Results 1 to 6 of 6
Like Tree6Likes
  • 2 Post By Judy
  • 2 Post By Beezer
  • 2 Post By nntrixie

Thread: Trump Saved Jobs at Carrier, but More Midwest Jobs Are in Jeopardy

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

  1. #1
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    55,660

    Trump Saved Jobs at Carrier, but More Midwest Jobs Are in Jeopardy

    Trump Saved Jobs at Carrier, but More Midwest Jobs Are in Jeopardy

    By NELSON D. SCHWARTZNOV. 30, 2016

    In tiny Sellersburg, Ind., just across the border from Kentucky, Manitowoc Foodservice is in the final stages of closing a factory that makes beverage dispensers and ice machines and is laying off 84 workers.

    The company is moving production to Mexico.

    Just 100 miles away, President-elect Donald J. Trump will appear on Thursday with workers at Carrier’s Indianapolis plant to boast of his success in saving at least 1,000 jobs from moving to Mexico.

    The truth across the Rust Belt is that there are more Manitowoc Foodservices than Carriers. The layoffs and closing in Sellersburg follow similar shutdowns by Manitowoc in Ohio and Wisconsin.

    “I’ll give Trump his due, but I hope he and the American people and Congress don’t forget about all these other jobs going to Mexico,” said Chuck Jones, the president of Local 1999 of the United Steelworkers in Indianapolis, which represents Carrier. “Down the pike, a lot more are going to be moving out.”
    Indeed, Rexnord, the ball bearing factory in Indianapolis where Mr. Jones went to work straight out of high school nearly 40 years ago, said in October it would be moving to Mexico. It is just a mile from the Carrier plant.

    The mayor of Indianapolis, Joe Hogsett, and Senator Joe Donnelly, both Democrats, tried to exert Trumplike pressure to force Rexnord to rethink its plans, but so far the company has not shown any sign it will change course.

    “On a personal level at Carrier, it is huge,” said Jerry N. Conover, director of the Indiana Business Research Center at the Kelley School of Business at Indiana University. “But by itself, the disappearance or retention of 1,000 jobs is a small slice of the total economy in Indiana.”

    “I think there will be continued downward pressure on employment in factories because of trends toward automation especially and moving to lower-cost areas for production,” he added.

    Carrier, in its official statement on the deal on Wednesday, said that it thought the agreement it negotiated with Mr. Trump and Vice President-elect Mike Pence “benefits our workers, the state of Indiana and our company.” But it said that incentives provided by Indiana, where Mr. Pence is governor, “were an important consideration.” It added that “the forces of globalization will continue to require solutions for the long-term competitiveness of the U.S. and American workers.”

    Those 1,000 Carrier jobs saved represent just 0.2 percent of total manufacturing employment in the state. And despite a rebound since the aftermath of the Great Recession, at just over half a million positions, factory employment in Indiana this year is still down by more than 20 percent since 2000.

    The good news is that Indiana has been doing well economically, with an unemployment rate below the national average and steady gains in employment like food service, retail and logistics.

    But those service jobs pay well below the $20 to $25 an hour that veteran Carrier employees — with only a high school diploma — can earn building furnaces and fan coils in Indianapolis. The typical manufacturing worker in the state earns $59,000 a year, about $20,000 a year more than the typical service job.

    And for less credentialed workers, that margin is the difference between having a shot at a middle-class life, including owning a home and sending children to college, and having to struggle to make ends meet.

    “These are truly irreplaceable jobs,” said Scott Paul, president of the Alliance for American Manufacturing, an advocacy group, and a native of Rensselaer, Ind. “A manufacturing job is one of the only ladders to fulfilling the American dream for a worker without a college degree.”

    “A manufacturing worker who loses their job at Carrier will be resigned to facing a lower standard of living and leaner retirement years,” Mr. Paul added. “Carrier is special because it happened at the right time and the right place and it gained a high profile. But obviously, Donald Trump and Mike Pence can’t intervene every time a plant closes.”

    The economic fortunes for this group have been shrinking for years, which is a major reason the story of Mr. Trump and Carrier has resonated so deeply.

    In Indiana, in particular, as in other so-called Rust Belt states, there are a lot of people who are less educated: Just 16.5 percent of the state’s residents ages 25 to 64 have a bachelor’s degree, half the rate for the country over all. And while about 30 percent have an associate degree or some college, the bulk of Indiana residents, 44 percent, have only a high school diploma — or less.

    Nor has manufacturing remained the sole domain of whites. It provides a crucial source of higher-paying jobs for minorities.

    In the popular imagination, the Indianapolis factory where 1,400 Carrier workers build furnaces and fan coils looks like a scene out of “The Deer Hunter” or “Norma Rae.” Blue-collar guys walking through the plant gate, lunch pail in hand, or white women barely getting by after years on the line.

    But the reality at the Carrier plant that Mr. Trump will visit on Thursday is very different. About half the workers are African-American, making it a much more diverse workplace than many white-collar settings.

    Women account for a substantial portion of the work force as well, but the wages are anything but subsistence: over $20 an hour plus benefits for workers with just a high school diploma. That is an almost unheard-of level of pay for Indiana workers with that level of education in other sectors like food service and retail or even many health care jobs.

    Carol Bigbee, 59, who has worked at Carrier for over 13 years, earns $22 an hour. Her daughter has a bachelor’s degree and works in a medical lab, but earns one-third less.

    “You have to be really blessed to find a job that pays that kind of money,” she said.

    In southern Indiana, where the Manitowoc Foodservice factory will close next year, good-paying blue-collar jobs are just as rare.

    But Rich Sheffer, vice president for investor relations and treasurer at the company, said it had little choice but to relocate to Mexico.

    “This company has 20 percent excess manufacturing capacity,” he said. A few of the jobs are being transferred to Covington, Tenn., he said, but the Sellersburg plant “would have required a massive investment in automation. And we have to deal with profit margins that are trailing the industry.”

    Mr. Sheffer said his company’s situation was different from that of Carrier, which has profitable operations in Indiana but could make more money in Mexico.

    “Our motivation is completely different, but,” he added, “we haven’t been contacted by anybody in the Trump administration.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/30/bu...-jeopardy.html
    A Nation Without Borders Is Not A Nation - Ronald Reagan
    Save America, Deport Congress! - Judy

    Support our FIGHT AGAINST illegal immigration & Amnesty by joining our E-mail Alerts at https://eepurl.com/cktGTn

  2. #2
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    55,660
    This is the conversation of truth over fiction that Donald Trump has been waging since 1980. It took 36 years, $100 million of his own money, 30 states and US Presidential Victory to bring that conversation to the national stage. It's time everyone knows that free trade is treason, nothing less. Protectionism is not "isolationism", it's smart business. Manufacturing is not some hard dirty business that Americans are too good to work in, it's the foundation and single most important business sector of our economy because all income generates from production, "making things". If you aren't making things, you aren't producing, if you aren't producing, you're borrowing and going down.

    Globalisation isn't business, it's socialism to support oligarchs and councils and tribunals. It's a modern day feudalism world wide. In other words, it's evil like slavery. So when United Technologies states they want to make it clear that they still adhere to free trade policies, listen to them, because then you will know that they are socialist oligarchs feeding off the misery of poor people in other countries at the expense of American citizens. Listen to them, because they are a major US defense contractor. Listen to them so you will know who our defense budget is feeding ... socialist oligarchs willing to sell out and bankrupt the very nation that sustains them. UT needs new management. We need a defense contractor "Vetting System". We need to know who is with US and who is against US, and no company run by people who "adhere" to a free trade policy that has bankrupted our country need apply to bid on US taxpayer funded defense contracts.

    Trump need to call Rexnord and Manitowoc Foodservice. Call them both, set up meetings, work it out, save them all. And tell UT if they move that other plant to Mexico, they'll pay a tariff and won't be viewed positively for defense contracts, attitude towards the United States is now part of the bid selection program because we don't want traitors supplying our military with goods and services, because that would be working at cross-purposes with our national security and national interest.
    Last edited by Judy; 12-01-2016 at 09:16 AM.
    A Nation Without Borders Is Not A Nation - Ronald Reagan
    Save America, Deport Congress! - Judy

    Support our FIGHT AGAINST illegal immigration & Amnesty by joining our E-mail Alerts at https://eepurl.com/cktGTn

  3. #3
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    55,660
    In fact, UT and Carrier need to use this press conference today in Indianapolis to apologize to the American People for wanting to abandon the American Workers whose efforts over decades have built this mammoth company by moving production our country needs to sustain itself to some foreign pastures filled with cheap virtual slave labor while expecting US to buy the finished products. They need to instead encourage Congress to pass Trump's new tax plan that will encourage retention of our industries as well as expansion and new investment in manufacturing so we can rebuild our depleted industrial base.

    And for those who don't know, in the United States, every time you lose a manufacturing job, you lose 5 other jobs in the US economy. So it wasn't just the 1,400 Carrier employees jobs that would have been lost, it was 7,000 other jobs as well for a total of 8,400 jobs lost in the United States.

    In 2000, we had 20 million manufacturing jobs. Today we have 12,000,000. That's 8 million manufacturing jobs we've lost since 2000. Multiply that number by 6, and that's how many total jobs free trade treason had cost the United States. Yes, that's right 48 million total jobs gone. The national average wage index for Social Security is $48,000 a year. Can you do the math? It's a big number, yes, that's right, more than $2.3 Trillion a year in lost payrolls and wage earnings. Like Trump said, "it's the greatest jobs theft in the history of the world".

    So you tell these idiotic sociopathic Libertarian "free traders", "free trade" isn't free when it cost your workers over $36.8 Trillion in lost wages in just 16 years. And that's just lost wages due to lost manufacturing jobs. Now add in the jobs and wages lost to illegal aliens and excess immigrants and you'll understand why we have 94 million Americans out of the work force and owe $20 trillion in national debt.
    Beezer and nntrixie like this.
    A Nation Without Borders Is Not A Nation - Ronald Reagan
    Save America, Deport Congress! - Judy

    Support our FIGHT AGAINST illegal immigration & Amnesty by joining our E-mail Alerts at https://eepurl.com/cktGTn

  4. #4
    Senior Member Beezer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    16,612
    1,000s employees out of work affect the WHOLE community. Restaurants, clothing stores, Doctor's, movies, all the services available for the public to spend their money. Not too mention they will lose their homes, people moving out of these neighborhoods just turns them into ghettos. Less property tax back into the community for City services!

    And every employer hiring ILLEGAL aliens in this country...fire them today! Shame on you! Start replacing them with Legal US Citizens.
    Judy and nntrixie like this.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Judy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    55,660
    Yes, jobs are created with suppliers, vendors, maintenance companies, technicians, services, utilities, materials, logistics, trucking, equipment companies, hydraulic companies, plumbers, electricians, roofers, all the jobs with companies who service and supply the manufacturing operation, then there's the community businesses, banks, insurance, telephone, cable, stores, car dealers, restaurants, hotels, hospital, medical professionals, etc., etc., etc. Jobs created in all of these other businesses who are fed revenue by the manufacturing operation and its giant payrolls.

    It's called the "multiplier effect" of manufacturing jobs and it's 6 to 1 ratio. Used to be 4 to 1 but today it's actually higher, and states use the 6 to 1 now.
    A Nation Without Borders Is Not A Nation - Ronald Reagan
    Save America, Deport Congress! - Judy

    Support our FIGHT AGAINST illegal immigration & Amnesty by joining our E-mail Alerts at https://eepurl.com/cktGTn

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    7,377
    Quote Originally Posted by Judy View Post
    Yes, jobs are created with suppliers, vendors, maintenance companies, technicians, services, utilities, materials, logistics, trucking, equipment companies, hydraulic companies, plumbers, electricians, roofers, all the jobs with companies who service and supply the manufacturing operation, then there's the community businesses, banks, insurance, telephone, cable, stores, car dealers, restaurants, hotels, hospital, medical professionals, etc., etc., etc. Jobs created in all of these other businesses who are fed revenue by the manufacturing operation and its giant payrolls.

    It's called the "multiplier effect" of manufacturing jobs and it's 6 to 1 ratio. Used to be 4 to 1 but today it's actually higher, and states use the 6 to 1 now.
    That is so true.

    I lived in an area that had a steel plant here in Texas. In the 70's and 80's, they began importing Japanese steel and it made such an impact on very large area of that part of the state.

    Yes, the grocery stores, banks, etc. Also, there was support industry - trucking, truck maintenance, etc. This was just devastating to that area.

    Sort of off topic, but before the area could quit reeling over that loss, they began bringing in hundreds of illegals, to take the jobs in the poultry industry.

    In the little town we live in now, there was a sewing factory - employed 100 people. It went to Mexico. Now 100 jobs doesn't seem like much, but the town had less than 3,000 population at the time. That's not just 100 jobs - it's 100 families.

    I was talking to one lady and asked if she was offered job training for other employment. She said yes she was, but 'where are the jobs'?
    Newmexican and Judy like this.

Similar Threads

  1. Trump to Announce Carrier Plant Will Keep Jobs in U.S.
    By Judy in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 11-30-2016, 02:02 PM
  2. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-25-2016, 11:12 PM
  3. In Midwest, mining unearths jobs as well as metals
    By JohnDoe2 in forum Other Topics News and Issues
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-02-2011, 10:14 PM
  4. Special report: Are jobs in jeopardy for the Hispanic commun
    By Ratbstard in forum illegal immigration News Stories & Reports
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-15-2011, 07:33 PM
  5. 5,400 L.A. teacher jobs in jeopardy
    By JohnDoe2 in forum Other Topics News and Issues
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 04-15-2009, 01:23 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •