Thread: Chicago police arrest 81 in overnight raids, mostly for drug and weapons offenses

Originally Posted by MW

Maybe I'm wrong. I just assumed the DEA was involved since it was a hunt for guns and drugs. If the police didn't have them involved this time, they should have.

After Trump threatened in a Tweet last month to “send in the Feds!” 20 additional agents with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives were reassigned to Chicago.

Originally Posted by Judy

Well, yes, that is what I'm saying. You can't free them from the ghetto if you keep them pinned to it. They need to move on and up. Can they figure out a fit for themselves in the revitalized areas, I'm sure some can and will, perhaps a lot will, but many need to just pack up, go to another place and re-start their lives.

There's a whole big beautiful country out there for them, and if they've lived their whole lives stuck in a Chicago ghetto, it's time to leave the ghetto and begin anew on fresh ground with new faces, make new friends, get a good job, and find a nice place to live they can afford and join the human race. It's the same for all the inner city ghettos. They need to move on, away, out and up.

Most Americans have moved somewhere at least once or twice, to go to school, to go to work, to join the service, to take a better job, to be transferred by their employer to another job in another location. This is the real world, it's time they joined it.

No. If these people had some sort of escape route to a job outside of these neighborhoods, they would have taken them already. It takes money, a lot of money to relocate to employment somewhere else -- unless you are an immigrant (illegal or otherwise) with connections to employment somewhere and a network of support to insure your welfare on the way and when you get there, including public assistance.

Forcing people out of these neighborhoods is no solution. Solutions have to be found within the communities. One of the tougher solutions is for people to quit reproducing in poverty. We need to pressure these communities to quit having kids while on public assistance. Living on public assistance is not the place to start or expand a family. And anticipating public assistance in supporting a family is no way to lay the foundations of starting a family. It could be that this alone would cause such communities to vanish, but more likely the increased attention on families as deliberate acts rather than unavoidable accidents would do a lot to improve the character of people growing up in these communities. Smaller less impacted communities might show better chances of employment or enterprise within the communities.

Remember again that many immigrants (fake refugees especially) come here for the specific purpose of reproducing subsidized by public assistance.

Originally Posted by Judy

That's not limited to gang members, JD2. That applies to the general population.

Since 2001, American law enforcement has arrested around 1.5 million Americans a year, just on non-violent drug charges, 80% or more for possession only, 40% of those for pot possession. Those are all felonies. Lives ruined by the War on Drugs. Can't work, can't get a job. Doesn't sound very "conservative" to me. 1.5 million Americans x 16 years = 24 million unemployable Americans. Congratulations!!

Time to end the spectacularly vile, costly and stupid ... War on Drugs.

If you'd concentrated those resources arresting illegal aliens, we wouldn't have one left to worry about.

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/Crim....AMZe4uG8.dpbs

Your information leaves some pertinent facts out. Most of those arrested by federal law enforcement are for trafficking, manufacturing, and distribution, which is a felony. Those charges normally result in prison time.

Most of those arrested for simple position without intent to distribute are by local law enforcement. Those arrest are only misdemeanors, not felonies, and normally only result in probation, short jail sentence, or a fine.

So no, not all drug arrests are felonies.

I'm not directing this at anyone. Just happened upon it while searching for something else and thought I'd share it because I thought it was interesting reading.



October 31, 2015
Why Liberals Identify with Criminals
ByTom Trinko

Liberals hate cops, honest citizens with guns, and hard sentencing laws because liberals identify with criminals.

When visiting a Federal prison Obama summarized the view of liberals when he said:

“These are young people who made mistakes that aren’t that different than the mistakes I made and the mistakes that a lot of you guys made.

"While the people in the prison he was talking about were really drug dealers and violent felons, Obama, was repeating the liberal lie that the prisons are full of folks who just smoked a joint and got caught.

Liberals are five times more likely to use marijuana and cocaine than conservatives. A natural consequence of drug use is fear of the police. While the U.S. has an overly soft policy towards drug users, users are nonetheless afraid of the consequence of getting caught breaking the law. This fosters in liberals an anti-cop mentality, since the police are the agents of society that enforce society’s laws against drug use.

If a liberal dislikes the police because he thinks they are unfairly targeting his “harmless” drug use it’s not a big step for him to assume that cops are racist and violent towards other “innocent” people. After all if a liberal believes that cops are “racist pigs” then it becomes clear that arresting “innocent” drug users is an act of fascist repression and that drug users are actually victims of the“police state” not criminals.

This antipathy towards the law because of drugs is not new. During Prohibition Americans who liked to drink lost respect for the police. Anyone who likes to do things that are illegal is going to develop a distaste for the men and women in blue who enforce the law. It’s a natural consequence of the fact that human nature is such that we usually try and rationalize our behavior by scapegoating someone else.

The problem is exacerbated because for many liberals, such as Obama, drug use began when they were highly impressionable teens; biases developed at a young age are often much harder to escape than those developed later in life.

Further because illegal drug users are criminals, that is they are intentionally breaking the law, they tend to identify with other criminals rather than with the criminal justice system or victims.

Drug users rationalizes their criminal acts by saying it’s the law that’s bad, that the “system” is unjust, that they’re being unfairly persecuted; exactly the same sort of rationalizations that every criminal uses. It’s not surprising then that liberals will identify with the criminal rather than the victim or the police.

Like other criminals, liberal law breakers often believe that what they do doesn’t hurt others. Robbers will rationalize that they’re stealing from people who are rich only because the system is corrupt and that they, the robbers, are just getting what should be theirs, and anyway the “rich” they’re stealing from won’t miss what was stolen. Rapists will claim that the woman “asked for it”and that “no means yes.” Similarly liberals argue that their drug use doesn’t hurt anyone. Apparently liberals either don’t care or are unaware of the victims of their drug use.

Drug use however does have many victims; the gang wars in our cities, the massive deaths of blacks in our cities, the chaos and death in Mexico are all fueled by the dollars of American drug users. Mexico is turning into a cesspool of violence and corruption because Americans want their drugs and they don’t care who suffers.

The river of drug money also leads to the corruption of the police that in turn causes the very sort of police misconduct that liberals excoriate.

However, liberals tend to be people who eschew personal responsibility so they fail to see the connection between their giving money to criminal organizations and the violent acts of those cartels.

If liberals were to admit to themselves that the average cop is a decent person who tries to treat people fairly, they’d have to confront the fact that it’s a liberal’s choice to break the law that makes liberals fear the police. Sadly, liberal DNA just doesn’t include accepting responsibility for one’s actions so they continue to blame others for the consequences of their drug use, including their fear of police.

https://www.scribd.com/document/288704551/Why-Liberals-Identify-With-Criminals

No, MW. You obviously didn't read the charts I provided. Those numbers are from the FBI statistics that count all state and local arrests made by local law enforcement. Of the 1.5 million people arrested for drug offenses by everyone law enforcement agency in the US who reports to the FBI, the range of possession arrests compared to "trafficking, manufacturing and distribution" is over 80% possession for the past 16 years compared to less than 20% "trafficking, manufacturing and distribution. In 2016, the ratio was 84% possession arrests and 16% "trafficking, sale and manufacturing." 39% of the possession arrests were for marijuana.

Some of the possession charges may be misdemeanors. I thought they were all felonies because the penalty is jail time starting with 1 year with the first offense, at least under federal law. Maybe you can still go to jail on a misdemeanor. If so, I didn't know that. Why would you send someone to jail for a "misdemenaor"? Strange. Keep the prisons full to soak the taxpayers very which way you can? I guess so. No wonder there's no room for illegal aliens in the local jails, they're all filled up with pot smokers.

Originally Posted by Judy

No, MW. You obviously didn't read the charts I provided. Those numbers are from the FBI statistics that count all state and local arrests made by local law enforcement. Of the 1.5 million people arrested for drug offenses by everyone law enforcement agency in the US who reports to the FBI, the range of possession arrests compared to "trafficking, manufacturing and distribution" is over 80% possession for the past 16 years compared to less than 20% "trafficking, manufacturing and distribution. In 2016, the ratio was 84% possession arrests and 16% "trafficking, sale and manufacturing." 39% of the possession arrests were for marijuana.

Some of the possession charges may be misdemeanors. I thought they were all felonies because the penalty is jail time starting with 1 year with the first offense, at least under federal law. Maybe you can still go to jail on a misdemeanor. If so, I didn't know that. Why would you send someone to jail for a "misdemenaor"? Strange. Keep the prisons full to soak the taxpayers very which way you can? I guess so. No wonder there's no room for illegal aliens in the local jails, they're all filled up with pot smokers.

Nothing you've said here changes what I said.

Your information leaves some pertinent facts out. Most of those arrested by federal law enforcement are for trafficking, manufacturing, and distribution, which is a felony. Those charges normally result in prison time.

Most of those arrested for simple position without intent to distribute are by local law enforcement. Those arrest are only misdemeanors, not felonies, and normally only result in probation, short jail sentence, or a fine.

So no, not all drug arrests are felonies.

Originally Posted by pkskyali

No. If these people had some sort of escape route to a job outside of these neighborhoods, they would have taken them already. It takes money, a lot of money to relocate to employment somewhere else -- unless you are an immigrant (illegal or otherwise) with connections to employment somewhere and a network of support to insure your welfare on the way and when you get there, including public assistance.

Forcing people out of these neighborhoods is no solution. Solutions have to be found within the communities. One of the tougher solutions is for people to quit reproducing in poverty. We need to pressure these communities to quit having kids while on public assistance. Living on public assistance is not the place to start or expand a family. And anticipating public assistance in supporting a family is no way to lay the foundations of starting a family. It could be that this alone would cause such communities to vanish, but more likely the increased attention on families as deliberate acts rather than unavoidable accidents would do a lot to improve the character of people growing up in these communities. Smaller less impacted communities might show better chances of employment or enterprise within the communities.

Remember again that many immigrants (fake refugees especially) come here for the specific purpose of reproducing subsidized by public assistance.

There's no solution unless you bust it up and gentrify. Ask every city including specifically Chicago that dumped a fortune into new housing projects that within a matter of a few short years looked worse than Aleppo. The particular mix of population or lack thereof, however you want to view it created what there is. If you don't bust it up, you just have the same thing in new buildings that becomes what it was.

Private developers usually manage the relocation of the people they're asking to leave the properties. That's nothing government needs to get involved with. Government needs to be involved with zoning, infrastructure, design and building approvals, occupancy permits and things like that.

The differences between felonies and misdemeanors are quite simple. Misdemeanors generally carry up to one year in the county jail. You cannot go to prison on a misdemeanor, only to your local jail.

Felonies are anywhere from one year plus one day served. There are a lot of different classifications listed for felonies...

http://www.barryboches.com/criminal-...eanor-charges/

Originally Posted by JohnDoe2

The differences between felonies and misdemeanors are quite simple. Misdemeanors generally carry up to one year in the county jail. You cannot go to prison on a misdemeanor, only to your local jail.

Felonies are anywhere from one year plus one day served. There are a lot of different classifications listed for felonies...

http://www.barryboches.com/criminal-...eanor-charges/

That's basically what I said, except you left off the part about a misdemeanor not necessarily meaning jail time when arrested by local law enforcement. Simple possession charges are misdemeanors. However, punishment can very greatly depending on who is doing the arresting (federal or local law enforcement).

If you were arrested by federal law enforcement, most likely you were targeted for arrest because your possession was in connection with other violations such as drug trafficking, large scale grow operation, ties to criminal enterprise, or violent activities or unlawful possession of a firearm.

From what I understand a lot of federal arrest for possession happen on our border with Mexico (U.S. Customs and Border Patrol).

Moral of the story. If you're going to get popped for possession, you're going to be a lot better off if it's by local law enforcement vice federal law enforcement.

Attorney General Jeff Sessions vows new violent crime fight


The attorney general said. "I want to see (federal) gun prosecutions go up. I do think that aggressive prosecutions of federal gun laws will decrease the number of shootings and murders.''...


In Chicago, the attorney general said, a "dramatic reduction in (police) stops and arrests has to to be a factor in violence in the city.''...