Thread: ACLU response to my email re: Hazelton

Originally Posted by ohflyingone

you nailed it on the head! The ACLU is hell bent on destroying this Country! They prove it every day! The fact that their "volunteers" were watching the minutemen while smoking "um questionable vegetable matter" speaks volumes! They are a total disgrace to the legal profession.

They should be brought up before the Bar Association for treason (if they have the guts).

I have the utmost respect for the Mayor of Hazelton for having the guts to stand up to them! It is about time! Also thank GOD for the law firm that is representing Hazelton! If ever there was an organization (besides ALIPAC) that needs our donations it is them! They are non profit!

The Bar is every bit as complicit in the attempt to destroy this nation. It is a British institution crafted to serve the banks and moneychangers in their theft of all real property, and exists for little else.

"The American Civil Liberties Union is the nation's premier guardian of liberty, working daily in courts, legislatures and communities to defend and preserve the individual rights and freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution and the laws of the United States."

This is what is on the bottom of a handout written by the ACLU and given to international university students. It is intended only for students that are here on a visa and informs them of their rights. There is nothing in there for illegals. In fact the last part of the ACLU states: "the laws of the United States" which to me includes immigration laws as well.
I took 2 university courses involving constitutional cases that went to the supreme court and some of them were by illegals. I will look them up as well as any updates and I will ask my former professor in the course as he is an immigration lawyer. Once I get that information I will post it.

One word comes to mind after reading that response from ACLU - condescending

You know, there's another aspect, a very based aspect that - IHMO - isn't emphasized enough. That is the States vs Federal rights angle.

Here in OR, we have had laws enacted at the state (and local) levels which directly challenge the supremacy/jurisdiction/<whatever term you prefer>... of Federal law (mind you, I'm not saying I necessarily agree with any of these, but I just want to list 'em so maybe it'll help jog the memory - some of these are rather highly visible and have been a subject of very intense debate). Examples include:

More recently -
Death With Dignity act
Medical Marijuana Use

Earlier -
LUBA (Land Use Board of Appeals) / Local Land Use Planning Reqs. (eg. much stricter laws regarding environmental concerns at State AND Local levels...)
Bottle Bill (we were the first state in the nation to implement the deposit/refund on used bottles, cans, etc)
(etc)

Not only do these laws just CHALLENGE the jurisdiction of Fed. Law, in neary every case, they are MORE RESTRICTIVE (place many burdens on people) in the legal areas they pertain to.

So, the point is, states CAN and DO pass laws that challenge the jurisdiction or supremacy of Federal law in many different [legal] areas rather often.

Why shouldn't communities be allowed to do the same regarding the handling of persons residing illegally amongst themselves? (especially considering the Fed Gov't has effectively absconded in enforcing immigration law). Yes, the Federal Gov't was specifically singled out as the responsible 'manager' of immigration in the Constitution. But, states DO have the right to control and manage a variety of CRIMINAL activity as well. Illegal aliens are NOT 'immigrants' - they ARE people that generally have side-stepped most or all legal mechanisms designed to allow people to migrate within legal constructs.

Further... much of the law governing the treatment and handling of persons from other countries 'illegal entrants' (and this applies to most countries of the world, not just the US) is most directly controlled and governed by International Treaties (yes, bad as many are...). But, the point is, there is some other body of 'laws' which are involved - it is not JUST a simple Federal Immigration Law vs. nothing else (although the ACLU would certainly wish us to believe such thing).

I personally do not believe that illegal aliens should possess Federal legal rights on par with US citizens. They should only possess the bare minimum due to them to by treaty obligations and nothing more.

I'll be rooting for Kris Kobach and company in this one...(eg. for Hazleton's legal team)

OK, I'm done - that's my 0.02 cents.

It seems that you really do not understand what civil liberties are. You might like to read the Bill of Rights. It is short. The ACLU defends the Constitution and our civil rights.

The Consitution is quite clear, when it means "citizens" it says just that, when it means "people" it says just that. People are granted most of the civil liberties.

It's the ACLU who is ignorant. Apparently THEY need to read the Constitution. The first line (IT'S SHORT) reads "We The "People" OF THE UNTED STATES OF AMERICA. Of the United States Of America, makes it clear that they are talking about AMERICAN citizens, not Mexican, Chinese, British or any other "people".

Hopefully, enough towns like Hazleton will come up with enough anti-illegal ordinances, to bankrupt the ACLU.

Someone should ask the ACLU exactly who made them the 4th branch of government. If I was a Senator, I would investigate this group of traitors under RICO.

Puerto Rico isn't a state. Besides it's an island! We're no island here!

Boy Dianne, you were much nicer than me! I got downright nasty of course I did not swear, but still!

I told them they were anti-American and looked forward to the demise of their organization, and would do whatever it took to see them out of business. Also told them they were nothing but a bunch of greedy lawyers with no brains!

Kind of a PMS and lack of sleep moment, but I think it was deserved on their part!

Originally Posted by Dianne

From: info@ACLUPA.ORG

Thank you for contacting the ACLU.

It seems that you really do not understand what civil liberties are. You might like to read the Bill of Rights. It is short. The ACLU defends the Constitution and our civil rights. It has done so for many decades. If you are interested in learning what we do do, you might want to check out the docket, posted on the website of each of the individual entities that make up the ACLU. We handle 1000s of cases a year on many issues. But they are all civil liberties issues.

The Consitution is quite clear, when it means "citizens" it says just that, when it means "people" it says just that. People are granted most of the civil liberties.

English only? Puerto Rico has been part of the United States for almost 100 years, part of the deal was that the citizens of that island got to keep their language if they liked. So, there are 4th generation American citizens who speak their own language. They do not have to prove their citizenship every time any ones to question it.

If you are concerned about the plight of the working poor and laborers, you should support the local unions. That is what they are for.

Take Care


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sent: Sat 9/2/2006 9:43 AM
To: Info
Subject: Hazelton, PA.


I write in support of the Mayor of Hazelton. He is making an attempt to protect the civil liberties of his constituents who happen to be Americans and legal immigrants. It is my wish that the ACLU would do the same. After all, isn't the A in ACLU the word American?

I will no longer support your organization until you begin to protect the blue collar and poor American/legal immigrant workers who are losing their jobs as a result of greedy corporations circumventing minimum wage requirements and payroll taxes, by hiring illegals.

By the way, please remove the A from ACLU as this is misleading to those who donate to your organization. The public is being misled into thinking your organization is here to represent the rights of Americans, which we now know is untrue.

I SHOULD THINK THE MAYOR OF HAZELTON IS WELL WITHIN IT'S RIGHTS.

Federal Immigration and Nationality Act
Section 8 USC 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv)(b)(iii)
"Any person who . . . encourages or induces an alien to . . . reside . . . knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such . . . residence is . . . in violation of law, shall be punished as provided . . . for each alien in respect to whom such a violation occurs . . . fined under title 18 . . . imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both."
Section 274 felonies under the federal Immigration and Nationality Act, INA 274A(a)(1)(A):
A person (including a group of persons, business, organization, or local government) commits a federal felony when she or he:
* assists an alien s/he should reasonably know is illegally in the U.S. or who lacks employment authorization, by transporting, sheltering, or assisting him or her to obtain employment, or
* encourages that alien to remain in the U.S. by referring him or her to an employer or by acting as employer or agent for an employer in any way, or
* knowingly assists illegal aliens due to personal convictions.
Penalties upon conviction include criminal fines, imprisonment, and forfeiture of vehicles and real property used to commit the crime. Anyone employing or contracting with an illegal alien without verifying his or her work authorization status is guilty of a misdemeanor. Aliens and employers violating immigration laws are subject to arrest, detention, and seizure of their vehicles or property. In addition, individuals or entities who engage in racketeering enterprises that commit (or conspire to commit) immigration-related felonies are subject to private civil suits for treble damages and injunctive relief.
Recruitment and Employment of Illegal Aliens
It is unlawful to hire an alien, to recruit an alien, or to refer an alien for a fee, knowing the alien is unauthorized to work in the United States. It is equally unlawful to continue to employ an alien knowing that the alien is unauthorized to work. Employers may give preference in recruitment and hiring to a U.S. citizen over an alien with work authorization only where the U.S. citizen is equally or better qualified. It is unlawful to hire an individual for employment in the United States without complying with employment eligibility verification requirements. Requirements include examination of identity documents and completion of Form I-9 for every employee hired. Employers must retain all I-9s, and, with three days' advance notice, the forms must be made available for inspection. Employment includes any service or labor performed for any type of remuneration within the United States, with the exception of sporadic domestic service by an individual in a private home. Day laborers or other casual workers engaged in any compensated activity (with the above exception) are employees for purposes of immigration law. An employer includes an agent or anyone acting directly or indirectly in the interest of the employer. For purposes of verfication of authorization to work, employer also means an independent contractor, or a contractor other than the person using the alien labor. The use of temporary or short-term contracts cannot be used to circumvent the employment authorization verification requirements. If employment is to be for less than the usual three days allowed for completing the I-9 Form requirement, the form must be completed immediately at the time of hire.
An employer has constructive knowledge that an employee is an illegal unauthorized worker if a reasonable person would infer it from the facts. Constructive knowledge constituting a violation of federal law has been found where (1) the I-9 employment eligibility form has not been properly completed, including supporting documentation, (2) the employer has learned from other individuals, media reports, or any source of information available to the employer that the alien is unauthorized to work, or (3) the employer acts with reckless disregard for the legal consequences of permitting a third party to provide or introduce an illegal alien into the employer's work force. Knowledge cannot be inferred solely on the basis of an individual's accent or foreign appearance.
Actual specific knowledge is not required. For example, a newspaper article stating that ballrooms depend on an illegal alien work force of dance hostesses was held by the courts to be a reasonable ground for suspicion that unlawful conduct had occurred.
IT IS ILLEGAL FOR NONPROFIT OR RELIGIOUS ORGANIZATIONS to knowingly assist an employer to violate employment sanctions, REGARDLESS OF CLAIMS THAT THEIR CONVICTIONS REQUIRE THEM TO ASSIST ALIENS. Harboring or aiding illegal aliens is not protected by the First Amendment. It is a felony to establish a commercial enterprise for the purpose of evading any provision of federal immigration law. Violators may be fined or imprisoned for up to five years.
Encouraging and Harboring Illegal Aliens
It is a violation of law for any person to conceal, harbor, or shield from detection in any place, including any building or means of transportation, any alien who is in the United States in violation of law. HARBORING MEANS ANY CONDUCT THAT TENDS TO SUBSTANTIALLY FACILITATE AN ALIEN TO REMAIN IN THE U.S. ILLEGALLY. The sheltering need not be clandestine, and harboring covers aliens arrested outdoors, as well as in a building. This provision includes harboring an alien who entered the U.S. legally but has since lost his legal status.
An employer can be convicted of the felony of harboring illegal aliens who are his employees if he takes actions in reckless disregard of their illegal status, such as ordering them to obtain false documents, altering records, obstructing INS inspections, or taking other actions that facilitate the alien's illegal employment. Any person who within any 12-month period hires ten or more individuals with actual knowledge that they are illegal aliens or unauthorized workers is guilty of felony harboring. It is also a felony to encourage or induce an alien to come to or reside in the U.S. knowing or recklessly disregarding the fact that the alien's entry or residence is in violation of the law. This crime applies to any person, rather than just employers of illegal aliens. Courts have ruled that "encouraging" includes counseling illegal aliens to continue working in the U.S. or assisting them to complete applications with false statements or obvious errors. The fact that the alien is a refugee fleeing persecution is not a defense to this felony, since U.S. law and the UN Protocol on Refugees both require that a refugee must report to immigration authorities without delay upon entry to the U.S.
The penalty for felony harboring is a fine and imprisonment for up to five years. The penalty for felony alien smuggling is a fine and up to ten years' imprisonment. Where the crime causes serious bodily injury or places the life of any person in jeopardy, the penalty is a fine and up to twenty years' imprisonment. If the criminal smuggling or harboring results in the death of any person, the penalty can include life imprisonment. Convictions for aiding, abetting, or conspiracy to commit alien smuggling or harboring, carry the same penalties. Courts can impose consecutive prison sentences for each alien smuggled or harbored. A court may order a convicted smuggler to pay restitution if the alien smuggled qualifies as a victim under the Victim and Witness Protection Act. Conspiracy to commit crimes of sheltering, harboring, or employing illegal aliens is a separate federal offense punishable by a fine of up to $10,000 or five years' imprisonment.
Enforcement
A person or entity having knowledge of a violation or potential violation of employer sanctions provisions may submit a signed written complaint to the INS office with jurisdiction over the business or residence of the potential violator, whether an employer, employee, or agent. The complaint must include the names and addresses of both the complainant and the violator, and detailed factual allegations, including date, time, and place of the potential violation, and the specific conduct alleged to be a violation of employer sanctions. By regulation, the INS will only investigate third-party complaints that have a reasonable probability of validity. Designated INS officers and employees, and all other officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws, may make an arrest for violation of smuggling or harboring illegal aliens.
State and local law enforcement officials have the general power to investigate and arrest violators of federal immigration statutes without prior INS knowledge or approval, as long as they are authorized to do so by state law. There is no extant federal limitation on this authority. The 1996 immigration control legislation passed by Congress was intended to encourage states and local agencies to participate in the process of enforcing federal immigration laws. Immigration officers and local law enforcement officers may detain an individual for a brief warrantless interrogation where circumstances create a reasonable suspicion that the individual is illegally present in the U.S. Specific facts constituting a reasonable suspicion include evasive, nervous, or erratic behavior; dress or speech indicating foreign citizenship; and presence in an area known to contain a concentration of illegal aliens. Hispanic appearance alone is not sufficient. Immigration officers and police must have a valid warrant or valid employer's consent to enter workplaces or residences. Any vehicle used to transport or harbor illegal aliens, or used as a substantial part of an activity that encourages illegal aliens to come to or reside in the U.S. may be seized by an immigration officer and is subject to forfeiture. The forfeiture power covers any conveyances used within the U.S.
RICO -- Citizen Recourse
Private persons and entities may initiate civil suits to obtain injunctions and treble damages against enterprises that conspire to or actually violate federal alien smuggling, harboring, or document fraud statutes, under the Racketeer-Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO). The pattern of racketeering activity is defined as commission of two or more of the listed crimes. A RICO enterprise can be any individual legal entity, or a group of individuals who are not a legal entity but are associated in fact, AND CAN INCLUDE NONPROFIT ASSOCIATIONS.
Tax Crimes
Employers who aid or abet the preparation of false tax returns by failing to pay income or Social Security taxes for illegal alien employees, or who knowingly make payments using false names or Social Security numbers, are subject to IRS criminal and civil sanctions. U.S. nationals who have suffered intentional discrimination because of citizenship or national origin by an employer with more than three employees may file a complaint within 180 days of the discriminatory act with the Special Counsel for Immigration-Related Unfair Employment Practices, U.S. Department of Justice. In additon to the federal statutes summarized, state laws and local ordinances controlling fair labor practices, workers compensation, zoning, safe housing and rental property, nuisance, licensing, street vending, and solicitations by contractors may also apply to activities that involve illegal aliens.

Originally Posted by Preachingtothechoir

Wow, their arrogance, rudeness and ignorance knows no bounds.

I was just about to say the very same thing. The letter is very rude and condensending