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05-31-2008, 11:43 PM #31Originally Posted by chloe24
Who knows,maybe those jews are making money off the oil from them ?
I wonder how many marines who know their anthem know which war inspired it ? "from the halls of Montazoma to the SHORES OF TRIPOLI '.
Our first terrorist attacks happened in the 1500s, before we were a nation . And continued up till Thomas Jefferson sent ships to 'patrol the African coast in his ' un-declared' war on these barbareans. Not to speak of the muslims deadly Otterman Empire who had by force taken over much of SE Europe Mid East N.Africa ,Ukrane and spanned 3 continents.
The Marine Anthem was written for our first navy who just so happen to be fighting the 'MUSLIMS' who had already kidnapped and enslaved over a million europeans and Americans between 1530 and 1780 when taking our ships ' Barbary Pirates '. Also their are pictures of their famous torture chambers in our military archives .
Muslm Corsairs kidnapped a whole town in Ireland .
Also We were allies with other nations from our very beginning .
France was one who may have helped us survive to become the great nation we are today, also where our Statue of Liberty came from .
Egyptions ,Africans and muslims were the first to have slaves and still do, also the ones we bought our first slaves from . [ Slavery is evil so not defending it. ] but you will never hear this from any of our universities or schools. And you sure will never see an Alex Haley movie on it either .
Maybe RP should read up on his history .
I am not defending any politicians ,because there is not one I'd vote for .
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06-01-2008, 12:02 AM #32Originally Posted by fj45lvr
George Washinton was not our first president, he was more like our 7th or 8th .
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06-01-2008, 02:15 PM #33
Thanks for the history lesson but as someone who seems quite knowledgeable about it, certainly you cannot believe that Muslims and other people of color, are the only groups who have committed terrorist attacks through the centuries. (Although I think I understand where you're coming from with regard to revisionist history in our classes).
Throughout time we've had tribes of people of all colors and persuasions who are guilty of some very evil and violent acts. They came from China, Scandinavia, Germany, France, England, Rome, etc., etc. They invaded countries, raped and pillaged and took slaves. And just because we Americas didn't invent salvery, we're just as guilty about that, as well as how we treated the Native American Indians.
I'm not about to pull a Rev. Wright and preach that America is completely evil and so is our history. I don't believe that at all. You could argue that the slave trade ended because American abolitionists rose up against it. The fact is, the human race in general has had a pretty poor record of treating one another with compassion and tolerance.
Personally, I find it non-productive to point out all the past horrors committed by Arabs from thousands of years ago to make your point about how we should be entirely committed to Israel. Like I said earlier, we are all guilty of committing violence. But it is this mindset that prevents peace from ever taking root between Arabs & Jews! This living in the past and tit for tat nonesense never gets people anywhere. The Palestinians have a right to a homeland and for their children to live in peace, as well as the Jews.
All I was trying to point out (and I think Ron Paul as well) is that we as a nation and as a world power, have to treat all nations fairly. I mean, isn't that the Christian way? It's our policies that are enraging people and turning them to extremists.
Ron Paul on Palestinian & Israeli Conflict:
I have a proposal and a suggestion which I think fits the American tradition. We should treat both sides equally, but in a different way. Today we treat both sides equally by giving both sides money and telling them what to do. Not $1 million here or there, not $100 million here or there, but tens of billions of dollars over decades to both sides; always trying to buy peace.
Â*Â*My argument is that it generally does not work, that there are unintended consequences. These things backfire. They come back to haunt us. We should start off by defunding, defunding both sides. I am just not for giving all of this money, because every time there are civilians killed on the Israeli side or civilians killed on the Palestinian side, we can be assured that either our money was used directly or indirectly to do that killing.
Â*Â*Â*
So we are, in a way, an accomplice on all of this killing because we fund both sides. So I would argue we should consider neutrality, to consider friendship with both sides, and not to pretend that we are all so wise that we know exactly with whom to have solidarity. I think that is basically our problem. We have a policy that is doomed to fail in the Middle East; and it fails slowly and persistently, always drawing us in, always demanding more money.
With the Arabs, we cannot tell the Arabs to get lost. The Arabs are important. They have a lot of oil under their control. We cannot flaunt the Arabs and say, get lost. We must protect our oil. It is called ``our oil.'' At the same time, there is a strong constituency for never offending Israel.
I think that we cannot buy peace under these circumstances. I think we can contribute by being more neutral. I think we can contribute a whole lot by being friends with both sides. But I believe the money is wasted, it is spent unwisely, and it actually does not serve the interests of the American people.
http://www.ronpaullibrary.org/document.php?id=737
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