Thread: Matt.org's false attacks and smear campaigns.

http://www.matt.org/Discussions/tabid/8 ... fault.aspx


Matt.org

I politely stopped by your website after being notified that several false negative statements had been made about me and my organization Americans for Legal Immigration PAC or ALIPAC located at www.alipac.us

As many are aware, we are a national organization that supports legal immigration and legal immigrants although we oppose Guest Worker amnesties and expanded legal immigration levels. Our organization has supporters in all 50 states and we are blessed with a very ethnically diverse group of supporters and a lot of LEGAL immigrants that are madder than hell about the current non enforcement of our existing immigration laws.

Our platform and mission is simple. We support our existing laws which have been passed by our elected Representatives. America has an illegal immigration crisis because the Bush administration is acting in defiance of his oath of office and the requirements of the US Constitution to enforce our existing laws.

There is nothing radical or harmful about our organization ALIPAC unless one believes that the existing laws passed by Congress and the will of over 80% of the American public is radical and harmful.

Here at Matt.org, this forum supports false information to further the goals of Matt.org since blatant rule violations are allowed to stand against me and those that disagree with Matt.org

Quotes by people I do not know have been falsly attributed to me which violates the rules about impersonation here.

Also, Rule #1 at Matt.org states that no defamatory information is to be posted.

Why then have my requests to moderators to remove false and defamatory information been ignored? A claim has been made that I'm against and attack all Mexicans / Latinos. The implied claim here is that I am a racist. This is false and defamatory and has no evidence based in fact.

A link has been posted to a screen proclaiming that I am Xenophobic and Nativist. I guess I'm the Xenophobic Nativist working with LEGAL immigrants from across the globe. Makes sense right?

This event says a lot more about Matt.org than it does about me or ALIPAC. We gladly remove information that is provenly false from our website as we value our credibility. We also enforce our rules when people on our side of the issue cross the line with opposition on our site. It is too bad that Matt.org does not share our concern for integrity, honesty, and rational intelligent debate on this issue.

This reinforces what we have learned time and time again.

Those that favor open borders, benefits for illegal aliens, Guest Worker Amnesty programs, and the whole SPP program cannot maintain a rational debate on this issue without resorting to name calling and character attacks. It always boils down to your side calling our side racists, Nazis, Xenophobes, nasty hateful people. You do this all the time because you cannot stand to rationally discuss the issue so you try to cast aspersions on your opponents to distract viewers from the weakness of your positions.

In the end, these false and defamatory comments say more about yourselves and the moral and rational weakness of your positions and efforts.

The law is not on your side, the American public is not on your side, and decency and common sense are not on your side so bad mouthing your opponents becomes the rule of the day.

My experiences here combined with the reports of purges of Americans that disagree with your goals are cause for concern. It is clear that Matt.org is willing to claim one thing while doing another. That's called a lie by the way.

We are part of the resistance and I have to ask why would any American want groups like this that engage in name calling and false character attacks to have any influence on public policy? We have enough lies and liars in politics as it is and it has made our nation so weak inside that we cannot defend and preserve our quality of life and our own borders.

So we can clearly see now that despite the posted rules and the positive sounding glitz on this site that matt.org is in the business of dirty politics and smear campaigns.

For the record: 1. Building a wall is not part of our platform. 2. I did not make the statements in other posts that Dee and Matt.org have attributed to me. 3. Neither I nor ALIPAC oppose all Mexicans and Latinos. We have many Latino supporters and we value their support. 4. We support legal immigrants and welcome them. 5. Neither I nor ALIPAC stands for nativism, hysteria, xenophobia, or racist white supremecist conspiracy theories etc....

Should I decide to respond in a more official capacity to the dirty politics and the one sided deceptive practices here at Matt.org then you can count on my information being factual and accurate as my position occupies the high ground and I will not lower myself or my cause to the dispicable tactics clearly observed here at Matt.org

In closing, I am very happy that my organization is not in the business of supporting lawless behavior by millions of illegal aliens and a large group of corporations like Matt.org is. I look forward to the day when those in politics and the corporate ranks that are responsible for this crisis and the massive amount of death, destruction, and loss of resources through criminal conduct are put on trial and sent to prison for crimes against the citizens of America.

William Gheen
Americans for Legal Immigration PAC ALIPAC
www.alipac.us

Well said William...

Slam dunk. I would like to hear any kind of reply if you even get one.

Oh wait, they will probably post your email on the front page and change everything to say racist and hateful statements. Then somehow, it will be on a 30 second spot on every channel.

Actually, things are VERY QUIET over there right now.

Dee is usually there every morning for awhile, and not a peep from her. There have been two replys to Williams post so far, one from the Pro-Illegal side, and a rebuttal from Delbie.

A few people from the ANTI side (Dee's label for those who oppose illegal aliens) have asked some very pointed questions in a few threads, but otherwise, the scroll rate has stalled to a CRAWL.

"BuildingDemocracy Fan" is putting out some posts. Sounds like Burkhardt or whatever his name was....??

Those that favor open borders, benefits for illegal aliens, Guest Worker Amnesty programs, and the whole SPP program cannot maintain a rational debate on this issue without resorting to name calling and character attacks. It always boils down to your side calling our side racists, Nazis, Xenophobes, nasty hateful people. You do this all the time because you cannot stand to rationally discuss the issue so you try to cast aspersions on your opponents to distract viewers from the weakness of your positions.

William,

Dead square in the bullseye!

Amazing that Xenophobia and racism are their only "ace" in their hand.
If this were poker, those two "aces" would be confused with the 2 jokers.

I too would love to see their repl to W on this one.

Way to go W!

Delbie just weighed in over on MATT after being accused of being William's LACKEY.

Building:

lackey
2 entries found for lackey.
To select an entry, click on it.
lackeyΏ,noun]lackeyΐ,verb]

Main Entry: 1lack·ey
Pronunciation: 'la-kE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural lackeys
Etymology: Middle French laquais
1 a : FOOTMAN 2, : SERVANT b : someone who does menial tasks or runs errands for another
2 : a servile follower : TOADY

The above definition is from the Websters Dictionary...I am not a foot man/woman for William Gheen or ALIPAC, nor a servant who runs errands for William Gheen or ALIPAC. I am far from servile by any stretch of the definition, and do not fit the definition of being a TOADY.

In short, your unwarranted and baseless attack is FALSE upon it's face, and is a BLANTANT abuse of MATT.org's rules. It's attacking in nature, derogatory and amounts to a falsehood (defamation) of enormous proportions.

William Gheen is not my boss, I've not had the pleasure of meeting him, shaking his hand, and applauding his efforts over at ALIPAC. I hold no alliances with ALIPAC, there exists no memorandum of understanding, no agreement (written or verbal) wherein an alliance or agreement to work together has been created and agreed upon between any of the parties...in short, I am my own free agent, a citizen involved in the Good Fight. So again, you have made false allegations against me.

Let's see...you infer I have no pride, speculate that I am afraid, or perhaps paranoid...NONE OF THE ABOVE. I've never hesitated to wade into this debate and express my views, my beliefs on the subjects at hand, here and on many other sites. In fact, some of my views on the issue of Illegal Aliens differ from William Gheen's, and from those held as core values of ALIPAC.

1. Like ALIPAC, I support LEGAL IMMIGRATION, and embrace as fellow citizens all those who are here legally. I think some of our policies on immigration are too liberal under the existing realities, and do not support an increase in the numbers of those allowed to immigrate here...I think for the near forseable future, and in light of 15-20 million illegals, that America needs to seriously consider a moratorium on immigration while we deal with the status of all those here illegally, and then while we absorb those that might be provided a pathway to citizenship.

2. I fully embrace and support the concept of building a physical barrier on our Southern Border with Mexico...I'd actually like to see a significant wall complex built that would house offices, detention cells, and barracks facilities for border troops, with a second and third line of defense in the fashion of the fence, and would like to see said barriers build along our entire border with Mexico. My views on this are NOT the views of ALIPAC, I doubt seriously that William Gheen would embarce them....THEY ARE MY VIEWS on the matter, and I have no fear of making them known.

3. I'd like to see a TEN MILLION CITIZEN MARCH on our nation's capital demanding that our laws be enforced, rather than ignored in the name of CHEAP LABOR. Again, do not believe this is a position that ALIPAC would endorse, or embrace.

4. It's my personal belief that the 14th Amendment DOES NOT grant citizenship to children of illegals, and I believe a court challenge would successfully prove this point. Therefore, from my perspective, any deportation of parents not covered by and Amnesty should include as a part of it the deportation with them of their children.

5. I think CHAIN MIGRATION in the name of family unity is wrong, and unfair...it amounts to OPEN BORDERS, and leaves America incapable of fully controlling the legal flow of immigratns into our nation.

These are my views, these are my beliefs. I agree with ALIPAC and some of it's positions, and perhaps they agree with some of mine. We both agree on one CORE BELIEF...illegal immigration is wrong, illegal immigration is a crime.




Posted By BuildingDemocracy Fan on 07/12/2006 11:05 AM

Such a lackie, Delbie.

Have you no pride in yourself? You seem to be running interferance for your boss. Tell us your role with Gheen and your alliance with ALIPAC? Or are you too afraid of the truth or paranoid?


Posted By Delbie on 07/12/2006 10:45 AM


Posted By Hulk on 07/12/2006 10:28 AM

Is it reasonable to attribute the comments posted in a debate forum to the forum host?


If MATT goes to a great deal of time and trouble to POST HOUSE RULES, do they not have a responsibility to fairly and equitably ENFORCE them on ALL SIDES, rather than enforcing them only on a subsect of the whole...in this case, enforcement only for those on the ANTI side of the discussion?

Read the house rules...they do not include exclusions for those on the Pro Illegal Alien side. There is no disclaimer for Dee that says, GEE we really like her, so we have decided the rules do not apply to her.

It appears their tactics are: outright, baldface lies; ad hominem attacks; playing the race card, trying to blur the line between legal and illegal immigrants, and trying to characterize our side as, "anti immigrant," and not anti-ILLEGAL immigrant.

Good post William, with grace, dignity and truth as always thank you.

They are deleting threads again........... I can still get to one because of the last post there........ They must be hiding them first for some reason. Maybe they are saving them for some reason.


Michael