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  1. #11
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    This article reminds me of what I hear sometimes in the black community. Keeping in mind, I live with an African American. And yes, we do talk about different things. My love for this person makes me sensitive to what she has to say. Some may think it's a disqualifying position but nonetheless it's still a position.
    After looking at the history of African Americans during Black History Month 2018, my eyes have been opened more than they have been in the past. I cannot align myself with the Democrat Party, but I do have (limited) access to many African Americans' opinions.
    (I am not a spokesman for any African American. I'm just sharing my thoughts)
    African Americans can smell "sweet apples" too!


    Haunted by the smell of apples: 28 years on, Kurds weep over Halabja massacre



    March 17, 2016 9.29am EDT

    EPA/Ali Haider
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    1. Bahar Baser Research Fellow, Coventry University


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    Kurdish history is full of oppression, suffering and tragedies. But the gas attack at Halabja, 28 years ago this week, must surely be the most egregious.
    In 1988, during the closing days of the Iran-Iraq war, Saddam Hussein’s army attacked the Kurdish province near the Iranian border with chemical gas, including mustard gas, sarin, cyanide and tabun. Survivors from Halabja say the gas smelled sweet like apples and instantly killed people who were exposed.

    These attacks were part of a larger genocidal campaign mainly against the Kurdish people. Called al-Anfal, it cost 50,000 to 100,000 lives and destroyed 4,000 villages between February and September 1988. Al-Anfal referenced the eighth “sura” of the Koran, “The Spoils of War”, which described the campaign of extermination of non-believers by Muslim troops in 624CE under Ali Hassan al-Majid.
    In Halabja, nearly 5,000 civilians were killed on the spot. A further 10,000 were left with serious injuries that affect their lives to this day. It was reported that more than 75% of the victims were women, the elderly and children. The attacks completely destroyed residential areas. Many of those who fled were never to return.
    The legacy of the attack is an increased risk of cancer, miscarriage, infertility, birth defects – and a lingering trauma that is being transmitted from one generation to another.
    Poignant: Halabja Memorial in the Kurdistan region of Iraq. Adam Jones CC BY-SA 3.0, CC BY Shocking images taken by journalists were to become global symbols of Halabja – and proofs of the depth of human cruelty. After these genocidal campaigns, many Kurds fled the country and became asylum seekers or refugees in Europe and elsewhere. Today, combined with Kurds from other countries, they constitute the largest stateless diaspora in the world.
    Many Kurds believe that the rest of the world turned a blind eye to the massacres. Despite a handful of European politicians who are considered “the friends of Kurds” and who constantly raised the issue in their parliaments, such as the French politician Bernard Kouchner, the outside world did nothing to prevent these crimes and in many case still doesn’t acknowledge them for what they were – genocidal acts.
    Once the main perpetrator of these crimes – Saddam Hussein – had been toppled from power, Iraq’s High Tribunal and Supreme Court recognised the al-Anfal campaign as genocide – although Halabja was not one of the crimes for which the late dictator was hanged. For many, the issue is not resolved and Kurds do not think that justice has been done. They want to see the campaign recognised as genocide across Europe.
    ‘Chemical’ Ali Hassan al Majid faced questions about Halabja during his trial in 2004. US Air Force photo Talk to people in the Kurdish diaspora, as I have for ten years now, and they’ll explain why recognition of the al-Anfal campaign as genocide across Europe is so important to them. They will tell you that various European companies supplied Saddam’s regime with the poisonous gas that murdered so many Iraqi Kurds – and should be held accountable.
    They’ll point out that many of the perpetrators of these atrocities, including some of the pilots who dropped the bombs and the soldiers who directed the execution of Kurds on a systematic basis, fled to Europe as asylum seekers after the fall of Saddam. They demand that these people should be found and tried for committing crimes against humanity.
    International silence

    Many Kurds believe that their suffering has not been sufficiently acknowledged by the international community. Under pressure from attacks by Islamic State they are frightened at the possibility of massacres to come – and believe that international recognition would prevent these genocidal acts from happening again.
    They also believe that recognition of these massacres will bring more visibility to the Kurds and to the plight of the Kurdish people in general. It would counter the consistent denial of their ethic identity and existence as a people.
    The KRG has had some success with its lobbying over the years: the Norwegian, Swedish and UK parliaments have all recognised the al-Anfal campaign against the Kurds as genocide. In all these cases, MPs of Kurdish origin played a vital role in arguing their case. For instance, in the UK, Nadhim Zahawi – the first Kurdish-origin British MP – was the one who put forward the motion that prompted the British parliament to recognise the Kurdish genocide (a motion supported by, among others, Jeremy Corbyn).
    Meanwhile diasporas in European cities have done what they can to keep this issue on the agenda. There have also been local diaspora initiatives, including one that convinced the Hague City Council to build a Halabja memorial to commemorate the victims.
    This is all well and good. But while the atrocities visited upon the Kurds remain unrecognised as genocide by most of the world – and while murderous groups still bombard and attack defenceless people in their region, the people of Kurdistan still live in fear.

    http://theconversation.com/haunted-b...massacre-55979
    Last edited by Boomslang; 02-23-2018 at 01:36 AM. Reason: for clarity

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by 6 Million Dollar Man View Post
    It looks like democrats are starting to realize that black people are finally starting to see through their lies, and they're getting nervous and putting their propaganda machine in full swing.

    And unfortunately, I think that most are still brainwashed by the democrats' lies, or they wouldn't be continuing to vote for them.
    **I don't hate anyone for the reason that they choose to be with the same sex.**
    I think Black Americans view themselves as every other bloc of voters and not some brainwashed drones.

    Remember Black Americans' rejection of a Democrat Party "bread and butter issue"?
    I remember hearing all kinds of racial names hurled at black people for their refusal to bend to the Dems.
    Do you think the Republicans could have stepped in and "done something"?
    I don't know the answer to that question but I can tell you that they didn't do a thing.

    Most of California's Black Voters Backed Gay Marriage Ban


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    Judge says gay marriage may resume in California next week
    A federal judge in San Francisco ruled Thursday that same-sex marriages in California may resume as soon as Aug. 18, but gave opponents until then to seek an injunction from a higher court.
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    By Karl Vick and Ashley Surdin
    Washington Post Staff Writers
    Friday, November 7, 2008


    LOS ANGELES, Nov. 6 -- Any notion that Tuesday's election represented a liberal juggernaut must overcome a detail from the voting booths of California: The same voters who turned out strongest for Barack Obama also drove a stake through the heart of same-sex marriage.
    Seven in 10 African Americans who went to the polls voted yes on Proposition 8, the ballot measure overruling a state Supreme Court judgment that legalized same-sex marriage and brought 18,000 gay and lesbian couples to Golden State courthouses in the past six months.
    Similar measures passed easily in Florida and Arizona. It was closer in California, but no ethnic group anywhere rejected the sanctioning of same-sex unions as emphatically as the state's black voters, according to exit polls. Fifty-three percent of Latinos also backed Proposition 8, overcoming the bare majority of white Californians who voted to let the court ruling stand.
    The outcome that placed two pillars of the Democratic coalition -- minorities and gays -- at opposite ends of an emotional issue sparked street protests in Los Angeles and a candlelight vigil in San Francisco. To gay rights advocates, the issue was one of civil rights. Attorney General Edmund G. "Jerry" Brown Jr. reworded the ballot language to state that a yes vote was a vote to "eliminate the rights of same-sex couples to marry."
    That appeal ran head-on into a well-funded and well-framed advertising campaign in favor of the ban -- and the deeply ingrained religious beliefs of an African American community that largely declined to see the issue through a prism of equality.
    "I think it's mainly because of the way we were brought up in the church; we don't agree with it," said Jasmine Jones, 25, who is black. "I'm not really the type that I wanted to stop people's rights. But I still have my beliefs, and if I can vote my beliefs that's what I'm going to do.
    "God doesn't approve it, so I don't approve it. And I approve of Him."
    The overwhelming rejection of same-sex marriage by black voters was surprising and disappointing to gay rights advocates who had hoped that African Americans would empathize with their struggle.
    "I wasn't surprised by the Latinos," said Steve Smith, senior consultant for No on 8. "Basically, Latinos and the Anglo population were fairly close. The outlier of the proposition was African Americans. Many are churchgoing; many had ministers tell them to vote."
    Indeed, Proposition 8 promoters worked closely with black churches across the state, encouraging ministers to deliver sermons in favor of the ban.
    "What the church does is give that perspective that this is a sacred issue as well as a social issue," said Derek McCoy, African American outreach director for the Protect Marriage Campaign. "The reason I feel they came out so strong on the issue is one, for them, it's not a civil rights issue, it's a marriage issue. It's about marriage being between a man and a woman and it doesn't cut into the civil rights issue, about equality.

    "The gay community was never considered a third of a person."


    Black residents agreed with that reasoning in interviews at a Culver City mall on Thursday. David Blannon, 73, who opposed the measure, said his wife summed up her yes vote in one sentence: " 'As far as I'm concerned, that's not something I read in the Bible.' And let it go at that," he said.
    But Kesha Young, 32, called religious arguments a cover for persistent prejudices rooted elsewhere. Taboos against homosexuality are exceptionally strong in Africa, McCoy acknowledged.
    "I'm going to tell you something about the black race: We love to pass judgment. I think that's just a smoke screen about the church thing," said Young, a licensed vocational nurse.
    Anthony Maurice-White, 31, who is gay, said he learned early in life to keep his sexual orientation to himself around fellow blacks as a matter of routine. "Closed minds," he said in the mall parking lot. "And they're afraid of change."
    His friend Ike Young, 21, nodded agreement. "I'm straight, but I think a lot of people are bi-curious but they're afraid of what family members will think of them," he said.
    The Latino vote for the ban also appears rooted in culture.
    "It's our tradition," said Flor Guardado, 38, who voted yes. "In Latino Central American culture, the gays aren't accepted."
    Guardado said that in her native Honduras, she would not tell her mother if she had a lesbian friend. "If I had a lesbian friend, they'd think I was a lesbian, too," she said.
    But in Los Angeles, where she owns a hair salon, a different kind of diplomacy obtains. All eight of her employees are gay. When they asked how she voted, she tells them it's a secret.
    "I'm sorry for the gay people. They have feelings," said the mother of two. "Legally, I don't want that for the children. They will be confused and think it's okay. They might think they're gay, too."
    Television commercials supporting the ban skirted the issue of rights, and instead declared that schools would treat same-sex marriage as normal. Even opponents acknowledged the ads as powerful and positioned to influence minority voters, whose children account for a disproportionate share of the public school population.
    Pablo Correa said his mind was made up by a TV spot in which a young girl comes home from school and tells her mother she learned how a prince could marry a prince.
    "Before, I didn't know about Proposition 8. When I saw the commercial, it opened my mind," said Correa, 42, standing in his beauty supply story in Boyle Heights, in heavily Latino East Los Angeles.
    "I don't discriminate against people," he said, with a wave at the rows of lipstick and makeup. "I have a lot of customers who are homosexuals, transsexuals and bisexuals. I'm not against these people."
    He added: "But I'm a traditionalist. I come from a traditional family. People can do whatever they want in their own life, but I have to protect my family."
    Still, strategists for neither major party saw the outcome on Proposition 8 as an opening for Republicans to corral minority voters who share a socially conservative agenda.
    "I think it's unclear that the social conservatism would trump economics," said Arnold Steinberg, a Republican strategist in Los Angeles. "Certainly with Latino voters there have been opportunities to market themselves on a socially conservative level. But the Republican Party has been too bumbling and irresponsible to do anything with it."

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...110603880.html
    Last edited by Boomslang; 02-23-2018 at 04:41 AM.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    I'm a Christian. I'm a Republican. I support gay marriage, I support a woman's right to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. I support protected trade to protect our businesses and industry that provide our jobs that enable us to support ourselves. I support secure borders and limited immigration to protect those jobs, wages, livelihoods and good futures for the American People.

    I was told by a blogger once when I was being attacked by both liberals and conservatives several years ago on another site I used to post on about illegal immigration, that I am a Classic Republican, with the views of the original Republicans, who were social liberals, fiscal conservatives. I wish every Republican, and American for that matter, would at least consider the Classic Republican view, so that our political system is not poisoned and fractured by personal religious views or unduly influenced by the power, wealth and agendas of organized religions.

    Judy's Five Classic Republican Principles To Abide:

    1. if you don't believe in abortion, don't have one
    2. if you don't believe in gay marriage, don't marry one
    3. if you want it, you pay for it
    4. if you breed 'em, you feed 'em
    5. if you make it over there, you sell it over there

    Last edited by Judy; 02-23-2018 at 07:17 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    I'm a Christian. I'm a Republican. I support gay marriage, I support a woman's right to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. I support protected trade to protect our businesses and industry that provide our jobs that enable us to support ourselves. I support secure borders and limited immigration to protect those jobs, wages, livelihoods and good futures for the American People.

    I was told by a blogger once when I was being attacked by both liberals and conservatives several years ago on another site I used to post on about illegal immigration, that I am a Classic Republican, with the views of the original Republicans, who were social liberals, fiscal conservatives. I wish every Republican, and American for that matter, would at least consider the Classic Republican view, so that our political system is not poisoned and fractured by personal religious views or unduly influenced by the power, wealth and agendas of organized religions.

    Judy's Five Classic Republican Principles To Abide:

    1. if you don't believe in abortion, don't have one
    2. if you don't believe in gay marriage, don't marry one
    3. if you want it, you pay for it
    4. if you breed 'em, you feed 'em
    5. if you make it over there, you sell it over there

    Impressive!

    You're a Christian? Good
    You're a Republican? OK.
    You're a supporter of gay marriage? OK
    You believe in abortion? Got it!

    As with the illegal alien groups in the US running around and accusing people that Americans hate "immigrants".
    We are very familiar with that sleight of hand.

    So when you say you're a Christian that believes in abortion and supports gay marriage, should I take
    a look at your definition or save myself the trouble and just accept the different definition for the same word, like
    illegal alien = immigrant?

  5. #15
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    A Christian is someone who believes in Jesus Christ. So I am a Christian because I believe in Jesus Christ. My religion is Protestant. My church denomination is Southern Baptist.

    No, illegal alien is not immigrant. Illegal alien is someone in the United States in violation of US immigration law. Immigrant is someone in the US who has valid, legal, unexpired documentation to be here.
    A Nation Without Borders Is Not A Nation - Ronald Reagan
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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boomslang View Post
    So when you say you're a Christian that believes in abortion and supports gay marriage, should I take
    a look at your definition or save myself the trouble and just accept the different definition for the same word, like
    illegal alien = immigrant?
    I say "Mind your own business!" That is, do what you believe, but don't play god on anybody else! If you believe in abortion, you pay for it. If you are, or accept homosexuality, just don't rub it in my face!

    There is an agenda to make homosexuality the norm, or an equal alternative. I don't think it is either. But I do believe some are inclined that way, naturally. There are people with Tourette Syndrome, who curse uncontrollably. Do we bring society down where everybody curses or do we maintain limitations? Many people have limitations, but with political correctness, society must be geared to the lowest common denominator. Our society cannot excel if that is everybody's goal!

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    A Christian is someone who believes in Jesus Christ. So I am a Christian because I believe in Jesus Christ. My religion is Protestant. My church denomination is Southern Baptist.

    No, illegal alien is not immigrant. Illegal alien is someone in the United States in violation of US immigration law. Immigrant is someone in the US who has valid, legal, unexpired documentation to be here.
    Great. We have the definitions on hand.

    I wasn't asking for a definition. I was asking for a bill of reconciliation.
    The Bible has a position on what a Christian is, gay people and abortion. I was asking you to simply reconcile your
    beliefs with The Bible that you follow since you are a Christian.

    Or, of course, you can keep your religion as a personal space for you and your God.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtdc View Post
    I say "Mind your own business!" That is, do what you believe, but don't play god on anybody else! If you believe in abortion, you pay for it. If you are, or accept homosexuality, just don't rub it in my face!

    There is an agenda to make homosexuality the norm, or an equal alternative. I don't think it is either. But I do believe some are inclined that way, naturally. There are people with Tourette Syndrome, who curse uncontrollably. Do we bring society down where everybody curses or do we maintain limitations? Many people have limitations, but with political correctness, society must be geared to the lowest common denominator. Our society cannot excel if that is everybody's goal!
    Great. I respect your views as being your own.
    This topic was about African Americans being brainwashed by Dems. I pointed out that Black Americans do go against Dems.
    My motive was not to challenge gay people's validity to their beliefs and goals.

    Point was that Black Americans will go against the Dem Party if they do not agree with the position.

    I just briefly followed Judy's tangent on Christianity and her beliefs.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boomslang View Post
    Great. We have the definitions on hand.

    I wasn't asking for a definition. I was asking for a bill of reconciliation.
    The Bible has a position on what a Christian is, gay people and abortion. I was asking you to simply reconcile your
    beliefs with The Bible that you follow since you are a Christian.

    Or, of course, you can keep your religion as a personal space for you and your God.
    I'm not a Bible Thumper. I believe in Jesus, not everything that's said in the Bible. The Bible was written by men, not Jesus, nor God for that matter, men wrote it all, politicized religious men wrote it with all types of their own agendas. Humans knew there was a God, long before there was a Bible.

    Christianity isn't a club. It's not a groupie thing. Christians are individuals who have one thing in common, they believe in Jesus Christ.

    While we're on this trail, in this country, the issue of gay marriage and abortion are settled law. There is nothing wrong with either one. We are also a nation of separation of church and state. I don't want your particular spiritual views interfering with mine through the government. I don't want your income tax to be less than mine because you give to your church or donate to their "charities". I'm heterosexual, but have never had hostile feelings towards gay people.

    We had gay people in my Southern Baptist church when I was a kid. Very nice people. Why would I want to do anything to make them feel uncomfortable, unwanted, forced to live alone, or otherwise ostracized?? I would never want to be like that and never have been.

    As to abortion, I don't see any reason at all and never have of using the force of law to prevent pregnant girls and women from terminating unwanted pregnancies. Who would want to force them into childbirth against their will? I would never want to be part of a "groupie thing" that wanted to do that. Using law to force a pregnant or woman into childbirth against her will is to me, right out of Rosemary's Baby, as icky as it gets.

    It's all very simple to me.
    Last edited by Judy; 02-25-2018 at 02:13 AM.
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  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    I'm not a Bible Thumper. I believe in Jesus, not everything that's said in the Bible. The Bible was written by men, not Jesus, nor God for that matter, men wrote it all, politicized religious men wrote it with all types of their own agendas. Humans knew there was a God, long before there was a Bible.


    Christianity isn't a club. It's not a groupie thing. Christians are individuals who have one thing in common, they believe in Jesus Christ.

    While we're on this trail, in this country, the issue of gay marriage and abortion are settled law. There is nothing wrong with either one. We are also a nation of separation of church and state. I don't want your particular spiritual views interfering with mine through the government. I don't want your income tax to be less than mine because you give to your church or donate to their "charities". I'm heterosexual, but have never had hostile feelings towards gay people.

    We had gay people in my Southern Baptist church when I was a kid. Very nice people. Why would I want to do anything to make them feel uncomfortable, unwanted, forced to live alone, or otherwise ostracized?? I would never want to be like that and never have been.

    As to abortion, I don't see any reason at all and never have of using the force of law to prevent pregnant girls and women from terminating unwanted pregnancies. Who would want to force them into childbirth against their will? I would never want to be part of a "groupie thing" that wanted to do that. Using law to force a pregnant or woman into childbirth against her will is to me, right out of Rosemary's Baby, as icky as it gets.

    It's all very simple to me.
    Great. I accept your religious views as your own expression and valid in that vein.

    It's getting hard to follow so I added a little color coordination.

    If you are a "Bible Thumper" then that means you believe or don't believe in the Book you use for guidance.
    2 Peter 1:21 tells me who wrote the Bible. Either I believe God or I don't.
    It's all very simple to me.


    Christianity is exclusive. Either you believe Jesus is the Son Of God or you don't. Muslims claim to believe in the God of Abraham but reject Jesus. So, Jesus is the key. Ask this question to yourself, "How can I be a child of God?" immediately read (Galatians 3:26)

    The laws of the country are not reflective of closeness to God. But The Bible speaks on laws (Romans 13:1-6)

    I don't believe anyone wants to hurt gay people in the church, but I could be wrong.


    Children are a gift from God. God even knows you while you are in the womb (Jeremiah 1:5)

    The enemy (Satan) have always know this and has been quite successful in abortion.
    The demon named Kasadya is responsible for teaching mankind how to perform abortions.
    Demons are never on God's side...
    (Enoch 69:13)

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