Thread: OH DEAR GOD

I watched some of the "CAFTA show" on CNN today and it was truly sickening. These well paid (with OUR tax dollars) oral farters that are SUPPOSED to do the right thing...are SO selling us out!

Originally Posted by greyparrot

I watched some of the "CAFTA show" on CNN today and it was truly sickening. These well paid (with OUR tax dollars) oral farters that are SUPPOSED to do the right thing...are SO selling us out!

Yes they are selling us out. It is up to us to get them out of office. As responsible citizens, we need to remove those from office who are not representing us.

W. Me too, but we just know that we have been fooled with the Real ID and God only knows what other things they are trying to sneak by us.

There should be a sticky note for this Lou Dobbs transcript... Even those who are conspiracy-phobic would be moved to reflection at some of these statements :

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On Capitol Hill, testimony calling for Americans to start thinking like citizens of North America and treat the U.S., Mexico and Canada like one big country.

Because it comes from CNN, it has more credibility to many people than other media outlets.

I like Dobbs's reaction too :

DOBBS: Americans must think that our political and academic elites have gone utterly mad at a time when three-and-a-half years, approaching four years after September 11, we still don't have border security. And this group of elites is talking about not defending our borders, finally, but rather creating new ones. It's astonishing.

Just because most conspiracy theories are fanciful and without basis doesn't mean all conspiracy theories are that way... It seems ludicrous that there are elites who sit around in smoke-filled rooms, plotting various schemes which fulfill their interests and ideologies even while knowing that most people would be opposed... Yet, why not?..

What's shocking is how open they are about their plans... They must figure that we either won't have the will or the power to stop them... In the end, they may be victims of their own hubris, but on the other hand, we may be victims of our political idleness and naivete... We may not have much time... What would I give to live in boring times!!!

There's the Economic and Security perspective to "Open Borders", but also a Democracy aspect too.
http://www.infowars.com/police_state.html
There can no longer be any doubt. America is transforming into a police state. Local and state governments, megaglobal corporations and even communist dictatorships are being merged globally into a colossal world government.

This world government is hell-bent on consolidating the resources of individuals, governments, sole-proprietorships, churches, charities, political parties, and armies under its unaccountable, unelected quasi-governmental bureaucracies, like the WTO, IMF, World Bank, Central Banks, i.e. US Regional Governorship (Federal Reserve).

See these other ALIPAC topics for more information :
North American Integration
Trinational Call for a North American Economic and Security

http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.a ... E_ID=44609


Bye-bye USA?
Posted: June 6, 2005
1:00 a.m. Eastern

© 2005 WorldNetDaily.com

It's amazing what happens when the people – the little people – make their voices heard. Very often, what they say doesn't jibe with what they're supposed to believe.

It's amazing that the governing elite even allow it to happen.

Truth be known, if the elite had their druthers, it would never be permitted because they really don't want to know what the average citizen believes or wants. Nor do they care.

If the truth be known, the governing elite believe they know best for everyone. They believe they are anointed with, and should have, the power to put in place their political, economic, cultural, educational, social and, yes, even moral and religious guidelines.

It doesn't matter whether you're talking about elections in this country – consider the ongoing sour grapes about the last two presidential races – or, the vote in France and the Netherlands on the proposed E.U. constitution.

Candidates or issues are put before "the people" with the expectation that the desires of the elite will be confirmed, but when the votes are in – well, lowrdy me, surprise, surprise – what a shock it is!

I guess the indoctrination didn't work. Guess they'll have to reconfigure the sales pitch, but then again, maybe not. Then again, maybe the impact of the result will make the "little people" realize the power they really have.

Maybe they will realize it isn't safe or wise to put the entire future of your country – and indeed your continent – in the hands of a group of elites who have a vision of the future that isn't quite what the people have in mind. Maybe they will realize that if they go along to get along, they will end up living in a country, in a society that has no reflection of their own history, their own independence and their own identity.

There are 25 E.U. countries and nine had approved the constitution before the French vote. Clearly President Jacques Chirac and his supporters thought they had a sure thing. Why else would they have allowed the issue to go before the people? Talk about being blindsided and, now, not only is the E.U. concept in jeopardy, but so are political careers thought to be bulletproof.

The French people said "non" with a vote of 54 to 46 percent, which was bad enough until the Dutch had their turn. Stunningly, they nixed the proposed constitution 62 to 38 per cent.

You'll hear and read all kinds of interpretations as to why the people said no, but bottom line, it appears the core of the dissatisfaction with the currently popular view of the "new Europe" rests with the ultimate goal of ending the sovereignty of individual countries, the power that would rest with a central government, central court system, central monetary system – essentially, central everything.

Look at it this way: How would you vote if the issue on the table would change our entire system of law, finance, currency, trade, borders, language, education, culture, religion and, on top of that, eliminate our Constitution?

It's a pretty big order and not one to be approached lightly. If your reaction to such a proposal would be a loud "NO," consider that the United States is little more than 200 years old with a system that guides all the states and, despite the multicultural, open-border advocates among us, just one language.

Look at the history of Europe. Consider the varied cultures, languages and political histories of the 25 nations involved in the European Union. Are they just to throw out everything and start over? That is the mantra of the ruling elite who only look at two bottom lines: money and power.

They want to centralize power and control trade. They envision creating, with the stroke of a few pens, a "country" to compete with the United States. What they ignore is that we became the powerhouse we are because of the freedoms granted by our Constitution and by the innovation and energy of our people. Our government didn't create the economic powerhouse that is the USA – our form of government allowed citizens the freedom to succeed.

The E.U. advocates just don't get it. But the people do, and it appears they don't want to be part of a huge, European super-state, forged by politicians who essentially don't give a fig what the people want. Since to be ratified, all 25 states must approve the E.U. constitution – all 448 articles of it – they face a dilemma. As can be expected, the proponents plan to forge ahead.

From our side of the pond, I hope our politicians are paying attention – and that extends to the White House. While our media lament and moan about the E.U. vote, too little attention is being paid to the fact that we're moving closer to more free-trade agreements that would essentially do the same thing to us. There was NAFTA, the Caribbean Free Trade Initiative and now, with the support of the administration, CAFTA and ultimately, the goal of open trade and open borders from the tip of South America to the top of Canada.

My producer at work is Canadian--here legally--and I started telling him about this North American integration scheme and he looked at me like I was crazy and several hastily-provided links later, he acknowledged that politicians MIGHT actually be trying to do this, but that "Canadians will never go for it." I told him he was completely missing the point. They aren't ASKING us if it's okay, they are just doing it.

BobC,
That is why we need to work so hard to prevent it. they are not following the Will of the people nor are they Following our Constitution.

Originally Posted by Brian503a

Originally Posted by jp_48504

Are we all clear that this is not a conspiracy? I have been saying this since before the Real ID and its Tri-national Database passed and I was shunned. When I opposed the Real Id, I got a lot of hateful emails. 2010 isn’t far away. CAFTA could pass soon, and then the FTAA and our borders will be wide open, aided by the NAFTA Highway going from Canada, Michigan to Texas into Mexico and beyond. Say Goodbye to America's Sovereignty.

I'm a believer. You have to be blind to not see this coming.

You would be amazed at the amount of Americans who either dont know or dont care. All most Americans care is about is American Idol and if the Yankees beat the Mets or vice versa.

JP I'm doing all I can--I joined NumbersUSA and started faxing like a madman and I "came out" on several of my True Crime forums, telling my friends there about this issue. I have provided links to sites like this as well. I am also sending money to various sites who are helping to spread the word.

The scary thing is we might be too late. When you have all these different nationalities owning huge chunks of America, then they obviously have little or no impetus to hold this nation together.

Originally Posted by BobC

JP I'm doing all I can--I joined NumbersUSA and started faxing like a madman and I "came out" on several of my True Crime forums, telling my friends there about this issue. I have provided links to sites like this as well. I am also sending money to various sites who are helping to spread the word.

The scary thing is we might be too late. When you have all these different nationalities owning huge chunks of America, then they obviously have little or no impetus to hold this nation together.

Bobc, your work is to be commended. Don’t despair, it aint over until the fat lady sings and I will put some cake in her mouth to prevent it. We need to yell until we can’t yell any longer, march on DC if need be. We cannot let them take our country.

Originally Posted by ChrisF202

You would be amazed at the amount of Americans who either dont know or dont care. All most Americans care is about is American Idol and if the Yankees beat the Mets or vice versa.

Actually, I think this is what the elites want us to believe about our fellow Americans... They want us to believe that we're all alone in our strong objections to the leadership of this country on important issues like illegal immigration... When people believe they are all alone, they're more likely to feel powerless and not resist, which is exactly what the elites want.

Yet, in reality, statistics show Americans are very concerned about such issues... According to the Chicago Council on Foreign Relations, 59% of Americans classify reducing illegal immgration as "very important" and 33% think it's "somewhat important.".. This means 92% of Americans are against illegal immigration.

Here's a poll by the Chicago Council on Foreign Relations just before the 2004 election :
( The numbers to the left represent % of Americans who regard the issue as "very important" )
78 Protecting the jobs of American workers
73 Preventing the spread of nuclear weapons
71 Combating international terrorism
69 Securing adequate supplies of energy
63 Stopping the flow of illegal drugs into the United States
59 Controlling and reducing illegal immigration
50 Maintaining superior military power worldwide
47 Improving the global environment
43 Combating world hunger
38 Strengthening the United Nations
32 Protecting the interests of American business abroad
18 Protecting weaker nations against foreign aggression
18 Helping to improve the standard of living of less developed nations
14 Helping to bring a democratic form of government to other nations
Click on "Public [pdf] on the left side under "Topline Results" - page 26 in the PDF file

( But the Chicago Council also polls the elites, who (not surprisingly) don't share the same concerns... Only 21% believe that controlling illegal immigration is very important and only 41% think "protecting the jobs of U.S. workers" is very important. )

As I hinted above, I think that part of the reason there isn't more effort expended on worthy causes is because people feel that most Americans are not concerned enough to do anything... People feel less motivated if they feel they're one of the few who gets it - when they feel they're alone.

It's also a lack of belief in our democracy... I recall this quote from someone who's concerned about the high cost of health care.
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2003/ ... ndex2.html
But don't expect the Leunzes to pick up the cause of national healthcare, much less write a letter to their congressman -- they've dropped out. "What can you do about it?" Betty asks. "We just have to rely on more powerful men to make the right decisions."
I'm sure we've all heard people speak jokingly about "writing my congress person," as if that were an exercise in futility... And is it any surprise that people feel that way, given that most of our politicians are like inert rocks, when it comes to the interests of regular folks, while they bend over backwards to please corporate interests?

There are many people who will not do anything unless they believe there's something they can do that has a good chance of working... Because it's not always clear what that is, instead they often seek diversions like TV and sports, which allow for a temporary escape from their concerns, which seem intractable.

Many have no idea what to do and think they're one of the few who "gets it." (sigh, the Mindless Masses).. Also, the media propaganda has convinced people that "globalization" is this unstoppable force... So, this is why most people do nothing.

Most Americans are already strongly opposed to illegal immigration... The challenge is to make them believe there's something they can do and to describe what that might be... What's lacking is not awareness or concern, but belief that there are things that can be done... At least, that's what I think.

Organizations like ALIPAC, Number's USA, and FAIR help a lot, because it makes people feel they're part of a group effort in which they can actually participate... Perhaps, just intoducing more people to such organizations will make the difference.

By the way, I'm a Number's USA mad-faxer and mad-phoner too... But I need to do more to get others involved... I wonder how many people would really be required... Maybe if just 1% of the population really did their best, then that would turn the tide?