Thread: Motion:America is to Blame for Mexico's Drug War

A debate before a voting (adult) audience held at New York University was aired last evening on Bloomberg TV on a program called "Intelligence (mathematical symbol for) squared". The subject of the debate was, "Motion: America is to Blame for Mexico's Drug War". I came in past the middle and did not write down the names of the 6 adult professional TV speaker-type participants, two of whom were Hispanic and who represented solely an "anti-Calderon Drug War" point of view. Before the debate began, the audiences' votes were:

For the Motion: 43%; Against the Motion: 23%; Undecided: 34%

At the conclusion of a tepid debate, featuring eye-rolling by an economics professor from Harvard arguing "For" whenever Asa Hutchison, former Director (or Deputy Director) of the DEA spoke "Against" this amazing proposition, the audience vote had risen to:

For the Motion: 72%; Against the Motion: 22%; Undecided: 6%

I was truly stunned at the overwhelming number voting in support of the motion. Audience members seemed not only willing but eager to believe that drug consumption in the United States (demand from Europe, where illegal drugs also are consumed in large quantities, never was mentioned) had "forced" some people in Mexico who are, in reality, by nature totally uncaring, unprincipled, and highly dangerous, to organize and pursue these extraordinarily profitable drug operations in place of, for example, selling shoes for a living. They also clucked with disapproval after learning from a panel participant that Mexican drug cartels now have branched out into human trafficking, seemingly not over any alarm or disapproval of the actions of the cartel members themselves ("a man has to eat"), but over the fact that actions in and by the United States evidently had "driven" Mexican Drug Cartel leaders to additional desperate measures in order to support themselves and their hosts of "employees".

A depressing less than half hour's viewing.

Yeah probably another set up to brainwash us that all of Mexico's problems are our fault. They have propaganda and set up situations coming from directions right now hoping we will buy the BS.

America needs to legalize/regulate/tax under the FairTax the illegal drug trade and ensure it's 100% owned and operated by US citizens. A certain percentage of Americans want to use drugs on some level. They view it as part of their liberty. Whether you agree or or disagree with that desire to use drugs, it's a fact. American authorities and those who support them in the War on Drugs are causing havoc in our own society, creating deplorable ruination of lives in ways far more dangerous than drugs, based on a misguided concept that they know better than someone else how they should live their lives.

The War on Drugs is a prime example of how we've strayed from the concepts of liberty and laissez-faire that our country was founded upon to an authoritarian society that works against the grains of freedom, liberty, fairness, reason, logic, pragmatism and tolerance that are and have always been the true soul of the American People.

Of course they're going to blame us and we have idiots in this country that believe every word they say.

Everyone has the right to be an Idiot once in awhile, But those in Washington and the media are abusing the privlege.

It is mind boggling how many in this country have been brain washed to believe that America is evil and to blame for all the ills of Mexico and the rest of the world. The more that are brought in from third world countries to take up residence in the US the more that mind set seems to set in. Those that are supposed to be Americans that go along with that mind set are in my mind DISGUSTING !

I guess using this train of thought we should blame banks for being robbed. If they didn't have so much money they would cause people to rob them?

I guess it is also America's fault that Mexico too is a consumer of its own drugs. The number of addicts in Mexico has grown in just six years by more than 50 percent, from 300,000 to 465,000, according to government statistics. This is addicts, not casual drug users.

However, instead of criminalizing drug use Mexico has made it legal. Not only is the use of marijuana legal, but cocaine, LSD, and heroin will be tolerated for personal and limited use.

Originally Posted by bigtex

I guess using this train of thought we should blame banks for being robbed. If they didn't have so much money they would cause people to rob them?

I guess it is also America's fault that Mexico too is a consumer of its own drugs. The number of addicts in Mexico has grown in just six years by more than 50 percent, from 300,000 to 465,000, according to government statistics. This is addicts, not casual drug users.

However, instead of criminalizing drug use Mexico has made it legal. Not only is the use of marijuana legal, but cocaine, LSD, and heroin will be tolerated for personal and limited use.

I'm curious on how it will be "limited".

Originally Posted by mkfarnam

I'm curious on how it will be "limited".

I am sure it will be like most laws in Mexico, ignored. Now they have given themselves an excuse to turn a blind eye.

Originally Posted by mkfarnam

Originally Posted by bigtex

I guess using this train of thought we should blame banks for being robbed. If they didn't have so much money they would cause people to rob them?

I guess it is also America's fault that Mexico too is a consumer of its own drugs. The number of addicts in Mexico has grown in just six years by more than 50 percent, from 300,000 to 465,000, according to government statistics. This is addicts, not casual drug users.

However, instead of criminalizing drug use Mexico has made it legal. Not only is the use of marijuana legal, but cocaine, LSD, and heroin will be tolerated for personal and limited use.

I'm curious on how it will be "limited".

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/2 ... 64904.html

"Mexico Decriminalizes Small-Scale Drug Possession

"MARK STEVENSON | 08/21/09 07:49 AM

"MEXICO CITY — Mexico decriminalized small amounts of marijuana, cocaine and heroin on Friday – a move that prosecutors say makes sense even in the midst of the government's grueling battle against drug traffickers.

"Prosecutors said the new law sets clear limits that keep Mexico's corruption-prone police from shaking down casual users and offers addicts free treatment to keep growing domestic drug use in check.

"This is not legalization, this is regulating the issue and giving citizens greater legal certainty," said Bernardo Espino del Castillo of the attorney general's office.

"The new law sets out maximum "personal use" amounts for drugs, also including LSD and methamphetamine. People detained with those quantities no longer face criminal prosecution.

"Espino del Castillo says, in practice, small users almost never did face charges anyway. Under the previous law, the possession of any amount of drugs was punishable by stiff jail sentences, but there was leeway for addicts caught with smaller amounts.

"We couldn't charge somebody who was in possession of a dose of a drug, there was no way ... because the person would claim they were an addict," he said.

"Despite the provisions, police sometimes hauled in suspects and demanded bribes, threatening long jail sentences if people did not pay.

""The bad thing was that it was left up to the discretion of the detective, and it could open the door to corruption or extortion," Espino del Castillo said.

"Anyone caught with drug amounts under the new personal-use limit will be encouraged to seek treatment, and for those caught a third time treatment is mandatory.

"The maximum amount of marijuana for "personal use" under the new law is 5 grams – the equivalent of about four joints. The limit is a half gram for cocaine, the equivalent of about 4 "lines." For other drugs, the limits are 50 milligrams of heroin, 40 milligrams for methamphetamine and 0.015 milligrams for LSD.

"Mexico has emphasized the need to differentiate drug addicts and casual users from the violent traffickers whose turf battles have contributed to the deaths of more than 11,000 people since President Felipe Calderon took office in late 2006.

"But one expert saw potential for conflict under the new law.

"Javier Oliva, a political scientist at Mexico's National Autonomous University, said the new law posed "a serious contradiction" for the Calderon administration.

""If they decriminalize drugs it could lead the army, which has been given the task of combating this, to say 'What are we doing'?" he said.

"Officials said the legal changes could help the government focus more on big-time traffickers.

"Espino del Castillo said since Calderon took office, there have been over 15,000 police searches related to small-scale drug dealing or possession, with 95,000 people detained – but only 12 to 15 percent of whom were ever charged with anything."

____________________________

Decriminalization alone doesn't solve the crime problem or shut down the cartels who are responsible for the violence, gangs, murders and torture. That's why I think any country including our own that wants to solve the crime problems associated with the illegal drug trade needs to not only decriminalize but legalize, regulate and tax the entire trade and only license and authorize it's own citizens to own and operate the trade.

For more information, LEAP (Law Enforcement Against Prohibition)

www.leap.cc

This is just a remake of the movie called, Prohibition. Just playing at a different theater.