Thread: No wonder Congress has been ignoring the American people!

Originally Posted by CountFloyd

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Yes, I deny that. There are Christian groups that are considered lobbyists. The NRA, which protects my rights to keep and bear arms is a lobby group. There are numerous lobby groups that serve the public good. Heck, as a political action committee, some would consider ALIPAC to be a lobbyist group.

Not without lots of money they don't.

ALIPAC doesn't have a lot of money to throw around. How effective have we been at persuading our civil servants to see things our way?

COUNT
lobbying in itself isn't a negative as long as it's accomplished within a certain set of guidelines.

However, lobbying while throwing money into the ring is a horse of a different color. TAKING lobby contributions is where the act of lobbying becomes twisted.

Lobbying on private jets and private compounds, well, that puts it into a different category altogether.

It's the MONEY, not the lobbying.

Originally Posted by CountFloyd

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Yes, I deny that. There are Christian groups that are considered lobbyists. The NRA, which protects my rights to keep and bear arms is a lobby group. There are numerous lobby groups that serve the public good. Heck, as a political action committee, some would consider ALIPAC to be a lobbyist group.

Not without lots of money they don't.

ALIPAC doesn't have a lot of money to throw around. How effective have we been at persuading our civil servants to see things our way?

Without the NRA, we would have been disarmed and subjugated under Demonrat leadership ages ago. I'm not saying that there aren't serious problems with the manner in which many lobby organizations operate, but you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater. As a matter of fact, there are those who believe that forces that want to subvert our system of government and its institutions manipulate the majority to do their dirty work for them by discrediting those precious institutions, such as freedom of speech and the right to petition for redress of grievances.

Let me ask you a few simple questions, and I expect reasonable answers:

Who do you think would regulate access to Congress if lobbying was outlawed or strictly limited?

If lobbying was regulated, do you believe that honest citizens and citizen groups would be among those gaining access?

If lobbying was completely banned, do you believe that it would be inpossible for those who abuse the lobbying process would be excluded from influencing legislators?

I will remind you of the old axiom that if guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. The same is true of denial of access to legislators.

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Originally Posted by CountFloyd

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Yes, I deny that. There are Christian groups that are considered lobbyists. The NRA, which protects my rights to keep and bear arms is a lobby group. There are numerous lobby groups that serve the public good. Heck, as a political action committee, some would consider ALIPAC to be a lobbyist group.

Not without lots of money they don't.

ALIPAC doesn't have a lot of money to throw around. How effective have we been at persuading our civil servants to see things our way?

Without the NRA, we would have been disarmed and subjugated under Demonrat leadership ages ago. I'm not saying that there aren't serious problems with the manner in which many lobby organizations operate, but you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater. As a matter of fact, there are those who believe that forces that want to subvert our system of government and its institutions manipulate the majority to do their dirty work for them by discrediting those precious institutions, such as freedom of speech and the right to petition for redress of grievances.

Let me ask you a few simple questions, and I expect reasonable answers:

Who do you think would regulate access to Congress if lobbying was outlawed or strictly limited?

If lobbying was regulated, do you believe that honest citizens and citizen groups would be among those gaining access?

If lobbying was completely banned, do you believe that it would be inpossible for those who abuse the lobbying process would be excluded from influencing legislators?

I will remind you of the old axiom that if guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. The same is true of denial of access to legislators.

Good questions. BUT....... What happened to "We the People" being able to vote on such life changing proposals? We the people have to pay for "amnesty" We the people have to pay for all the illegals in the country! So why dont we the people get a direct say in what happens!? Most lobbyist don't speak for "We the People" We should have the final vote! Not the the lobbyist who are paying off government leaders. Until "We the People" have our voices heard the rest is just politics.

Miami-Dade County, FL - 6

Am I getting this right? Miami-Dade County's government is spending tax dollars on lobbyists?

2ndamendsis wrote:

It's the MONEY, not the lobbying.

You're damned right! How do they all come out of Congress gazillionaires???

Nobody ever seems to ask that question!

Originally Posted by Leah

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Originally Posted by CountFloyd

Originally Posted by CrocketsGhost

Yes, I deny that. There are Christian groups that are considered lobbyists. The NRA, which protects my rights to keep and bear arms is a lobby group. There are numerous lobby groups that serve the public good. Heck, as a political action committee, some would consider ALIPAC to be a lobbyist group.

Not without lots of money they don't.

ALIPAC doesn't have a lot of money to throw around. How effective have we been at persuading our civil servants to see things our way?

Without the NRA, we would have been disarmed and subjugated under Demonrat leadership ages ago. I'm not saying that there aren't serious problems with the manner in which many lobby organizations operate, but you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater. As a matter of fact, there are those who believe that forces that want to subvert our system of government and its institutions manipulate the majority to do their dirty work for them by discrediting those precious institutions, such as freedom of speech and the right to petition for redress of grievances.

Let me ask you a few simple questions, and I expect reasonable answers:

Who do you think would regulate access to Congress if lobbying was outlawed or strictly limited?

If lobbying was regulated, do you believe that honest citizens and citizen groups would be among those gaining access?

If lobbying was completely banned, do you believe that it would be inpossible for those who abuse the lobbying process would be excluded from influencing legislators?

I will remind you of the old axiom that if guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. The same is true of denial of access to legislators.

Good questions. BUT....... What happened to "We the People" being able to vote on such life changing proposals? We the people have to pay for "amnesty" We the people have to pay for all the illegals in the country! So why dont we the people get a direct say in what happens!? Most lobbyist don't speak for "We the People" We should have the final vote! Not the the lobbyist who are paying off government leaders. Until "We the People" have our voices heard the rest is just politics.

Why don't we have a direct say in what happens in government? Maybe you should have paid attention in civics class. The founders of this nation rightly rejected direct democracy as mob rule. As has often been said, direct democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.

The problem that we have right now arose from the folly of the rabble. The rabble voted to make the Senate just a different version of the House but with power more concentrated, removing the essential balance of power inherent in the old format of having states appoint senators who would act to protect states' rights and check federal power. The rabble voted that Socialist scumbag FDR in for FOUR terms because he promised them handouts. He bought their votes after the forces he served drove them into desperation by replacing our sound money with worthless debt notes, crashing the economy.

See, most of our problems have arisen not from a lack of democracy, but rather from the folly of the ignorant and greedy using democracy to undermine the origianl system that the founders painstakingly balanced to prevent tyranny. That's why I get so worked up when people here and elsewhere start talking about limiting liberties or making more laws or amendments as a "solution" for the problems with the system. The only tampering this system requires is an elimination of every amendment after XIII (the original one).

Originally Posted by olivermyboy

You're damned right! How do they all come out of Congress gazillionaires???

Nobody ever seems to ask that question!

Any guess as to where they go to work after leaving congress

With so many open borders lobbyists in the halls of Congress,there must be a shortage of puppet strings in D.C. by now.

Thanks CrocketsGhost, point taken!

Keep in mind that lobbyists such as the CHURCH are not legal!

Racist groups such as laraza, maldef and mecha are not legal.

Etc. etc.

There's the big snaffoo. Circumventing the LAW.