card.

At the risk of repeating myself for the 2nd, 3rd, or 4th time):

Excerpt:

[quote]Is this a National ID card?

No. The proposed regulations establish common standards for States to issue licenses. The Federal Government is not issuing the licenses, is not collecting information about license holders, and is not requiring States to transmit license holder information to the Federal Government that the Government does not already have (such as a Social Security Number). Most States already routinely collect the information required by the Act and the proposed regulations.


Who will have access to the information that the DMV will be required to collect?

As they do now, authorized DMV officials in the licensing State will have access to DMV records. DMV employees in one State cannot “fishâ€

Yes, they say one thing while doing another. Gee there's a surprise. Just what they do with Immigration enforcement and fence building.


[quote]
Page 7
A primary privacy concern has been whether the REAL ID will result in a national identity system, including a centralized database of PII regarding all drivers. Although DHS cannot control how private sector third parties will use REAL ID cards, it can address the concern regarding the development of a centralized database. DHS states the following in the [b]preamble to the final rule: “DHS does not intend that a REAL ID document become a de facto national ID based on the actions of others outside of DHS to limit their acceptance of an identity document to a REAL ID-compliant driver’s license or identification card.â€