Thread: At Risk...

justfred knows whereof he speaks.... he is a troll.... knows most of the arguments but considers the subversion of basic laws as less important than anything else. If the US turns into another third-world, Latino country, then the "American Experiment" will have been lost by those of us who permitted "foreign" interests (i.e. unAmerican) to use our Constitution as a SUICIDE PACT for the descendents of our Founding Fathers. The weapons of choice?: the very principles of tolerance and diversity turned on the descendents of the authors of those who crafted these principles; "diversity" is used to justify illegal entry, then diversity is applied only for the benefit of Latinos/Mexicans. Defacto Discrimination in Favor of Latinos.... to hell with all other "immigrants"...

You don't believe it? The Chicago branch of AZTLAN just published in HOY (Chicago Trib's Spanish rag) its demands: a halt to enforcement of any immigration laws, including "deportations", but also a 150% INCREASE in visas for "people of the Western Hemisphere".... code for "Latinos", right?... did I mention Defacto Discrimination in Favor of Latinos?, did I say "Affirmative Action" for Latinos?

For Bush, "commerce trumps law, especially immigration law"
For the Church, "God's law trumps all laws" despite its own biblical admonishment to "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's"... but then, religion recognizes no national borders nor laws, but societies do! at least societies that wish to survive longer than 200 years...

For American citizens, who live by the Rule of Law, to allow this government to circumvent & ignore the RULE OF LAW, is a travesty.

There is no grey area here.

It begins and ends with a Congress that blatantly does not demand that existing Law is enforced.

Originally Posted by ALIPAC

justfred,

Yes, illegal immigration has been going on for some time, but from what we can tell from the numbers it really escalated in the late 90's and under the Bush administration may have reached levels as high as 1.5-3 million entering illegal per year!

So what was once a chronic trickle, has turned into a flood having a dramatic impact on states from NC to Main.

Also, the reason this is the #1 issue can be explained two ways. One, as you have already stated, illegal immigration has deadly consequences and has a highly negative impact on our national quality of life in hundreds of ways.

Two, since we cannot get the Executive Branch to adequately enforce our existing laws which are supported by over 80% of the American public, this means that we are no longer the land of the free and a functioning republic where our citizens are self governed.

We are now becoming a nation of servants that have been deprived of representation and a voice in what happens to us, our communities, or nation.

We are being treated like cattle that are told we must make room for more cattle by the farmers!

This is the end of America if we do not restore the Rule of Law and reverse the flow. There is no end to the flow of illegal aliens from 3rd world poverty environments. They will come and come until most of what we love about America is destroyed and children are stolen in broad daylight by gangs into sexual slavery and you and I will face a death sentence if we pick up the phone to call the law.

The degradations the American public are being forced to endure now are just the beginning compared to what the corporations responsible for this treason may have in mind for us next!

The illegal aliens are a human army here to force Americans into many things we would never accept voluntarily such as a North American Economic Union, national biometric big brother ID, and lower real wages.

Illegal immigration is a weapon of mass destruction killing 12-25 Americans per day and the deaths are just the tip of the human suffering iceberg when you think of the thousands of others that become victims in other ways from this each day!

Illegal immigration is part of the terrible deficits you are concerned about and part of the Orwellian electronic police state of observation we are being forced into.

W

W....thanks so much for taking the time to respond to me, and my apologies for not having the personal bandwidth to read it and respond until now.

We are being treated like cattle that are told we must make room for more cattle by the farmers!

I can see your point, here - but this is being done as much through legal immigration as illegal immigration. Being here in the silicon forest near Portland, OR, I see a lot of engineers out of work while companies like Intel are importing engineers from India and Pakistan, which they can get for less expense. Are you advocating limiting legal, as well as illegal immigration?

Making more room for other cattle is a good analogy, but in a related topic (since I am going on about high-tech jobs) what is your opinion on the exportation of jobs and the lowering and elimination of tarriffs to keep US jobs in the country?

...and you and I will face a death sentence if we pick up the phone to call the law.

I am confused about this quote. Do you mean to say that we will be actually killed by the US legal system, or those on whom we are calling?

The degradations the American public are being forced to endure now are just the beginning compared to what the corporations responsible for this treason may have in mind for us next!

Here you are preaching to the choir, sir. I disagree with decisions determining that corporations should have rights of the individual - including the right to lie to the public. Until corporations start breathing, eating, drinking and raising families, they should never be considered as civilians.<off soapbox>

Illegal immigration is a weapon of mass destruction killing 12-25 Americans per day and the deaths are just the tip of the human suffering iceberg when you think of the thousands of others that become victims in other ways from this each day!

I am skeptical about this being a terrible concern. According to your numbers there are tens of millions of illegal aliens in this country in a population of 300 million Americans. People die from automobile accidents and face it - some people kill other people. I don't like the idea of the illegals smuggling drugs with them or their gang affiliations. I do agree that we need to do a better job of enforcing our laws.

A friend of mine came up with an idea that I think might work. One of the problems we face is punishing those who break the laws of the US. If we incarcerate them it costs a lot of money. If we merely deport them, we know that they will be back in a few days.

Since we outsource the running of many of our prisons, why not build and run one in Mexico? The cost of incarceration will be less due to less labor costs and we can get them out of the country at the same time (besides, if we ran it like a Mexican prison, it would be a certain detriment to them breaking our laws in the future.

Originally Posted by loservillelabor

Logically why should they? I agree. However, they share a home with me that I was hoping to pass along in some recognizable form to the Grandchildren as my own Grandparents did for me. Quality of life is a consideration. The economy should serve the people, we don't exist for the most efficient economic model imho. Those who want to run a world hive are going to meet with an adversary in me. I'll do whatever I must.

I agree with you, whole heartedly. You will find no argument, here.

Originally Posted by AmericanElizabeth

Justfred, it is not merely a war on the middle class, it is a slaughter of America's working poor.

I see daily, two parents households struggling to feed their kids, and make the rent. I know of one family personally, who not only is struggling in this way, but both parents have major life-threatening medical issues, which require frequent medical attention and daily medication. Many times feeding the kids is nothing more than rice and a package of gravy mix.

All too many people talk about the effects this invasion has had on the middle class, but it hit the working poor long ago, but they were all silent, only because they were too busy trying to survive, they did not have the luxury of free time, or the resources to speak out.

Hi, Elizabeth...thanks for the response.

I agree with you, also. We must help the working poor as well as the middle class. I understand that there are some who ride the welfare gravy train, but I also know that most Americans don't realize how close many families live to being homeless and starving - and these people work hard, like you say, sometimes two or three jobs.

I do agree that we need to enforce our border laws, but there are other ways we can ensure working wages for those who are willing to work, including through such things as tax policy.

but there are other ways we can ensure working wages for those who are willing to work, including through such things as tax policy

Yes, the old TAX POLICY.

I'd be very interested, fred, in hearing about your TAX POLICY suggestions.

Originally Posted by mkfarnam

justfred, Welcome to ALIPAC

Have you ever seen any of the protests, marches or demostrations that Illegals have put on? If not, you should see some of the videos posted in this site. You will see what they are really in this country for.

(who wants to post a link for "justfred" to see?)

From what you`ve said, you must not live in or near an area with a high popultion of Illegals. Or your income is high enough to where you do not feel the effect from illegal immigration.
I live in Southern California where the affect cannot be ignored by anyone. The Eastern and Western coastal states along with the Southern Border states are the most affected. but they are moving inward quit rapidly.
The small rural community that I live in, was once known for its Dairy farms and Orange/citrus groves. Illegals have moved into barns and garages and converted them into unsanitary living spaces for over 6 famlies to a small building. Most farmers moved out of the area (or state) and rented out their property. So most of them are not aware of illegals moving onto their property.
Illegals wont pay for trash, they just dump it in the streets or on vacant property.
Illegals and even some legal immigrants that rent houses in fairly large property, allow illegals to move old stripped out house trailors and campers onto the property to live in, with no sanitary hook up.
Now I could go on and on and on. But instead I`ll just say that, this is not just happening in my community, It`s everywhere, and I mean everywhere.
You cannot drive 1 mile without see at least 1 property that is run down as I mentions.
It`s disgusting. But worse, there are laws against everything I mentioned, but the law does nothing about it.

Thanks mkfarnham...

Here in Oregon we have a large population of illegals, as well. However, I have seen little or nothing of the squatting mentality of which you speak. I have seen, however, many unscruplous landlords who will charge exhorbant rents (for the property in question) for turning a blind eye to how many people reside at that property rather than enforce their own rules.

As far as the other conditions you mention, I have really not noticed a lot of difference between the illegals and many Americans in the same economic class.

2ndamendsis wrote:

For American citizens, who live by the Rule of Law, to allow this government to circumvent & ignore the RULE OF LAW, is a travesty.

There is no grey area here.

Well said and very true

To all those to whom I have not responded...thank you for your greetings and words - and I was pleasantly surprised that only one of you have gone the name calling route. I will read dillon's post (I got the the 'troll' part and passed for more meaningful dialogs) but will not respond.

To 2ndamendsis, I will be happy to go into greater detail on my tax plan at a later time/date, but need to get ready for work, now. It is actually a rather simple twist to the current tax structure which would give tax breaks to all business and individuals earning less than $192,000/year while encouraging long term investment, rewarding sweat equity and penalizing those who receive obscene compensation (yes, I have taken the liberty of creating my own definition of 'obscene compensation).

To CCUSA, thank you for your greetings, and let me have time to chack out the links to which you directed me. You took your time to share information with me, the least I can do is to honor it with more than a glance.

mdillon1172 wrote:

justfred knows whereof he speaks.... he is a troll.... knows most of the arguments but considers the subversion of basic laws as less important than anything else. If the US turns into another third-world, Latino country, then the "American Experiment" will have been lost by those of us who permitted "foreign" interests (i.e. unAmerican) to use our Constitution as a SUICIDE PACT for the descendents of our Founding Fathers. The weapons of choice?: the very principles of tolerance and diversity turned on the descendents of the authors of those who crafted these principles; "diversity" is used to justify illegal entry, then diversity is applied only for the benefit of Latinos/Mexicans. Defacto Discrimination in Favor of Latinos.... to hell with all other "immigrants"...

You don't believe it? The Chicago branch of AZTLAN just published in HOY (Chicago Trib's Spanish rag) its demands: a halt to enforcement of any immigration laws, including "deportations", but also a 150% INCREASE in visas for "people of the Western Hemisphere".... code for "Latinos", right?... did I mention Defacto Discrimination in Favor of Latinos?, did I say "Affirmative Action" for Latinos?

For Bush, "commerce trumps law, especially immigration law"
For the Church, "God's law trumps all laws" despite its own biblical admonishment to "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's"... but then, religion recognizes no national borders nor laws, but societies do! at least societies that wish to survive longer than 200 years...

Thank you, mdillon, for a very well written piece that I happen to agree with.

2ndamendsis wrote:

For American citizens, who live by the Rule of Law, to allow this government to circumvent & ignore the RULE OF LAW, is a travesty.

The "rule of law" issue is probably the number one reason I'm here. Thank you for reminding me of what brought me to ALIPAC, 2ndamendsis.