Thread: TV documentary puts Gould Construction in spotlight

TV documentary puts Gould Construction squarely in the center of attention



By Donna Gray
Glenwood Springs, CO Colorado
December 28, 2006


GLENWOOD SPRINGS, Colo. — An NBC television report on the national debate over illegal immigration aired the day after Christmas is having repercussions in the Roaring Fork Valley. The documentary team headed up by former NBC News anchor Tom Brokaw focused on Glenwood Springs contractor Mark Gould and his struggle to fill laborer jobs that he says only Latinos will take.

Gould spoke about his frustration at not being able to hire Americans to do the hand labor required to lay sewer pipe and sidewalks. He said young American men coming out of high school now don’t want to start out as ditch diggers for $14 an hour, the current starting wage at Gould Construction.

Without immigrant workers willing to take those jobs — illegal or not — his business would be in deep trouble, he said.

Gould also admitted that at the time he was interviewed for the story last spring, he could have had illegal immigrants on his payroll despite checking documents of prospective Latino workers.

Wednesday Brett Gould’s phone was ringing off the hook at the Gould Construction office south of Glenwood Springs. Brett Gould, director of human resources at Gould Construction, said by Wednesday afternoon he’d received more than 600 calls from across the country inquiring about jobs.

But there was also a downside for the Goulds.

“By the end of the show I had e-mails, applications for jobs,” said Mark Gould from Dallas airport Wednesday afternoon. He was returning from a family vacation over the Christmas holiday. “The hate mail bothered me the most. People want to put their head in the sand about this issue.”

He said most businesses don’t want to acknowledge they may be breaking the law because they need to hire illegal immigrants to fill their jobs.

The problem of illegal immigration is complex, with issues of economics, politics and social justice. The story highlighted living conditions for some Hispanic workers in the Roaring Fork Valley — 18 people to a four-bedroom home. That and the fact that some willing workers can’t work here legally, are issues that have to be addressed. Speaking out, he said, “is a first step in acknowledging (the problem). Maybe people will be able to talk about how we can solve it.”

Retired concrete contractor Ken Kriz of Glenwood Springs found the show revealing and unsettling. One of the themes of the story was the apparent failure of many Latino immigrants, whose numbers are growing exponentially here, to integrate into the valley’s Anglo community.

“It’s disturbing that Hispanics are really taking over and many don’t seem to want to assimilate,” he said. “Immigrants that came here 50 or 100 years ago, they assimilated.”

Kriz’ parents, who immigrated from Czechoslovakia, told him, “You were born in America. You’re going to learn English. There’s some (Hispanics) that do want to learn English, that do want to be part of the culture here, but a lot of them don’t.

“He (Gould) probably doesn’t really care whether they’re legal or not.”

On his way back from a vacation Tuesday night, Mark Gould managed to catch the show on TV.

He said his message “didn’t necessarily come across because it was broken into sound bites.”

NBC producer Soraya Gage said in an interview last week that she and Brokaw appreciated Gould’s willingness to speak out about a problem that many employers won’t acknowledge for fear of bringing the law down on their heads.

During the show, Brett Gould was filmed taking applications from several Latino men and checking their immigration documents. He said the company does everything it can to stay within the law when it comes to hiring.

“We try to not knowingly hire illegal workers,” he said in the show.

Also interviewed for the documentary was an Latino worker hired by Gould named Trino. He admitted he was in this country illegally and used a false Social Security number to get the job.

Wednesday Brett Gould terminated Trino and his brother Juan Carlos who had also been hired by the company.

“We had to,” he said. “I did not know he was illegal until last night (when the show aired).”

Brett Gould said he felt badly about letting them go. “They’re darn good workers. They learned fast. They learned English.”

On Aug. 7 Colorado passed a new law requiring prospective employees’ documents to be screened by Homeland Security.

“Everyone we’ve hired since then is legal,” he said. But he said he’s lost 10 percent of his workforce. He has no praise for the new law.

“The state legislature reacted to many people’s opinion. They don’t understand the real problem.”

Watching the TV show was not comfortable for Mark Gould, but he acknowledged that it’s an issue that needs to be discussed more.

“It was hard to watch last night. I didn’t feel all warm and fuzzy inside. There’s something wrong with the world and we need to fix it. We can’t fix it unless we talk about it.”


Contact Donna Gray: 945-8515, ext. 16605
dgray@postindependent.com

What people are saying
The comments below were posted on the Post Independent Web site and received via e-mail.

Anonymous comments from the Web site:
• “This contractor is attempting to justify the smuggling and employment of illegal labor. I believe that ICE should conduct a criminal investigation of this local contractor, in fact I will be filing a compliant [sic] with ICE on Tuesday.”

• “As a fourth generation Colorado native, I am embarrassed that a national TV documentary on illegal immigration would select the Glenwood, Carbondale, and Aspen/Snowmass and Colorado in general to highlight the greed of some building contractors like Gould.”

Via e-mail:
• “It is a farce to claim Americans will not do the work that illegal immigrants are doing. What Gould Construction should do is recruit workers in states where unemployment rates are high. The company will find plenty of American workers.
Gould construction should place ads in metro Detroit and Michigan newspapers for workers. The company would find a surplus of workers willing to work for the same wages the company is paying to illegal immigrants.”

• “The one thing that NBC did not bring out is that “European Males – White” cannot work on a job site where all the coworkers are speaking Spanish. It makes young white men feel very uneasy, Hispanics make threats against whites and purposely intimidate them & out numbered so they do quit.
“Construction trades are now completely taken over by illegals. All the unskilled jobs whether fast food, receptionists, retail, truck drivers or construction around the nation have been taken by foreign born individuals – male and female.” Dorothy Brasch

• “What was so blatantly horrendous was Gould knowingly breaking the law, Americans being told they won’t work for $14 an hour, illegal kids taking over schools on our financial backs, their birthing their illegal kids in our hospitals that we pay for, crime wasn’t mentioned, drunken drivers not mentioned, illegals driving without a license or insurance, only a bunch of nice guy illegals, no word about drug trade, no word about Americans not getting those jobs, nothing about diseases. It was a sickening portrayal of illegals in a soft, fuzzy light while we’ve got 67% drop out/flunk out rate in Denver schools from illegals, total classroom chaos, killings regularly by illegals, people smuggling, forgery outfits and much more.” Forrest Wooldridge; Louisville, CO

• “As a first generation US citizen who spent thousands of dollars in lawyers fees to help me stay legal, I find it amusing that Mr. Gould and others like him claim that there are no Americans willing to work for the wages he is willing to pay. This is simple supply and demand. If you cannot buy something at the price of $14, maybe if you offer to buy it for $15, $16 and so on, you will eventually find willing workers. For businesses this is simply the game where they look at the cost of compliance with the law (i.e. hire legal workers) versus the cost of non-compliance.” Satish Rajan; Roseville, CA

The comments below were posted on the Post Independent Web site and received via e-mail.

Anonymous comments from the Web site:
• “This contractor is attempting to justify the smuggling and employment of illegal labor. I believe that ICE should conduct a criminal investigation of this local contractor, in fact I will be filing a compliant [sic] with ICE on Tuesday.”

• “As a fourth generation Colorado native, I am embarrassed that a national TV documentary on illegal immigration would select the Glenwood, Carbondale, and Aspen/Snowmass and Colorado in general to highlight the greed of some building contractors like Gould.”

Via e-mail:
• “It is a farce to claim Americans will not do the work that illegal immigrants are doing. What Gould Construction should do is recruit workers in states where unemployment rates are high. The company will find plenty of American workers.
Gould construction should place ads in metro Detroit and Michigan newspapers for workers. The company would find a surplus of workers willing to work for the same wages the company is paying to illegal immigrants.”

• “The one thing that NBC did not bring out is that “European Males – White” cannot work on a job site where all the coworkers are speaking Spanish. It makes young white men feel very uneasy, Hispanics make threats against whites and purposely intimidate them & out numbered so they do quit.
“Construction trades are now completely taken over by illegals. All the unskilled jobs whether fast food, receptionists, retail, truck drivers or construction around the nation have been taken by foreign born individuals – male and female.” Dorothy Brasch

• “What was so blatantly horrendous was Gould knowingly breaking the law, Americans being told they won’t work for $14 an hour, illegal kids taking over schools on our financial backs, their birthing their illegal kids in our hospitals that we pay for, crime wasn’t mentioned, drunken drivers not mentioned, illegals driving without a license or insurance, only a bunch of nice guy illegals, no word about drug trade, no word about Americans not getting those jobs, nothing about diseases. It was a sickening portrayal of illegals in a soft, fuzzy light while we’ve got 67% drop out/flunk out rate in Denver schools from illegals, total classroom chaos, killings regularly by illegals, people smuggling, forgery outfits and much more.” Forrest Wooldridge; Louisville, CO

• “As a first generation US citizen who spent thousands of dollars dollars in lawyers fees to help me stay legal, I find it amusing that Mr. Gould and others like him claim that there are no Americans willing to work for the wages he is willing to pay. This is simple supply and demand. If you cannot buy something at the price of $14, maybe if you offer to buy it for $15, $16 and so on, you will eventually find willing workers. For businesses this is simply the game where they look at the cost of compliance with the law (i.e. hire legal workers) versus the cost of non-compliance.” Satish Rajan; Roseville, CA



http://www.postindependent.com/article/ ... 7367112620


Post Independent, Glenwood Springs Colorado CO

What he didnt say was he probably would rather hire illegals so he doesn't have to privide any health care or any other benefits he might have to supply if he hired american workers!

Yeah, like how about hiring a national recruiter to search for unemployed skilled Americans to fill your openings Mr. Gould.

im glad to hear that he got 600 calls for jobs from all over america.
but how many people will actually move there, thats the next question

IF Gould really wanted to do everything he could to hire only legal workers, he would have been using the Basic Pilot program to check SS numbers. Interesting that Brokaw never even asked him if he did.

And, do we really believe that during the entire shoot for this program, Gould and Brokaw never spoke about his workers being illegal? He just found out throguh watching the program?

The lies, the lies, I can't stand it!!!!!!!!

Katewrote:

And, do we really believe that during the entire shoot for this program, Gould and Brokaw never spoke about his workers being illegal? He just found out throguh watching the program?

Right! Once again insulting our intelligence!

Originally Posted by Kate

IF Gould really wanted to do everything he could to hire only legal workers, he would have been using the Basic Pilot program to check SS numbers. Interesting that Brokaw never even asked him if he did.

And, do we really believe that during the entire shoot for this program, Gould and Brokaw never spoke about his workers being illegal? He just found out throguh watching the program?

The lies, the lies, I can't stand it!!!!!!!!

It's all about playing dumb. The Social Security "Pilot" program is too hard to learn. I am bad at computers. The dog ate my keyboard. Circuit City was closed that day so I couldn't get my computer repaired. My brother is the "computer wiz" in the family and he is still in the Bahamas on vacation. I didn't know it existed. I swear, your Honor, as God is my witness, I did not know that man was an illegal alien!

Originally Posted by CCUSA

Yeah, like how about hiring a national recruiter to search for unemployed skilled Americans to fill your openings Mr. Gould.

In Michigan we have a federally funded program called the 'MichiganWorks" program that does just that!

We taxpayers have spent millions putting these programs in place!

Here is an article in the Aspen Times written in September featuring Mark Gould that lends some more insight.



Contractors weigh in on new immigration bill
By Donna Gray


Glenwood Springs correspondent
September 5, 2006


Colorado's new immigration laws are starting to cause a stir among businessmen in the valley. For contractor Mark Gould, one bill in particular could mean the loss of about a quarter of his workforce.

Since House Bill 1343 took effect Aug. 7, Gould is now required to certify that he has no illegal workers on his payroll. The law applies to contractors working on projects for cities, counties, school districts and other governmental agencies.

According to the law, new workers must be checked through a Pilot Program, which is under the jurisdiction of the Department of Homeland Security. The program links employers to an online database that checks names against Social Security numbers to determine if the number is valid.

"We've been told (the database) is only 80 percent correct," Gould said.

Gould Construction employs about 100 people, many of them unskilled laborers, many of them Hispanic immigrants. About half his contracts are with local governments.

Although Gould said his company checks people's documents as a condition of employment to make sure they are legal immigrants, it's a matter of simple math to realize that many of them are probably living in this country illegally.

According to Denver's Bell Policy Center, in 2004 there were 435,000 foreign born immigrants in the state. Gould estimates there are about 250,000 who are here illegally.

"As you walk down the street one of every two immigrants is illegal," he said. "This is not rocket science."

He has already seen the fallout from the bill.

Currently the company has 10 openings, and only three people have applied. Hispanics are not applying, Gould said.

"If you listen to (congressman and anti-illegal immigration advocate) Tom Tancredo, he wants to send 250,000 people back home. Congressman Tancredo says employers are employing illegals when there are legal workers standing in line," Gould said.

If Tancredo, R-Colo., has his way - and HB 1343 could go a long way to making that happen - businesses like Gould's, hotels in Aspen and Vail, landscapers around the valley and others would be hard put to find employees.

Gould pays $14 an hour as starting pay. At that rate, a worker who puts in the usual 50-hour week and who makes time-and-a-half in overtime will get $770 a week. That's good pay for unskilled labor, but still Gould would be hamstrung without Hispanics applying for those positions.

American kids are finishing high school and going on to skilled jobs.

"Kids are trained on computers, they don't want to dig a ditch," Gould said.

"What's going to happen to our economy if those workers go home? It would mean the loss of about a quarter of the excavators, laborers, masons, concrete workers, landscapers, roofers, drywallers and insulators in the valley," he said.

"So far business has been silent, they're assuming no politician would hurt the economy to make their constituency happy, but that's just what they've done."

Gould, representing the Colorado Contractor's Association, was part of a round-table discussion with Secretary of Commerce Carlos Gutierrez at the Broadmoor Hotel in Colorado Springs Monday, Aug. 28. The secretary was there to gather comments about President Bush's proposal for comprehensive immigration reform, including a guest worker program.

Businesses are also keeping their heads down and not speaking out about the new immigration laws because they're fearful they'll attract the attention of ICE (Immigration and Customs Enforcement), Gould said.

Another Glenwood Springs contractor and former state representative, Gregg Rippy, agrees HB 1343 is flawed, although it will have less effect on his business. Rippy's government contracts account for about 35 percent of his business.

What the law is likely to do is drive contractors away from government projects and exclusively into the private sector, he said.

"You look at the level of work in the valley and why would you bid a city job when there is plenty of private work," he said.

That will also mean higher bids from contractors bidding on government contracts and higher construction costs. Contractors who do bid on government jobs will build in the cost of going through the process mandated by HB 1343.

Colorado should have waited for federal legislation to be put in place before passing its own immigration reform law, Gould said.

Any immigration reform should include a provision for a guest worker program that would allow employers to go to Mexico, for example, to choose workers and check their medical background and whether or not they have a criminal record. Most importantly, Gould said, foreign workers need to have biometric identification that contains individual and unforgeable markers such as fingerprints or eye scans.

Gould is now in the process of applying for 15 H2B temporary work visas for his employees. But this avenue of filling the need for unskilled workers is hampered by the U.S. State Department, which grants only 33,000 such visas annually for the entire country.

"We have 7 million workers in the construction industry in the U.S., and we project we'll need 180,000 new workers annually for the next 10 years - that's 1.8 million," Gould said. "That's just our industry, not hospitality or tourism. This economy would be toast if we lost (immigrant) workers."


http://www.aspentimes.com/article/20060 ... /FRONTPAGE

"“The one thing that NBC did not bring out is that “European Males – White” cannot work on a job site where all the coworkers are speaking Spanish. It makes young white men feel very uneasy, Hispanics make threats against whites and purposely intimidate them & out numbered so they do quit. "

I was sent out to a construction job site several weeks ago where I was the only White American working with an all illegal Mexican crew.

I was quite angry but kept my feelings to myself. The superintendent on the job signed my job ticket for only 4 hours that day, making the trip to the job site pretty much a waste.

As the Mexican illegals show up on the job sites, the American job holders have their work day shortened: from 10 hours to 8 hours, from 8 to 6 and 6 to 4 and so on until there is no "day" left and you are left to "beg" for any hours at all! If you get angry at all, you can get fired for insubordination which means you will get disqualified for unemployment benefits! It is a constant cat and mouse game trying to keep having "a good attitude" and timing it so that when your hours get really short, you can hurry up and apply for unemployment benefits if you time it just right!

And the most criminal thing of all is that if a company hires illegal Mexican aliens and they cause an altercation that causes an American to get fired, that American cannot use as an excuse that the hiring of illegals caused his firing and he may not qualify for unemployment benefits at this point!